Gua Kellogg – A Pioneering Tale of Human-Chimpanzee Interaction in Psychology


Episode Transcription

Made by robots for robots. Only read if you’re werid.

Jaron Myers 0:00 Hey man, what's the rub? Dude? Tim Stone 0:04 You for that? I don't know. I still don't know why I said that. I don't either. I've been saying it a lot lately. So here's the rub. Have you ever heard of Louella and with rope Kellogg? Jaron Myers 0:18 What are we doing his brothers? Tim Stone 0:19 They're actually on Kellogg not related at all. Okay, which I really wish they were and honestly, when you hear this story, you checks out. Jaron Myers 0:28 Leaders. How do they nail that dude? No way. Are you lying? I guess in a sense, somewhat, Hey, call on it's like, because when he goes, it's not a call. That's different than when he goes Yes. As you're 100% you're so close. Because that's when he goes. Tim Stone 0:52 Yeah, it's not a call it it's a podcast. Jaron Myers 0:57 That's our merch. Tim Stone 1:02 Yeah, sorry. Can you put Google on the phone for a second? Jaron Myers 1:23 Things I Learned last night? Tim Stone 1:33 No, okay. So Jaron Myers 1:33 these, this was a couple Tim Stone 1:35 Louella and with rope, Kellogg, they were married. They met in college, and they were science. Jaron Myers 1:45 Science School. Okay, what they do at Science School. So they've. Tim Stone 1:54 And Winthrop was really interested in the nature versus nurture discussion. And so during his master's, he kind of put together his whole master's thesis on how you would test whether it was nature or nurture. 19 The 1920s Jaron Myers 2:11 You got to separate twins. Well, Tim Stone 2:14 close. He said, You got to start a cult. That's not what he said. But he put together this whole thesis of how he would do it. And what he wanted to do was he said, if we could raise a child, and monitor that child from infancy, and see how they grow up, and then raise another child, from infancy and see how that child grows up and monitor that child from infancy. But the twist is that second child is a chimpanzee. Jaron Myers 2:46 All right, I mean, the results will work out, huh, he said we'll see is that we say if it really is nurture over nature, we should be able to raise that chimpanzee to be a pretty human, a chimpanzee. That's what year was this? is late, like the late 1920s. Gosh, I wish I was I wish I lived back then. Because it's so much easier to get into science school. They let that guy in. They were like, That's a good thought. It's Tim Stone 3:12 such a good idea. So he puts together this thesis. He doesn't get to actually do the experiment, though, is just a theoretical thing. Okay. And they were like, Yeah, sure. This passes, whatever. Okay, yeah, you get a degree for this. All right. Jaron Myers 3:30 Can you get a job science boy, Tim Stone 3:33 happy science school, I Jaron Myers 3:34 guess. Happy Science School. Tim Stone 3:37 He went on to be Bill Nye. Now he so him and his wife got married. And then they moved to any one of their names Thelma and Louise Louella. And Winthrop, Walla Walla, and went went thrown through. And then they had a child, they named him Donald. And then they Jaron Myers 3:57 had another child. And he's like, here's my chance. Tim Stone 4:03 So then, when their child was about seven months old, they said, Hey, we could we could do the experiment. And so they go to Florida. And they find a zoo. And they ask if they could take home one of the chimps is Jaron Myers 4:18 a Travis story. Kind of, they raise a monkey Tim Stone 4:22 kinda kinda. It's not quite a Travis story, because this is, yeah, it's not Jaron Myers 4:26 quite the Travis story, because in this story, that kid ripped off a neighbor's face. That is crazy. That is nurture. They nurture that into them. So Tim Stone 4:37 they go to the zoo. Yeah. And lo and behold, the zoo in Florida has a 10 month old chimpanzee so right? And Jaron Myers 4:43 they're like, Can I have it and the zoo was like, ah, we don't like it. Tim Stone 4:47 She was like, why? And they were like, don't worry. We went to science school. And they said, Okay. Jaron Myers 4:54 Okay. So they took this chimpanzee Tim Stone 4:56 home with them, and they put together a plan For a big experiment, and I don't understand exactly what happened here, there's not a lot I was trying to figure this out. Not a lot of documentation on this part of the story. Yeah. I difficult Jaron Myers 5:11 poor to understand. That's hard board. Tim Stone 5:15 I don't know, if they were backed by any institution or an investor who funded this project. I think they just quit their jobs. And we're like, Let's study this for a while. I can't tell but it's 1930. They got this chimp and moved back to Indiana. And they every day would wake up in the morning. And they would arrays Donald and the chimp who's the chimps name was gua. Which sounds like they let the chimp name the chimp. Yeah, the mom chimp. Jaron Myers 5:46 Where do you want your name to be? Goo? Gah. Gua gua. Tim Stone 5:50 Okay, nice. I like that. Jaron Myers 5:53 Imagine growing up with a chimpanzee sibling. And like, it's probably one of the situations in Indiana where they just gotta like, the neighbors meet this family. Because like they're trying to nurture it, right? They're trying to raise it as a normal kid. Yeah. And the neighbors are like, and they're like, how many kids you guys have? Like, oh, we have two beautiful children, Donald and gua. And they're like, Oh, cool. Tim Stone 6:15 That's okay. Yeah, she's adopted. Yeah, we got her in Florida a couple years ago. Jaron Myers 6:19 That's awesome. That's you from Florida. So International, Florida. That's crazy. Yeah. And Tim Stone 6:25 she's not like the other kids. Yeah, she's a little different. Oh, Jaron Myers 6:30 what years is like the 30s? Okay, and then they meet this family that has Yeah, they Tim Stone 6:41 invite them over for dinner. The whole family? Yeah, bring the kids. They sit down at the table. All the kids are playing and they don't want Jaron Myers 6:51 flies into the living room. hits the wall super hard. Like sorry, girl likes to play rough. Yeah, no, Tim Stone 7:00 man. Good shot. Yeah, yeah, she punches like 220. Pretty quick. Jaron Myers 7:03 Ever play for the football team? Oh, this she asked for? She hasn't told us. We keep asking. She's not sure either. Oh. Tim Stone 7:19 Okay, so the reason they decided to raise Donald and gua like their siblings, okay. Donald is obviously a little boy who was a little girl chimpanzee. Jaron Myers 7:29 And they creators and stuff. She complains and she's older. She's like, none of the Barbies looked like me. All right, career, unrealistic expectations. Tim Stone 7:41 And so she, they raised them together. And every day they had like a regimented schedule. they'd eat breakfast with them together. And then they would go to experiment time. They would do a handful of experiments with the two of them, and then they would eat lunch, and then they would do some more experiments and they would eat dinner. They would take a bath, and then it was bedtime. That was pretty much their life for like a year. While they did all Jaron Myers 8:02 this. I mean, yeah, they're gonna be they're gonna be affording to pay for stuff. Tim Stone 8:05 Yeah, I'm not exactly sure how this that part of the story work because they had a very regimented schedule. It wasn't like they had a day job, but they were going to and coming back and testing this stuff at night. Like it was. Jaron Myers 8:18 Yeah, kids say late at night, I get home and run some tests on my kids. Tim Stone 8:24 Excuse me? Yeah. Oh, already. One of them's a champ. Jaron Myers 8:26 It's the 1930s. So I'm not going to ask any questions. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not really I don't care. I got other stuff to worry about, like I'm depressed. Tim Stone 8:37 I literally just lost all my money. So I couldn't care less about what you do with your chip. So they every day are doing these tests. And it's interesting, like a lot of them are kind of the behavioral tests like you would expect, where they're asking questions or trying to get certain behaviors out of them like trying to potty train like, human potty train the chimp, which actually works out pretty well for them. After about a year, the chimp. After about a year, the chimp learns a handful of human II things. Okay, so the champ will learn how to communicate that it needs to go to the bathroom by kind of a Jaron Myers 9:18 lifespan of a chimpanzee though. Tim Stone 9:19 I'm not sure let's see. But like, you know, have you played the Sims? Jaron Myers 9:25 Yes. Your bear is doing with that aren't you? Know you're gonna say so Tim Stone 9:32 females in captivity live to be 39 and men live to be 32 I'll say Jaron Myers 9:40 men. Males. Yeah, men is man. So So 39 I mean, like their lifespan is half so I mean, are they developing twice as fast as one? Yes. Okay. So one year for them is two years for Tim Stone 9:58 Yeah. So they started noticing Yeah, it was picking up certain things quicker than Donald was. It could walk. Jaron Myers 10:03 Yeah, it could walk. It could say it's ABC. Tim Stone 10:08 It could walk it could eat with a spoon that was eaten with silverware. Jaron Myers 10:11 I guess we can call it we can cut we can say she was eating Tim Stone 10:14 with silverware. So this is them training. Jaron Myers 10:16 That's a real that's a real monkey. Tim Stone 10:18 This is this is the two of them actually is children. Donald and the chimpanzees gorillas, okay. Jaron Myers 10:31 Donald looks like he knows. He's like, he's like, Donald looks like my sister's not easy. We can cut the crap, right? But I know that this is an abnormal situation. Okay, what's the next picture? They're both where their diapers and they're both when their diapers. Tim Stone 10:45 Little younger their Donald's feet are very dirty. Jaron Myers 10:49 He's got shoes on. He's wearing shoes. Sure. Yeah. Well, either way. He's got someone. Yeah. He's also wearing shoes. No. Tim Stone 10:59 Playing with a phone. You're masking painted fingernails. Jaron Myers 11:05 I don't think this is such a high quality photo. Also. No, it's the 30s That's not the phone they were using. Get this out of here when you put this in here for it's funny. Tim Stone 11:18 But yeah, so they're raising them. And yes, the chimp is developing a little bit faster than Donald is okay. He's able to eat with silverware. She she's able to eat with somewhere she is able to say like, communicate that she has to go the restroom Jaron Myers 11:30 is gender my champion. She, she will Tim Stone 11:33 like The Sims. And so like, you know, when the students have to go to the bathroom, and they like throw up their arms, like, ah, you know what I'm talking about? Like, if you take the door away from the bathroom. You don't? Yeah, that's what the chip does. And shows. She'll like start screaming. And like, then they're like, oh, it's it's bathroom time. And so then they'll take her to the bathroom. And she knows how to use the bathroom. And it's a young few month old chip. Okay, and so they train the chimp to use the restroom. They also were able to train the chimp to understand a lot of language, not speak a lot of language. Yeah, understand a lot of language and they learned they were able to identify that because at first it was just kind of tones like dogs like Yeah, right? Yeah, they understand. Oh, hey, that's uh, you're mad at me for something. But gua was able to learn the actual words. Because they would say amen. Monotones and she was able to respond in an appropriate response. bathroom. Jaron Myers 12:31 Bathroom. She would just pee on through through Yeah, it's through the Tim Stone 13:10 Hey, thanks for checking out this episode. If you liked this one, we got a lot of great past episodes that you can check out. One of my recent favorites is Frank Abagnale, Jr. It's the dude from the movie cast me if you can. And it's the story about how he scammed everybody into really big scam. There's one scam that's like the scariest of scams I've ever heard someone's scam. So check that one out. It's a fun one. I like it a lot. But thanks for being here. But they would say things like, they would identify body parts. Like they'd say nose and she would touch her nose. And they would say she would touch your ears. And so like she understood. I think they said that she understood 90 words, she could understand 90 words and correctly respond to those those actions that would be appropriate when? Okay, that's words. Jaron Myers 14:03 I mean, they get really when you think about it, we're all just trained to respond to words. Tim Stone 14:07 I mean, yeah, it's kind of the same thing. You know, we know if you think about it, all the stuff that we're saying right now is made up. If Jaron Myers 14:15 you think about everything that comes over my friend that was just completely conglomerate of things we've been taught. It's just a bunch of sound graded into our brains. Tim Stone 14:24 If we want if we decided to, if we decided decided, if we decided these words meant something different, they would they would just mean a memory. That was a professor at college used to say that. Okay, like he would be he'd Jaron Myers 14:35 be like, Oh, my middle school band teacher said that. So I mean, like that same intellect. No, it was. Tim Stone 14:39 Who was it? Honestly, Smedley? He would say he'd say, yeah, like words are just, they're just made up. He's like, so there's nothing as because people would be like, that's not a real word. He's like, yes, it is. And Jaron Myers 14:53 what you're saying is, he would say something incorrectly, someone would go that's not how you say that word. He goes, Yeah, it is. Me You know, he's like he's like, tell me what Toyota quickly is. Tim Stone 15:03 Well, his point, his point was his point was a word. It's just a set of sounds that that's what I'm saying. And he's like, he's like, Do you know what I mean? Now you Jaron Myers 15:10 go, Oh, that's a chair. But if we decide that that's now, you know, falafels we go, oh, that's where philosophy is over Tim Stone 15:18 there that's worth $200,000. If we just say it's worth one, then it's worth one. Yeah, Jaron Myers 15:22 that's exactly how the housing market works. Thank you for explaining that to us. So they're the cheapest. I don't like the words in this book. I really like the pictures. That's a cool one. Tim Stone 15:39 The chip is developing faster than Donald at this rate. And Unknown Speaker 15:44 the chip is starting to show a handful of behaviors Tim Stone 15:47 that Jaron Myers 15:49 actually can you pull it back up? Do you see Oh, goody follows come me. Terrain. You put that's on positive reinforcement. Tim Stone 16:00 That's nurture right there. Jaron Myers 16:01 That's all nurture that once you guys get in, tell us I'm a chimpanzee. We just shave every day. Yeah. Okay. Do chimps have to wear this podcast? Before we record? Jared comes in with one of those razors. Just shaved my whole body. I have to do it for you. He does it. Yeah, you haven't learned yet. That's what Patreon Tim Stone 16:23 is for. Hopefully we can hire someone soon to do that. Yeah. It's really in Jaron Myers 16:27 search of. It's on indeed. It's like monkey shaver. Search of tube shaver. Chimp. Chimpanzees have tails. Tim Stone 16:38 I think they have nubs. Okay. Yeah. I don't know that for sure. But I think so. Okay. I know they don't have tails. Yeah, evidently they haven't done anything. Jaron Myers 16:46 Chimpanzees and monkeys Tim Stone 16:48 are different. Yeah, they're different. Yes, they're different animals. Jaron Myers 16:51 I agree. But at the end of the day, it's all made up. It's all made up anyways. So if we decide they're called chairs the Tim Stone 17:00 chimp gua she starts she starts displaying a lot of characteristics similar to a young child. For example. She when she's rebel Jaron Myers 17:13 she comes home wearing leather leather bikes. I'm talking to my friend. She's on the phone, on the phone talking to her friends. Friends dead. Do know what it's like to be a chimp in the 30s. slams her door it shatters so strong. So she she like for example, she's tired. She starts to like doze off and like startles her awake. I don't know if chimps do that for a while. But that was something that they took note of. We nurtured that into her fear, anxiety. They're like, I don't have anxiety. We do though. Humans do. Tim Stone 18:01 She watched the stock market very closely. Now, she, they gave her a crib to sleep in. And she like really enjoyed sleeping in the crib. And then if they took the crib away and made her sleep on the floor, like normal chimps, she threw a giant fit. So she really came to enjoy the crib, which I think most living creatures would enjoy having a place to sleep. One thing that they noted is that she did create a nest in their crib. So she took a bunch of blankets and built a nest like a champ in the wilds there. Jaron Myers 18:33 So we didn't ask nature. Yeah, we teach. What's crazy is that the chimpanzee taught Donald that though. Donald also built in the kid share a room. I don't know if they shared a room. I know they were raised again. I don't know if they shared a room that does seem like a liability. Yeah. The principal calls home is like Yeah, Mr. Kellogg gua today bit one of the other classmates Yeah, we didn't we didn't nurture her to do that. Nurture that that's nature. Yeah, that's yeah, that's a natural sign. You could thank God for that one. You're gonna have to take it up with him. Let me give me a second. I mean, talk to my wife real quick. Hey, did you teach Gu what a bipedal was that it? No, no. Yeah, that's not our fault. Yeah, sorry. Can you put go on the phone for a second? You're in when you Are they homeschooling Donald? Well, Tim Stone 20:05 infants, their toddlers Oh, there's no school yet. So she is learning how to live like a human kid. Donald and and GEWA ended up forming a really close bond. Gua is seems to be a little closer to Donald the Donald is to go up. But Donald still is close with Cuba. They play together all the time. Every time Donald walks in room go, it gets really excited and runs over and hugs him. But it's like they're real siblings. Like there's a there's a bot a clear and obvious bond between the two. Yeah. And so they're doing all these experiments to see how they're developing and how they're growing up. And whether or not gua is in fact learning how to be a human. There are some early signs of it. But there's also some signs that she's still a chimpanzee. Jaron Myers 20:54 Like, like a wolf. Boy, what gives it away? Tim Stone 20:59 Well, like the nesting, Jaron Myers 21:01 and the chimpanzee appearance. Tim Stone 21:04 Well, it's interesting, you bring that up, because there's kind of two sides of this experiment. There's a side where they're watching their behavior. And that is something that probably makes sense to do in this experiment. That seems like that's the purpose of this whole experiment. But then there's there's the developmental side where they're looking at appearance. And there's literal notes we have of them. Jaron Myers 21:24 Were starting to look more human. Where they're Tim Stone 21:27 literally being like, yeah, go it looks a lot more like a champ than Donald does, like stuff like that. Jaron Myers 21:39 You were just science school. And you're in your Indiana home writing Gulas Tim Stone 21:43 face looks pretty monkey today. Jaron Myers 21:50 Somebody says, yeah, and then Donald looks like a boring old human. Tim Stone 21:57 Despite all efforts, gua is not turning into human Jaron Myers 22:02 yet, yet evolving, Tim Stone 22:05 evolving. Thank you. And so he's he's testing the actual development. So he puts together some questionable tests for this, okay. One of them. This is really bad. One of them. He decides, hey, I'm going to see how their bone structure is coming together. And so what he decides is the best way to test this recording or bones is he takes a spoon and he Thomsen both on the head and analyzes the sound that it makes and determines that gua has had it skull is developing faster than Donald scarless because it sounds firmer than Donald's skull sounds when he Thomsen with a spoon. And to also like, what year is this? 1930? Yeah, so there's not like, yeah, audio tools? No. Yeah, this is literally saying, Yeah, that sounds. Yeah. Jaron Myers 23:03 And also, yeah, what could go wrong? Where you thump a chimpanzee on the head? Or a child cares about? He's fine. Tim Stone 23:14 Yeah, so that's questionable. Another thing that is so Jaron Myers 23:16 durable, you know, like, you can drop those things. Yeah, Tim Stone 23:19 it's true. Actually, Jaron Myers 23:21 I ended up going about it, they're gonna forget about I don't remember anything I won't remember, especially after you drop them. Another thing that they Tim Stone 23:26 would do is they would sit at a table. Another very questionable thing, they would sit up at a table and then behind them, like right behind them, they would fire a gun and see how they reacted. Like gua was more startled than Donald or whatever. Donald seem to be scared or have the gun. Jaron Myers 23:52 Today, this is one of their daily exercise daily Tim Stone 23:57 goes daily, but doesn't regularly enough because you got to repeat the just see if the data is accurate. And so there, okay, so Jaron Myers 24:03 you're a chimpanzee, right? You're living with a human family. Let's reverse it. Let's say our chimpanzee family has adopted you as a human. And every few days, they're hitting you on the head with spoons, and firing guns behind you. At a certain point, you're gonna lose it at certain point, you're like, why are you doing bro? Stop it. Stop doing that. Tim Stone 24:28 I keep trying to tell you but you're you're speaking a different language. Jaron Myers 24:30 So this sounds like they were trying to nurture some really bad kids. Unknown Speaker 24:33 Well, what they're trying to Tim Stone 24:35 they're just trying to see how they react to stuff kinda it's there's a side of it, where they're just seeing what's the reaction to stuff there's other Jaron Myers 24:41 side of it where they give affection and and yeah, they're trying to raise them as they would their child while also doing some weird experiments. Yeah, yeah. But it's the 1930s. So who knows? Maybe this is how they would raise their child to begin with assurance like they could this could be like he could have been brought up. He's like, Well, my dad fired a gun right behind me every breakfast every morning. Yeah. And it made me unafraid. Every morning my dad would fire to bullets and that's when we knew it was time to leave for school. Tim Stone 25:15 Yeah, every night he'd hit it on the head with the spoon. He said it was the skull fairy. Jaron Myers 25:22 Do you think the tooth fairy? This is a random fraud? I had the Tooth Fairy haggles on the price for some of these people's teeth. You know saying haggling with Tim Stone 25:33 got bad teeth like it? Does he wake them up and Jaron Myers 25:35 be like, Hey, your skulls pretty developed. But you have bad teeth. This one's only worth 50 cents. I was gonna leave you $1 But this tooth sucks. And the next morning I kid says the the tooth fairy came last night told me fairy woke me up and was going back and forth. We negotiated for like an hour. And like Tim Stone 25:58 I slipped price across the table. And he's led a counteroffer. And then he's Jaron Myers 26:02 like, let me go talk to my manager. And I was like, This is a classic. And I could tell he wasn't a good sales because he didn't have six pack abs. I was like this fat to me. Fat please grab this fat. Sell me, dude. So anyways, Mom, Tim Stone 26:23 what I'm trying to say is you need to take me to the orthodontist, I need to get some more valuable teeth before I lose them all. I Jaron Myers 26:29 gotta raise my own value before I can expect someone else to see it. You know, how can I expect someone else to care about my value? Hey, it's me again. Thanks for being here for this episode. If you like what we're doing, it does cost us money to do this. And so just think about that. You know, that's it. We have Patreon supporters. And it really helps us to make this show possible. Honestly, we're so grateful for everyone who listens to the show. But there's, there's people who want to make more of it happen and so they financially support the show. And you get a lot back for it. You get our private discord where we chat every day we're hanging out and just getting to bond and hang out. We also do live zoom Hangouts for our Patreon supporters. You get exclusive merch, it's a good time, there's a lot there's a lot in it for you. And it's a lot enough for us because we get to know you better. You know, you're not just a number and a stat board or whatever. But you know, you're our friends and we appreciate you a lot. So consider doing that. If not, then you can listen to this dumb little ad, because that's how we're gonna get money from you. We're gonna leech from you either way. We're gonna get paid. We're in this for the cold hard cash baby. Anyway, here's an ad. How do you how do they get it though? Tim Stone 27:48 I realized I forgot to put a CTA in mind. Jaron Myers 27:50 Oh dang, we're Tim Stone 27:51 doing Yeah, Jaron Myers 27:52 they can text Tillandsia 66866 Thanks Jared so they're they're they're doing all these experiments to see how the kids are developing. You never thought about that. I'd never thought about that. One thing I think about is you know you're gonna finish that thought came up was like you know, Santa comes for all gives different gifts if you're good or bad, but the Tooth Fairy doesn't care. Yeah, the tooth is the yard school. Yeah. I want you to Tim Stone 28:40 use failure in his millions because he's got to have a lot of money to be buying all these Jaron Myers 28:43 cells but he takes him with the caps on him. So oh, Tim Stone 28:46 he's upselling these there's a there's a dark website where he's selling these tees. upselling silk Jaron Myers 28:53 Sell tooth? Yeah. Anyway, you want to buy some teeth. Anybody wants some ice? Tim Stone 29:08 So these kids are grown up together and gua is another interesting thing about gua is she she starts to learn some like mannerisms and behaviors too. For example, by the time she was a year old, she could open doors so she could walk through around the house and open doors and walk through. She also understood that light switches turned on the lights. And so she both would operate light switches. But also if she saw someone reaching for a light switch, she would turn and look at the light bulb. So she understood what was happening there. She also loved animals when she was really young. So if she saw like a dog or a cat, she would go and pet it until I think she's about 13 months old. She found a dog and the dog was running from her and she thought the dog was playing. And so she kept chasing it thinking they were playing together. But the dog was not happy and The dog turned and barked at her like really aggressive, and that traumatized her for the rest of her life. She was deathly afraid of any animal dogs cats over really birds and trees. She would like cower in fear and run away from any other animal. Wow. Which was an interesting behavior. nurtured that is a nurturer behavior. She, she would if there was another Jaron Myers 30:26 dad lend out the dog. Go get them. Yeah, that's scare this kid. Scared the chip. Yeah, they did it with the kid too. But the kid doesn't didn't remember. He's your dog. The kid actually came back and say with all the dogs teeth. care how bad that dog was? I just wanted to stay on this data you can talk I mean, I mean wait a minute. Are you a Ukrainian 28 year old? Baby was an adult. They hired a baby. It's an experiment we're doing. It pays 30,000 a year, which is the 30s That's pretty good. I'm a baby. They jumped out for bed and they pull them in the other room for its performance review. Go home. You're good. Like Tim Stone 31:38 I gotta be honest with you, man. That wasn't very baby of you today. Jaron Myers 31:40 I know. Dude. My real child kept me up all night. He's got a family at home you know. Story I hate I hate this bit. David Buss Are you think there's gonna be any chimps there? Oh. No, there any chimps there? What are the chimps like at that place? Huh? The What if there was nurture versus nature? Tim Stone 32:14 Gua whenever they would bring other other kids would come over gua would gravitate towards the kids and play with the kids like, okay, child. What? If an adult came over though? She behaved similar to a child and was like really shy and was awkward around them? Because she didn't have anything in common. She didn't understand the stock market yet. Yeah. So like the conversation is just bored her. So there's some things where it's like, Ah, she's kind of behaving like a kid. But then there was a plot twist. About 15 months into the experiment. They started to notice that they felt like Donald's development was falling behind. He was able to say a couple words, but he they noticed that he was starting to make chimp noises to communicate. Jaron Myers 33:03 No, yeah. So no way, Riley Tim Stone 33:07 and saying things in the same way that Google would because Google was developing a little bit faster than him. Well, I mean, there. And so yeah, so Donald was starting to have mannerisms and act similar to the chimp. But the chimp. And the chip did kind of act like a child as well, but they kind of influenced each other. And they were like, Oh, this is we don't want our kid to grow up to be your guy. So they abruptly overnight, cut the experiment short when they realize this, because they kind of freaked out. They're like, Oh, no, we're messing up our kid. And they drove back to Florida. Jaron Myers 33:46 Let her lose the chip. And they said, Hey, remember last year when we took this chip from you guys? You want her back? No, she can't go live in the zoo. So they let her Tim Stone 33:56 back. And they took her sadly, the other chimps killed her. No, not that not that. But sadly, she did get sick a year later passed away. And Donald gave her the sickness which is got life in prison for it. Now Donald grew up and I actually became a scientist as well was relatively relatively successful ish in science. I don't know how Jaron Myers 34:26 but he always had that weird tick you always get angry. You doing got that chimp in me? Tim Stone 34:38 So yes, they kind of prove their theory that there was some nurture but there was obviously nature to so they published this paper and they published it in like plain English. It's now they published it in plain English because they wanted it to be like Unlike Time Magazine, not in like scientific journals, they tried to make it like normal. So it wasn't what's happening, Jaron Myers 35:06 y'all. We raised two kids plot twist. One of them was a chimpanzee Tim Stone 35:13 hashtag mom. Jaron Myers 35:16 Dag mambi. Ma, che Shem mom's? Tim Stone 35:23 Hey, Jim mom here. Yeah. And so they did get picked up and got a lot of media attention. But not a lot of science attention. And the scientists were like, this was a weird idea. And also pretty unethical. So there's a lot of conversation that came out of that, where they're like, We don't like this experiment. This was a weird thing that you chose to do. And also very questionable that you just chose to use your actual kid. Yeah, in this experiment. And also, you didn't even need him. Like, you could have done the nurture side with the chimp without a child. Yeah. And then, but instead, you were hitting your kid on the back of the head with a spoon to see what his thought was developing like, so. They kind of got blacklisted from the science world. But they got pretty popular in the media. They were like, Oh my gosh, this chip was human. And you can see it at the zoo in Florida. For now for a little bit, so but yeah, that's that's the whole story. Their kid kind of kind of turned into chimp a little bit. Jaron Myers 36:22 Still, they nurture that into him, though, Tim Stone 36:23 nurtured it into him. That's pretty crazy. Yeah. They had to have some awkward conversations with their teacher. Yeah. And his boss and his wife Jaron Myers 36:31 he's never been out of and his kids. Yeah. Tim Stone 36:35 Hey, so listen, your dad is kind of a monkey. Jaron Myers 36:43 Yeah, but I mean, like, he turned out okay. Yeah, Tim Stone 36:47 he ended up being alright. Yeah, I Jaron Myers 36:50 mean, so like, you know, Donald grows up and gets married and moves out of the house and stuff. And the chimpanzee, you know, died a lonely death in the zoo. Yeah. Which is like, do you think they felt bad about that? Tim Stone 37:09 I don't think they felt bad about it. I think Donald did. They seem to not care? Like, like, just judging by this experiment? Yeah, they're pretty cold people. Jaron Myers 37:20 Jeez, man. Yeah. Well, when I was growing up, my parents had sent me and my brother right next to each other. And they thumped us in the back of the head. You know, and my dad would like do a couple times he go see if he can hear how hollow my brother's skull is. Yeah, there's not a lot in the nine a lot in there. And then mine sounds very like it's very full. Yeah, like it's his medical condition where it's much yeah, anyway. They sneak up on us and we've received some breakfast needs to sneak up and they go you know, it was like a high pitched screaming Tim Stone 38:08 thanks for watching. If you liked this episode, make sure you subscribe, leave a comment to outweigh all the Grifters. Oh, and then we've got playlists on the screen. You can watch the new videos if you haven't seen them. We have a massive back catalogue. So you should go check them out. And if you want to become a patron you can go to till to do that or buy our merch, whatever you want about it. Thanks for being here. We appreciate you Transcribed by

In the annals of psychology, the story of Gua Kellogg stands out as a groundbreaking experiment that delved into the intricacies of human-chimpanzee interaction. Join us as we unfold the fascinating narrative of Winthrop and Luella Kellogg, who dared to challenge the norms of the 1930s by bringing a chimpanzee into their home. The Kelloggs and Their Unconventional Experiment in … Read More

John Edwards Mack – Almost Lost His Job For Alien Abductees


Episode Transcription

Made by robots for robots. Only read if you're weird.

Tim Stone 0:00 Hey man, what's up? Have you ever heard of John Edward Mack? Jaron Myers 0:04 John Edward Mack John ever Mack J Mack? No Tim Stone 0:13 Have you ever heard of like when people say like okay, it's a WWE SmackDown they get it from what they it's comes from his last name. Like that's where they got the idea for that from was yeah a WWE SmackDown Jaron Myers 0:29 was that your attempt at a joke? What is that? It's the truth. Tim Stone 0:32 That's what they got it WWE Mack down he was yeah, he was before the WWE. Jaron Myers 0:41 You do the story part. I'll do like the funny part Tim Stone 0:43 that somebody laughed. If you laughed, leave a review and tell us he laughed. And Jaron Myers 0:48 he didn't laugh. Please don't leave us a review. Let us get to some funnier parts first, Tim Stone 0:53 and then leave a review and say Jaron Myers 0:57 it really does help if you leave a podcast review. Tim Stone 1:01 The man with the big bean eyes told me to kill him Unknown Speaker 1:05 to take you out. No, you are shameless. Jaron Myers 1:08 They all see that you're gaslighting me right now. You're dazzling. You're just slowly pushed up here for the man slowly Tim Stone 1:15 like being I think you're bald. I'm Jaron Myers 1:17 trying to shape. Once here what the shooter has things I learned last night. Tim Stone 1:33 John emack, Edward Mack John Edward Mack. We can call him John. He was a boy born in 1904. Okay, in 1929, to a father who supported father was born in 1904. He was born in 1929 in New York City, to a pretty like, what's the word academic family and he had a father that was like, You got to do your studies and you got to learn your stuff. You know, I want to know that you can play piano and tell me about maths. And he said maths, not math. Yeah, like one of those kinds of dads, you know? Yeah. And so he, he grew up. Jaron Myers 2:19 Have you done your homeworks on how they didn't give us any in school? I'm talking about the school homework. Yeah, I'm talking about your home homework. Yeah. Tim Stone 2:25 And he's like, Oh, I didn't do that homework. And he's like, What did you do your other homework? And he's like, What homework daddy's the homework that you gave yourself. And, and it was like this weird. And then this Jaron Myers 2:36 was watched like weird versions of movies that existed like homework bound. And you're like, What the heck? We review Jaron Myers 2:51 stupid, dumb stuff. Tim Stone 2:55 And his dad is that like, this is an interesting thing that his dad did. They weren't a religious family. But he read his Bible to him and his siblings to like, learn culture. As a Catholic, won't you be cultured? And he's like, so listen to this story. This is a story about a kid with a dad because it's Jaron Myers 3:12 kind of like math and the Bible, Tim Stone 3:16 but not like the Bible, like normal. Like a lot of dads are about the Bible. But it's more like the Bible. Like, hey, you Jaron Myers 3:22 should know this stuff. Listen to this story is the most relevant story to humanity. Tim Stone 3:26 Yeah, but not to him. Okay. So he, he went on to go to medical school, obviously, got his degree in medical school in 1947. Went on to get a graduate degree in 1951. Okay, finally graduated from Harvard in 55. After that, he worked at the Massachusetts General Hospital doing psychology, he was a therapist. Okay. And then, you know, like a lot of people, war happens. And so in 1959, he joined the Air Force and served as a medic in Japan. And rose to the rank of captain was very distinguished in his medical army journey. And then he came back, returned from his military service, and he has a great career in psychotherapy, and studying specifically, people's experiences and how they relate to like, their worldview and how it relates to how they interact with other people in the world. You know, okay, and so like how your, your worldview shapes your behavior, Jaron Myers 4:35 and how your worldview shapes your behavior. I'm here I'm listening. And then he gets his reading like a young adult graphic novel, sorry. And then he went off to war and was a medic, and you're like, what is the shirtless medic? Where are you talking about this? Tim Stone 4:55 So one day while he is at the Washington or back at the Massachusetts General Hospital, Okay, and he's doing psychotherapy is doing psychotherapy. Okay, a client leaves his office and he peered out the window. It's a full moon and watch them walk straight. Backwards, backwards. Jaron Myers 5:12 It's like I gotta be Tim Stone 5:15 words backwards. Now he's looking at his period out the window full moon, his shots were Jaron Myers 5:21 glistening in the full moon as the moon beams shine it Tim Stone 5:28 wipes his hair away from his eyes. Jaron Myers 5:30 He's got a receding hairline but it's still hot. It's so hot Dr. Mac you're seeking Jaron Myers 5:49 male pattern baldness Jaron Myers 6:02 alpha male no male pattern, this is alpha, alpha male pattern baldness. Tim Stone 6:19 So he, he starts studying it's specifically people's worldview and how it shapes their behavior. And then also teams. Just that just teens because we're Yeah, they're weird. And then heroin addicts, those are three kind of areas of expertise that he's studying. And he becomes pretty prominent, gets published 152 scientific journals, actually publishes a number of books as well, sure. And this lands him a job as a professor at Harvard. And within five years, he becomes the director of the psychology program at Harvard, gets tenured, and is like kind of like a, a global name in the psychology field. By the time that eight is rolled around, sure, he's very highly respected. And 9990. He's serving in kind of two capacities. He's a professor, a full time professor. He's directing the Harvard psychology department, and he's doing that. But he's also still has a private practice. And so he's still doing therapy with people, specifically, younger people, but anyone, but specifically, he leaned towards youths, youth. And one day someone comes into his office. And it was an interesting experience for him. Because they tell them a story that typically he his gut response and the rest of the scientific community, probably their response would be, you're a crazy person. But he hears the story. Jaron Myers 7:55 Tim saw my face. I Tim Stone 7:56 love that notice you the moment you notice, it's the best. Jaron Myers 8:01 I hate that you bury the lead on this one, too. All right, what do you tell him? Tim Stone 8:08 So the guy comes in, he tells him a story. I hate that you told Jaron Myers 8:11 me this guy is not relevant to the story at all. Dude, Tim Stone 8:15 no, you actually use here's the point of the story. Okay. So this, this patient, tells him a story. The other night, he was sleeping in his bed, and he was abducted by aliens. And he tells him the whole story. And Dr. Mack notices, he said the response that this individual is having is not a psychotic response. This is a drama. Yeah, he has experienced Yeah, he's like, this is an authentic experience. And he said, I don't know if I would go as far as to say this guy was actually abducted by aliens, but there's some trauma that he experienced sure that he's reliving. Yeah, and this is not a psycho. issue. Yeah. And so he found this very interesting. And so he continued seeing this patient going through the thing with him and did a number of psychoanalysis to see if he actually did have any sort of condition that would explain the man having this experience. Okay. And they couldn't he couldn't find anything that would explain away, right thing. So he put out an ad on Craigslist, and he said, anybody who has been abducted by aliens, I want to talk to you. That's not real. He didn't this was pre Craigslist. But as you say, but he did put out a thing as to Hey, he did go and start, he left out. Jaron Myers 9:32 He left a thing at Starbucks. Does it have you call this number? Let's make fun of you on YouTube. Yeah. So he the number of comments on our voicemail videos, where people are like, these are just innocent people who called in and like they, and you're making fun of them. It's insane. And you're like, all right. Tim Stone 9:55 It's also crazy how quickly that changed because that out and people Jaron Myers 9:59 were like Haha, this is hilarious. Yeah. And then like two years later people like those people have mental issues and you're like, hey, like you're a boy, you have mental issues. You should have one because they want to be a cat. And it's like, no one calling into serious Tim Stone 10:13 no one. Yeah, no one calling in was like, oh, yeah, I Jaron Myers 10:15 want that. Like, yeah, Cat Daddy, you know, like nobody. Yeah, you're the one who you're miserable. And it's your fault. Yeah, that's kind of the message to everybody right now. Is Honestly, you're scrolling social media, you're getting ticked off by everything. And you're making yourself miserable. Tim Stone 10:32 Yep. Yep, exactly. So quit that. Quit doing that. So he, he found 200 individuals who claimed to have been abducted by aliens, over the course of a couple of years, interviews them, does a few sessions with them to understand their experience. Jaron Myers 10:48 See if they've all got that same kind of trauma response kind of stuff to Tim Stone 10:52 see is a common response from some of the other aliens. And what he finds is after interviewing these 200 people, not a single one of them showed any signs of any sort of psychotic break or anything like that. Okay. All of them showed signs of a trauma response. Okay. And so he started kind of raising some red flags and saying, Hey, we always write these people off. But there's something interesting happening here. He also noticed that the experiences were strikingly similar across these people. Here's the most common storyline that he noticed. People were typically at home asleep in their bed. And they woke up to some sort of noise like either a vibrating sound or like a like a I don't know how to describe it, like a shock. Wave type sound. Like, uh, yeah, so that's pretty good. Yeah, that was pretty good again. Yeah. Yeah. Or like a key. Yeah, I'm really good at this. Something like that. Yeah. Jaron Myers 12:04 I can't we we got that on camera. But I'm like, I'm like really good at alien noises Yeah. Tim Stone 12:16 Yeah, if Wow. Jaron Myers 12:20 All right. Tick tock video. No. Oh, you haven't seen that. Oh, there's a girl who's a girl a lady. She I don't know. She's older than us. And she has stepped back from that ledge my friend. She stepped back from that. And it's like the caption is POV. I actually caught myself finding out that I can actually sing like, so now people just do that. As a bit. Yeah. That's a bit. No, she was serious. She was like, she was like, she like she looks at the camera. She goes, oh my gosh, like and she's not good. I was gonna say I was because I saw I saw what last night. We're a girls in the bathroom and she's listening to the eyes. She goes whoa, whoa. Jaron Myers 13:27 I can do with my cotton on camera. I can't believe you're here. That's Jaron Myers 13:37 pretty good. Ready, lady? Seems like I've heard it before. And that's my trauma response. I'm gifted. Don't honk at me while I'm walking. Jaron Myers 13:52 Hey, thanks for checking out this episode of things last night. If you like our show, and you want more of it, we have plenty of other episodes. One that I enjoyed was Jose Canseco, you know the baseball player from like the 90s and stuff. But also it's kind of an alien episode. Spoiler alert. So go check that out. Thanks for being here. Thanks for listening. And thanks for watching. And now back to this episode Tim Stone 14:21 so they would hear the sound, it wouldn't wake them up. Yeah. And then they would see a bright light, and then they would lose time. Next thing they would know. They were back in their bed and hours had passed. Sure. And they would have died. They would have pain in their sides. And so many of them also had scars scarring, like actual legitimate scarring that Dr. John Mack said does not seem self inflicted, just because of the location of it. Typically self inflicted wounds are Yeah, Jaron Myers 14:52 where's the scars that are in their side? Right here? Yeah. What kind of scars are we talking? Tim Stone 14:57 Like incision type scars. Oh, yeah. And so kind of strange like, Jaron Myers 15:03 I got a scar here from my appendectomy. Oh, yeah, I Unknown Speaker 15:07 forgot you did that. Yep. Jaron Myers 15:11 I did do that. Thanks for asking. Do we could just we could corporate podcast this? Well, I know. So that's a great question. You know, when I got out of college, I was just kind of floating around. And I was like, fun to do. Yeah. I don't need it. Tim Stone 15:26 I didn't know. Yeah, I felt like hearing this. Wait. Jaron Myers 15:30 There's a lot of stuff in my life where I don't need this. Why do I do that? Why am I holding on to this stuff still? So I just got an appendectomy. Tim Stone 15:38 And, you know, two years later, Jaron Myers 15:40 much lighter. Yeah. Yeah. Also, my parents paid for college. So made it a lot. You know, I didn't have any debt. And I was like, Well, I want to experience what that's like. I Tim Stone 15:48 had a I had a similar experience. I just felt like a lot of what I was trying to do in business. I was getting held back from just like, I had these like, self limiting beliefs, right. And I could feel in my heart that like, I wasn't it. So I called up my doctor. I was like, Doc, I need you to take my heart out. They said we can't do that work. Yeah, but luckily, I found the Lebanon. Jaron Myers 16:14 Got you, Missouri. Tim Stone 16:17 Lebanon, out there, and it took my heart out. And now I don't feel a thing. Basically, or emotionally Jaron Myers 16:25 been better ever said. Yeah. Tim Stone 16:26 It's crazy how much I can get done with no heart, but I have to sleep 16 hours a day. But, but it's okay, because I get more done. I get more done in eight hours that you get in all 24 of yours. Anyways, hey, can you pour some blood? I can't live my arms. I need you to do it for me Jaron Myers 16:49 a little bit. That balloon. Did you call it a balloon? Yeah, it's how it's spelled. Yeah, I Tim Stone 16:59 just yeah. All right. I hate this. So Dr. Beck. Jaron Myers 17:04 He's like their scars that aren't. Tim Stone 17:07 Yeah. And some of them would say that. In that gap where there was last time they would say they remember. They have like, Jaron Myers 17:16 you're touching good memories. today. Yeah, exactly of like Tim Stone 17:18 being in some metallic room where people were operating on them. peoples are stronger beings. We're operating on them. People Jaron Myers 17:26 is a strong word. What is Tim Stone 17:28 what is what's interesting is they came back. And almost all of them. I don't have like a percentage. But I do know, the majority of them said that they felt as though they needed to become like an environmentalist. They're like, we feel like we need to protect the Earth was like they they would wake up and they they would have this Jaron Myers 17:54 urge. I gotta go talk to a tree right now. That tree, that tree would just belittle me, me, me. Oh, we shave you. I'm gonna endanger freedom. I can handle myself. Okay, sorry. All right. They woke up and they were like, We got to save the planet. Yeah. Tim Stone 18:15 So he writes a couple papers about this. And scientific journals are like, we're not publishing this. And then, so he just writes a book. And Jaron Myers 18:25 we're having a Elon. That's why he made electric cars. He got arrested. No, no, I think he's an alien. Tim Stone 18:34 Maybe. So John writes his book. And he kind of becomes like, the most academically distinguished person that is saying there might be something to this. And he's actually saying he never says this as aliens. He never says, These people got abducted. He says there's something to their experience. He's like, there's too much similarities. It's definitely a trauma response. I can't explain the scarring. And he said, I think we should look into this more. It's kind of is all he's really saying. Jaron Myers 19:04 You think aliens are real idiot done? Yeah. And he's saying he's saying I think we should validate Tim Stone 19:07 these people's experience, basically. And so he starts catching some flack from Harvard. And a independent confidential review gets launched from Harvard, into Dr. John Mack for malpractice, they feel that because he was not saying, Hey, you have a psychotic, psychotic condition. Yeah. He because he was just saying, hey, there'll be something that's irresponsible that you are. And so they're saying that's malpractice. And they were trying to remove his tenure at Harvard, which is something that has never happened before and never happened since. And so they launched this investigation, and it stayed underground for a couple of years while they were investigating them. And the only reason it became public, is because they started how vindico do personal interviews. And someone was like, Hey, I had this call with your boss. Yeah, Jaron Myers 20:06 someone called me the other day. And they were like, chopsticks was on Glenstone is owned by Tony and Michelle. Tim Stone 20:15 So call me the other day and they were asking me about your hairline. And is this him? Yeah. Jaron Myers 20:24 I called that. So good dude. He's not he's a handsome fellow. Yeah, Tim Stone 20:30 yeah, he doesn't have a good hairline. It's very strong. So they this, this review is going on and he realizes it, it gets when to it. And he is reputation was already kind of not taking like a big hit. But there was questions. And this was like, Oh, this is a big deal. So he goes and he finds an attorney. And one of the things the attorney says is like, we need to send you on a PR circuit. So they sent them on Oprah. They started sending them on these talk shows to be like, hey, like Alien people who've been abducted by aliens, like there's something to their story. And so like, he starts going on all these shows, we do a PR thing and make this worse. And yeah, Harvard was real mad about it was like, You got to stop doing that. And he's like, I'm tenure. What are you going to do? Wait until the full moon. Jaron Myers 21:23 They did one night. He's in his house. And a sniper shoots just four inches from his head. Sounds weird. Tim Stone 21:33 And there's a note on the bullet on the board. Jaron Myers 21:37 It's like a little. Yeah, it's like a little scroll inside. Very large. Yes. This will do Tim Stone 21:45 this. This message is for Dr. John E. Mac. If you are not Dr. Johnny Mac, please roll this. Jaron Myers 21:53 Confidential. Johnny Mac, please. Tim Stone 21:58 at your earliest convenience. Okay. So Eagles have this press tour. And he becomes kind of like the face of alien abductions in the 90s. For sure. Oprah is very interested in it. She had them on a couple of times. She had like, come on and eat this weird stuff was like, I don't know what this has to do with aliens. They're real now. Jaron Myers 22:24 You'll enjoy it. You'll enjoy it. Tim Stone 22:29 But he's doing like a daytime talk show circuit talking about this while this investigation is going on in the background. And then something interesting happens. Jaron Myers 22:37 I don't like this. Tim Stone 22:40 I think we need to go a little deeper. Have you heard of the Ariel school encounter? No, let's take it a step deeper. cultural themes are Jaron Myers 22:50 things I learned last night Tim Stone 23:01 so this is a side story, I need to leave a review. So in the same time, there was this thing called the aerial scoring counter, okay, there was a school in Zimbabwe in the air. There was a school in Zimbabwe called the areal. School. It was a like private Christian school in September on September 16 1994. There was during recess, a group of children and by group of children I mean, pretty much the whole school, because they were all out at recess. Saw what they described as three orbs floating above the school. And then they merged into one main orb, and then it landed on the soccer field. And they all like crowded around to see what was going on. And then a small what they described as like a three foot figure, like rose out of the center of this orb, and was wearing like black tights. Like just a really great receding hairline. No, but had big black eyes. And the kids described a like sense of dread or typical ale. Yeah. But they describe feeling a sense of dread but also villains Jaron Myers 24:20 they all come and tracksuits. That's pretty fun. It's a long journey. You got to be comfortable. You Tim Stone 24:26 got to be comfy. They used to wear suits, like three piece suits everywhere they went. But that was all caught on that they Jaron Myers 24:32 were officiating a wedding and they're like, Oh, you Tim Stone 24:34 gotta cover it up a little bit. Yeah, the the men and black got too popular. And they were like we can't Sure. They're copying our style. Now. That's where we got suits from. So the kids described a handful the kids described visions of like the world burning, and all the kids walked away, feeling like they wanted to become environmentalists. And so the headmaster, the headmaster of the school, after this whole event that There was no adults out there, which is a little suspect, but it's the 90s All right. Jaron Myers 25:06 One of the teachers perspectives, yeah. Kids are all released for class. They come back and suddenly they're like, We got to save the planet. And you're like, Okay. And they're like, you drive an SUV and you're like, Okay, I don't like this attitude from you and they go you hate this planet you know like all sudden your kids the kids in your class or as I'm saying like, Tim Stone 25:29 the man with the big bean eyes told me to kill you. Jaron Myers 25:33 Or to take you out what he told me Tim Stone 25:35 you're gonna kill Earth. They didn't call it earth he called it the soy again. That's pretty good. Old odd Jaron Myers 25:58 show you that video. We're done Tim Stone 25:59 with this. What was happening during this recess is the teachers were in a meeting with the headmaster, okay. And the lunch lady was actually supposed to be out there was the headmaster Jaron Myers 26:05 was sitting at the table for Tim Stone 26:09 the lunch lady was supposed to be out there helping watching the kids. Okay, but there was some murmurs that the kids were trying to steal some of the like snack cakes during recess. So she went into the school to cover the snack Jaron Myers 26:23 makes no round coverage. Tim Stone 26:28 During this, the suppose that snap case heist, the kids witnessed this UFO and it was like the whole school. The headmaster then pulls kids aside, immediately after this event, and as I draw me a picture of what you saw, and we have all these pictures, and they are, they are strikingly similar. Jaron Myers 26:48 separated, all of them was like, okay, draw. Tim Stone 26:51 Yeah, let me let me grab these, I should have probably grabbed these before. Yeah, I Jaron Myers 26:55 think that would have been probably you run into this, you're gonna mention some child's drawings, I'm gonna want to see him speaking your child's drawings in our Discord. People. People have been submitting drawings for thumbnails and different memes and stuff. And I liked that a lot. So please keep doing that. If you want to join our Discord. You can be a Patreon supporter. That's how you get to be in there and send us jokes and stuff. Tim Stone 27:24 Thanks for checking out our show. If you like it, and you want to support it be a part of what we're doing here. You can do that by becoming a patron. What happens there is you get to be in the community. We have a discord with our hosted producers, we have a lot of fun. We're super active in there every day, you get access to add free content a week before everybody else. And we have a zoom every month with our patrons. We hang out we eat pizza, we get to know you a little bit better. It's a blast. And there's a ton of other different benefits like merch discounts, birthday messages, things like that, that are super cool. If you want to be in that you can just text Dylan 266866. And that'll get you right in there. If not, we're just super glad that you're here. And thanks for watching our show. Tim Stone 28:09 Yeah, that's exactly right. And Jaron Myers 28:11 as of recently, Tim has been doing some research sessions sessions. Yeah, with our Patreon supporters, so he just goes live and then you can help him do the research for this. So thank you to our Patreon supporters for not steering him away from this topic. Tim Stone 28:28 I didn't talk to them about this one. I wanted this one to be a surprise. I don't know. I talked to them about the last episode. Jaron Myers 28:33 Doesn't matter how much money you pay him. He's still gotta keep secrets. That's what his wife has learned too. Tim Stone 28:41 Alright, so check this out. Okay, great. So here's one of them. Geez. Here is another it's a different one. Yeah, that's a different one. So yeah, you want to see that one again? Okay, this is a different one. Okay, and this one's a little different or Jaron Myers 28:58 different or, but still similar. That's the same one. That's the other one. Tim Stone 29:09 So yeah, these are these two specifically are very similar. This one is somewhat like go back. Jaron Myers 29:17 Nobody's the first one. Okay, so this just want to be clear. Both pictures. Yeah. See this guy? Yeah, go to the next picture. He didn't have a foot in that one either. This one footed, maybe. I think he's the same image dude. Scrolling. This is the same picture. Tim Stone 29:36 I don't know. Man. It might be. It is. Jaron Myers 29:39 Yes. Okay. Tim Stone 29:44 I don't know. He seems closer to it in this one than he doesn't this one. No. And there's more Jaron Myers 29:48 this black and white version of the picture you just showed me first. It's got a dot right here. Look at the little scrapes. Okay, dot right there. These are the screws Ah, Tim Stone 30:00 yeah, the scrapes are up though the scrapes don't go as far up though. Jaron Myers 30:03 These the scrapes he's got this little little hatch right here. Yeah, they window come back out the other one. Well dot here's the scrapes hatch right there window is the same page Tim Stone 30:15 very very simple pretty simple very very similar it's pretty similar scratches go further up, Jaron Myers 30:22 please save me closer pretty simple Tim Stone 30:28 and look at this Jaron Myers 30:32 picture are you joking right now Tim Stone 30:34 look at the look at the dashes at the bottom those are longer than the dashes on this one. Oh man, Jaron Myers 30:41 this is squiggly. This is a low res black and white version of this image. Tim Stone 30:47 I mean, I see where you're coming from. I could see it. Unknown Speaker 30:50 I mean, I'm also with Jared on that I could Tim Stone 30:52 see it a foot. I could see it also look at Speaker 1 30:56 the like the bottom lines on the structure, how it like it's the same number of lines, same orientation, and that little dip halfway to that door is the same. Tim Stone 31:09 Yeah, but if you look if you look, look these kids, this one's kind of concave back all the way across. There's a concave at the bottom, this one straight across. It's I could see a possible world. Where do you You're right. I'll give you that I can see a possible world. Yeah, I don't know. Jaron Myers 31:31 All of the other evidence for this one, it looks like there's a curve. Tim Stone 31:38 No, but the if you look at the scratches on this one, the scratches go way above his head and the color one, and the scratches go to his head and the dark. Black and white. I don't see anything past his head of that image. I'm not saying it's not. But I'm also not saying it. Unknown Speaker 31:56 I mean, no, You are shameless. So Tim Stone 32:03 here's what I was gonna say though. If you compare these images, these are kind of just classic alien pictures. You know, like if you saw an alien, and like you didn't actually see the Alien and you were like, hey, draw a picture of the alien you saw it probably would look something like this anyways. Like these are pretty cool. Jaron Myers 32:19 Right now just so you guys know I'm not embarrassed. I stand by when I'm humiliated. Hey, leave a review if you agree with me by the fact that Tim Stone 32:31 I could see I could see your I see your point. I see that I think there's the same I think there's a possible world but Jaron Myers 32:37 I think your reluctance to admit that you showed me to have the same picture. discredit the entire rest of the story if you were willing to just go yeah, those are the same. I might believe the rest of your story. Tim Stone 32:49 No, I think there's it's possible. It's possible. I'm not convinced for sure. All right. Anyways, Jaron Myers 32:58 so they all see this. They take the whole story. Everyone's got eyes. They all see that you're gaslighting me right now. You're gaslighting me. I said Zuckerberg. Tim Stone 33:15 So the headmaster takes down all their stories. Like these jobs are kind of similar. The stories are kind of similar. These two Jaron Myers 33:21 are identical. But that's crazy. These two images are identical. He's Tim Stone 33:26 looking at the one picture like guys, look, this looks exactly like this one. And he just moves into this. Jaron Myers 33:33 He's got he's, oh, he's just like friggin Tim Stone 33:37 crossed cross. Last your eyes. It looks like these two are the same, like so you're holding one, man. Jaron Myers 33:42 It's pretty crazy. Tim Stone 33:44 And so the headmaster is like, this is bogus. He's like, he's like, there's nothing to this. And so he he goes on and he's just like, You guys didn't see anything and then like we saw the aliens and they want you to take better care of the planet. And so they kind of they felt invalidated. Sure. word gets out about this and UFO ologists you ufologists mull over the world are like traveling ologists and like hey, can we interview the students at the school? And they're like, Absolutely not. You can't cannot talk to Yeah, absolutely not. And then they were like, they're holding Geiger counters up to the headmaster. And they're like you're pretty nucular bro. You're Jaron Myers 34:19 kind of alien. This is Tim Stone 34:22 you smell like aluminum. Jaron Myers 34:23 You wouldn't Oprah smelled the same but Tim Stone 34:26 that's just my deodorant. I have aluminum deodorant, bro. And then word gets back to Dr. John Mack about this. Okay. And he says, may pop them off an email. It wasn't emails letters too early for email. Well, maybe not. I don't know when did email start? Jaron Myers 34:43 Anyway, he writes a little scroll right Tim Stone 34:56 before we go into lockdown, I think he might be trying to tell me something. If Jaron Myers 35:01 Well, let's hear what the shooter has to say. Tim Stone 35:06 Might be a scroll in that. That's Jaron Myers 35:07 an intro quote. I see him typing it right now. But zero the shooter, Jesus, so he, no he Tim Stone 35:16 doesn't. He writes him a letter. He said, Hey, I'm from Harvard. Can I come interview all your kids? And they were like, oh, Harvard. Yeah. And so they let him come in, he interviews all the kids. And he leaves that experience saying, Hey, I think they really did experience something. And so he writes another book about this. telling their stories, guys crazy, okay, they heard something, I think they did see something. I think this is a trauma response. I don't think any of them are crazy. And then he goes back home to the US, has his trial, where he wins. The his lawyer was able to be like, You can't do this, and they're what we want to and then he was like, you can't and so then he got to keep his job. He's tenured. He got to keep his job, worked there for the rest of his life until he was killed by a drunk driver in London in 2004, which is really sad. And the Driver. Driver only had six years and principles Jaron Myers 36:05 go. I worked there. And then he was killed by a drunk driver. And I guess the main takeaway, what the heck. Tim Stone 36:15 But here's the thing. Recently, a new documentary came out about the Ariel school encounter guy. It's on Netflix. Called encounters. Yes. And then I think episode three, Jaron Myers 36:26 I watched the first one. Yeah, I watched half the first one. I was like, this is bogus. It's not great. It's not great. The fighter jets. Tim Stone 36:32 Yeah, we're good. We can talk about that later. There's, in this documentary, it's the first documentary where they got any of the students to tell their story since they were kids. Okay. A lot of the class is dead. Because they, yeah, yeah. So in this interview, what's interesting is, the majority of the kids that they got is about probably seven or eight of adults as adults, how many of these things saw pretty much the whole school? It's like, 200. Kids, oh, smaller, private school, boom, decent size, you know, all of them maintain the story. And as adults are saying, Yeah, I know what, what what I saw, and it changed my life, like, and a lot of them actually went on to become environmentalists as adults. Okay. It's just very interesting. One guy in this interview, was like, Yeah, everybody's lying. I made the whole thing up. He was like, he's like, I made it up. And they're like, what? And he's like, yeah, he said, I was trying to get snack cakes from the lunch lady. And I needed a diversion. And so I said, Hey, everybody, there's over there. And while everybody was in commotion, looking, I snuck into the lunchroom. And I took some snack cakes from lunch. It's like, I made the whole thing up. Everybody's like, he's like, I don't know, if a lot of people just convinced themselves what they saw. I mean, I think they did. Yeah. And he's like, he's like, he's like, either they're lying. Or they're convinced that they actually saw that he's but But I made the whole thing up. Jaron Myers 38:05 And I do it again. Jaron Myers 38:14 Why did you do this whole? Tim Stone 38:15 No, but I do want to talk about John Mack more than Jaron Myers 38:18 okay. Yeah. So I'm saying though, is that so that discredits all of his work, though? Kinda? Well, I mean, his work was more focused on the like, the the response that they have. Yeah. Tim Stone 38:32 What's interesting is he never said it was Aliens. What he said his he said, I think there was something something has some sort of response within them something he has something happened and this is how they verbalized it. Jaron Myers 38:42 But isn't that crazy, though? Like, let's let's follow the trailer. No, you know, aliens obviously don't exist, and those drawings were different. So, isn't it interesting, though, like, these kids, this kid made up a story to get a snack cakes. Yeah. And those kids in their mind, then just believed it and now, their psyche and their physical bodies. Remember, something that did not happen wasn't Tim Stone 39:09 real. Yeah, not crazy, that your brain can just do that. Yeah. Like trick yourself into believing something. I mean, you tell yourself the story long enough, like you start to believe it. My barber actually, the other day, she told me a story. Jaron Myers 39:20 He was like, I just one day was like, I went to Barber College Tim Stone 39:31 my barber was like, you know, I actually I am like a legal like medical doctor. And she's like, I've been practicing for a little bit. But she's like, I cut your heart out if you want me to. I think it'll make you perform better. Now, she told me she said one of the other barbers in the room left for a minute. She was like, hey, while they're gone is gone. Yeah, Jaron Myers 39:52 I saw something. She said. She said. Tim Stone 39:57 She said she stole my story. And she started telling it like It was hers. And she's like, and I heard her tell it. And like, I heard the details and the names and stuff. And I was like, that's my story. And she like in the shop, like, and she's telling another client, that they're telling my story. And so she's like, like wild. And it happened again. And I was like, that's weird. And then it happened again. And now I'm like, does she think that is her story? Or does she think that happened to her and I was like, You should call her out on it. I was like, I was like, you don't know. I was like, I was like, You should tell that story. And Jaron Myers 40:32 you will happen to me one time and see what she says I was an elementary students in Zimbabwe. Tim Stone 40:41 What's crazy to me is I can see a possible scenario where she got that story from that Barber, and it's not actually her story either. But she thinks she thinks that barbers told her story, but she told her story, all the Jaron Myers 40:53 stories together, one Tim Stone 40:54 of her stole my story, and Jaron Myers 40:57 both stole it from another barber, who's deliverable movie. Like, tell me the story. Okay. So I was trying to figure out how to fly across the country for free, right, I get to the airport, there's some hot dogs. And I just got on a plane. Yeah. Tim Stone 41:15 And I said, I said, Can I can I deadhead on this. I don't even know what that meant. I Jaron Myers 41:21 just said, yeah, yeah, deadhead led led me eventually to barber school where I definitely went. And now I'm here. I'm classically trained live in the woods for 27 years, Tim Stone 41:33 classically trained, Hey, your receding hairline is so good. I said that before. Jaron Myers 41:39 strictly professional, your professional should be professional. I love your hairline. Tim Stone 41:45 They have they have the clippers are clipping. Jaron Myers 41:49 Your you're like, hey, I don't want that far back. As you do, I just really like that's a funny thing. If you hate your clients as a barber, you could just slowly Tim Stone 41:59 slowly be like being I think you're bald. Jaron Myers 42:01 I'm trying to shape. I think you're bald. Tim Stone 42:09 Okay, so John bag. He, he is saying that he thinks that there's this trauma response here. But what a lot of his colleagues think, cuz in the 90s, this gets, I don't want to say discovered, but like, there starts to become scientific proof around sleep paralysis. And so she's like, I think this is a subset of the population who knows about aliens, and that's them trying to explain their sleep paralysis. Sure. And that Jaron Myers 42:37 doesn't explain the environmentalist part, though. But well, Tim Stone 42:42 John Mack before he worked at Harvard, or before, he was the head headmaster, before he was the director of performance when he was just a professor at Harvard, where Jaron Myers 42:50 he was Professor Dumbledore, Tim Stone 42:51 him, along with Carl Sagan marched into a nuclear test facility was I shouldn't say just Carl Sagan, like there was like 100 professors, okay, just different sciences. They marched in to a nuclear test facility as like a sign of civil disobedience. To be like, You guys need to stop doing this you're gonna destroy the planet. So Jaron Myers 43:16 he added that Tim Stone 43:19 there's, there's a possible reason to believe he was trying to come up with a, an supernatural, Extra Terrestrial reason why we need to stop damaging our planet. That could be a potential motive for that. Like, we don't know if that's true or not. So there's some questions there. Jaron Myers 43:40 One other detail about him was he was trying to save the planet by combining he was like, I want two burgers, but I want it in one bottle or one wrapper. So just put it on top of the other one. Yeah. And they were like, that's a big sandwich, man. So really, that's a big sales. Big. That's a big that's a I keep record this on camera, but that's a Big Mac. Tim Stone 44:10 Big Hold on. Oh, Jaron Myers 44:18 sorry. That's just my arteries. And he Tim Stone 44:20 was like, he's like, I want some royalties for that. And McDonald's is like you're gonna die when you go to London next week. Jaron Myers 44:28 He's like, I'm not going to London next week. We buy your flight already. Yeah. Tim Stone 44:31 That will see you there. I mean, we won't see their hamburger Oh, man, so yeah, that was the end of a Big Mac. Wow. Big John Mac. Jaron Myers 44:45 I can't believe now. All right. Well, Tim Stone 44:49 we can fiddle him off Jaron Myers 44:57 things last night is a production of space Tim me Yeah produced by Kristian Taylor audio is edited by Alex Garnett video by Connor Betts social media is run by Caleb Walker and graphic design by Caleb Goldberg. Our hosts are Jaron Meyers and Tim stone please follow us on social media at tellen podcast that's ti LL IN podcast, leave a review, comment, subscribe, wherever you are. Thank you for listening to things on my site. Transcribed by

John Edwards Mack, born on October 4, 1929, was an American psychiatrist and professor at Harvard Medical School. His career unfolded as an intriguing journey through psychology, marked by a distinctive interest in the uncharted territories of alien abductions. Achievements in the Field of Psychology Mack’s groundbreaking work earned him recognition, particularly for his research on the psychological and spiritual … Read More

Christopher Thomas Knight – Revealing the Hidden North Pond Hermit


Episode Transcription

Made by robots, for robots. Only read if you're weird.

Tim Stone 0:00 Hey man, what's up? Have you heard of Christopher Thomas Knight? Jaron Myers 0:05 Christopher Thomas Knight? Is this Chris angels legal name? Which would be very funny if you did that. Tim Stone 0:14 I could see that and now I'm inspired. Jaron Myers 0:17 Christopher Thomas night. No, Tim Stone 0:21 this is a fun one. Jaron Myers 0:22 CTK C T Tim Stone 0:24 K Yes, this is a fun one. This was recommended by one of our patrons Mickey. And I think you're gonna like this one a lot. Let's uh, but I don't want to a lot of times like I'll start the story like at the beginning of the story. I don't want to do that this Jaron Myers 0:38 time. Let's start at the start right at the end there was a murder Unknown Speaker 0:46 I'm just putting on my wiener me. Jaron Myers 0:49 The worst thing I've ever heard you say, wait till you see that on a trail cam. Tim Stone 0:53 And he said, Well, he said I have a radio. So he's like, I know who the Kardashians are. Here's Jaron Myers 0:57 salted soy beans are one of the rich people eat crap, dude. I beat the crap out of that eight things I learned last night Tim Stone 1:17 so here's how here's Okay, so there's a woman, an unnamed woman. We don't know her name. Let's call her. Let's call her Sue. Okay. It was it like a winter, early 2000s. She has a vacation home in Central Maine. Like a cabin in the woods. And she's having family out from out of state they're going to stay in the cabin and they're going to have a great weekend together. And so earlier that week, she decides to drive up to the cabin to go into the house and kind of get things prepped. Jaron Myers 1:50 I've seen this horror movie Tim Stone 1:52 it's not a horror movie. How does it end? Let's see your prediction. See what actually goes on the cat madlib Jaron Myers 1:57 goes over the cabin? Yeah, right during the week. Yeah it's a named scary movies always start with like the best house you've ever seen. They literally ruin your dreams of like living in like a good remote location. Yeah, just like oh my gosh, man. All this nature around and then nightfalls and you don't see anything? Like four feet past your house. Tim Stone 2:19 Yep. I hate that's like the stalker episode. Dave. Jaron Myers 2:21 Yes. Yeah, so Anyway, she's out there. This cabin goes up in that cabin. And in the middle of the night you just hear Unknown Speaker 2:31 or is Jaron Myers 2:33 that a door? It's like, do you think it is? Like what's scary? Is he goes out a door. And then you and your Oh, the raccoons are pretty crazy out there. You know, but that's that's another scary movie trope is that it's always like some some noise outside. Yeah, and and it's like freakin just, it's something else. It's like a raccoon. Yeah, yeah. Tim Stone 3:01 Put the killer put a raccoon in the trash to throw Jaron Myers 3:04 the brilliance of this serial killer. Speaker 2 3:07 They call him the raccoon killer. Do they? But it's weird because he doesn't kill the raccoons. Yeah, it's pretty Jaron Myers 3:17 confusing. He really wants to clarify that. But he only clarifies it to his victims Unknown Speaker 3:22 who he didn't kill. He's like, he's like, I don't kill raccoons. Jaron Myers 3:24 I don't kill raccoons. I kill people. Frickin. Tim Stone 3:28 But what's crazy about it is he's also a raccoon. Jaron Myers 3:30 But he kills him with a raccoon. And that's like, what is also a little the world's sharpest. It's a taxidermy rack. Unknown Speaker 3:41 Like a fan. Jaron Myers 3:44 Yeah, it's a lot of fears. A little strange. But anyway, so she's got this cabin in the woods. Tim Stone 3:50 Yeah. And so she's having family out and she Jaron Myers 3:53 survives the week. Tim Stone 3:57 She's having family out. So she says I'm gonna drive up on like Thursday night. I'm gonna get everything ready. So she goes to the store, she picks up a bunch of groceries, stalks up the fridge, and is getting ready for this thing leaves that evening goes home. And then Saturday, they come back out Saturday afternoon, they get there. And she opens up the fridge. The fridge is empty. And she opens it and closes it and still empty closes it opens it still empty closes it three times. And her husband. Her husband notices she's doing this and she's like, he's like, That's peculiar. That's weird. I'm doing that quickly goes to the junk drawer and starts checking the flashlights. Jaron Myers 4:38 He pulls it open, close. Close there. It turns out they've all just got weird OCD. Tim Stone 4:48 He opens up the junk drawer and started checking the flashlights. All of them have no batteries. So they got to the shed. The propane tanks are gone. And why did Jaron Myers 4:56 you say like that? Little pain isn't how you say You know it's propane. Unknown Speaker 5:01 That's exactly what I say. No. Tim Stone 5:06 Say it. Don't not you Alex, you say it. Jaron Myers 5:08 You said propane. That's exactly like it's a French desert. Propane. The propane? Yeah, it's a wine of the propane. Unknown Speaker 5:22 Propane paired with some dark chuck a lot. Jaron Myers 5:24 You've lived in the Midwest long enough. You gotta you gotta do propane, Speaker 2 5:27 propane propane just watch the king of the hill. Tim Stone 5:32 Anyways, so then they Jaron Myers 5:34 they're empty. Tim Stone 5:35 Yeah so this Jaron Myers 5:36 is just like our Airbnb experience paid a lot of money for that Airbnb showed up and nothing freaking work were their fingernails in the hot tub because that's mine. There Tim Stone 5:45 was a raccoon in the vents too. Jaron Myers 5:47 There was a dead animal event and we talked about our Airbnb. Oh my gosh, for our wedding. We got there and there's a bad smell. Yeah. And we called them and they were like, yeah, sometimes animals die. Like, yeah, we said what she said, I can't control where they die like she's on the phone with this with this, Airbnb. I'd be like, I don't think you put it there. Yeah, not letting me know that it's there. I'm just asking if you could get rid of this is where I think Oh, dude, when the past can drag, the pest control guy showed up. And the smell wasn't there. I was gonna burn the house. And he had his full face in the vent and was just like, Tim Stone 6:29 I don't smell anything. Jaron Myers 6:29 And then I got I was like, Come on, man. Yeah. I got down there. And I was like the vent was empty. Well, much like the flash, I opened the vent. I open the vent, close the vent, open the vent, I closed the fan. So, okay. Tim Stone 6:50 They go around, they notice all this stuff is missing. And then they come back to the house and they're standing there kind of in bewilderment. And then they lock eyes, and they look at each other. And in unison and unison. They say Christopher Thomas night. They say the North pond hermit was here. And as they say that they turned around and they noticed written on the wall and blood. It says that exact phrase. That part didn't happen. The Jaron Myers 7:15 North pond hermit Tim Stone 7:17 taunt hermit was here. So here's the here's the deal. from about 1986 to 2013, there was a community in Central Maine North pond around the north pond is what it's called. Here's a picture of it for your reference. It's a pretty, Jaron Myers 7:38 there's a little north pond right next to it. Tim Stone 7:40 I do respect that. There's a little just punt. And here's the here's a here's a satellite image that I took from Google Maps. It's Jaron Myers 7:50 a little warm with the red around it Yeah, so it's like Central lawn Southwestern Tim Stone 7:54 ish main. Not like this isn't North Main, like abandoned North Main Jaron Myers 8:02 soon abandoned domains. Yeah, North Main where you talk about fate is like a band and domain. This is the part where people are still there. Unknown Speaker 8:11 You know what I mean? Jaron Myers 8:15 Okay, but Tim Stone 8:16 in that community for 27 years, people would find they would come in their house and they would find that their groceries, their groceries were missing, but nothing of like, nothing of particular value is mostly groceries, things like batteries, propane tanks, sometimes tarps just like what you call supplies. supplies were missing. But there was no sign of force injury. Do Jaron Myers 8:42 you think they had those tubs for gasoline? Unknown Speaker 8:47 Say it again. Because only Yeah, yeah, I Tim Stone 8:50 think you're i That's exactly right Jaron Myers 8:52 tubs in the garage. Yeah, because only your sole legal. And it's like it's empty to Yeah, yeah, Tim Stone 8:58 they would. Yes. It was like someone to drank it straight out of the console. Daisy knows how much you can't drink Jaron Myers 9:08 go solely in that you can consume Speaker 2 9:09 gasoline sounds like like a weird, Jaron Myers 9:13 like a like a marinara dish. Tim Stone 9:16 It sounds like it sounds like a group of Americans who went to Italy and opened up at the Italian restaurant. They're like hello Unknown Speaker 9:27 and everyone's like SEC gasoline. Jaron Myers 9:32 Every day we joke about ideas that are actually pretty good. This spaghetti Unknown Speaker 9:35 tastes kind of Fumi Tim Stone 9:50 Oh my gosh. Jaron Myers 9:52 Oh, good. Tim Stone 9:53 Okay, so for 27 years, supplies would go missing please. Yeah, stuff will just disappear. What is interesting is there's no sign of forced entry, no broken windows, no footprint, nothing like that you can identify that someone was ever actually there and even the doors were locked, like they would come in and the doors would be locked. And they, they would go outside and like they couldn't find any footprints. Footprints. We can talk about that eventually. And so it was a very peculiar thing. They what? Go through the garage door now and go Jaron Myers 10:25 to my friend's house got broken into really they opened by my friend I mean Shama Murena, a man who apparently left his cars unlocked all the time, and someone just reached in the car, open the garage door, and stole a lot of stuff from the garage. Tim Stone 10:42 Oh my gosh, Shama. Jaron Myers 10:44 I had like a home security Tim Stone 10:46 101. Yeah, yeah, I had a lot of friends growing up who would just leave their garage doors open? Yeah, like people would just come in there. And just now, we used Jaron Myers 10:54 to do that until that one kid for the neighborhood was like kind of your ex box. Tim Stone 10:59 And I all the time. Oh, man. I made me so mad. Don't even get me started. Jaron Myers 11:02 Can I have your export? No. Yeah. That was bold, though. I mean, I almost want to give it to him just because he asked. We Tim Stone 11:09 had like, if you're listening we had like a man cave set up in our garage. We've said Jaron Myers 11:13 it before. But yeah, it was we have have we told this story. I thought so. That's held again, who cares? Tim Stone 11:18 And I was I was in there playing Xbox One day and a kid just boldly probably what eight nine? Yeah, a neighborhood child. Yeah. rode his bike into our garage like full speed road into our garage and like skin into the garage Jaron Myers 11:31 of the driveway with little black mark and everything. We did get a tennis ball and scrub it up. Tim Stone 11:35 Yeah. And I'm sitting there playing playing Xbox. And he doesn't like exchange pleasantries. doesn't ask my name doesn't do anything. For his Yeah, just says, Hey, can I have your Xbox? And I was a full blown adult at this time. Like I was what? 23? Yeah. 22. Like the boldness and it's like, Jaron Myers 11:55 I mean, he had a gun Jaron Myers 12:01 was like, guy that. Jaron Myers 12:04 I appreciate you're still asking. Unknown Speaker 12:07 know Jaron Myers 12:13 His voice was super deep. It's so good. I have that. You're like, Ah, I guess Unknown Speaker 12:19 it was actually just Jaron Myers 12:22 2017 and that was an Xbox 360 It wasn't? Tim Stone 12:27 God. Yeah, yeah. But I took a bullet for that Xbox. I got to keep it. Jaron Myers 12:32 I beat the crap out of that eight year old. I beat the crap out of that eight year old in the interim. So he so Tim Stone 12:46 people, it became this local legend that there was a North pond hermit crab that was sneaking in people's houses. Okay. No one knew who this guy was. I don't know why they labeled him as a hermit. I think it was because he was stealing supplies or like, there's gotta be someone just living in somewhere, stealing all of our stuff. And this started in the 80s. And so people for a while. Yeah, people couldn't pinpoint who he was. And then in the early 2000s, when like home security cameras started becoming more popular. A lot of the people in the town started up these whoa, Jaron Myers 13:23 guys, someone's breaking into our home. With a full television on, they're taking all our groceries. Tim Stone 13:38 And he doesn't seem concerned about the Jaron Myers 13:40 TV. He's a hermit at the Tim Stone 13:42 hermit. I mean, that is hermit crab behavior to put TVs on your head, and to find a better one, the HP hermit and so this mystery just kind of grew and grew. They started setting up these these security cameras in their homes. What was interesting, though, is in the early 2000s, when security cameras were like I call them security cameras were new. There wasn't any like, Well, I mean, there was but the majority of it wasn't much since it was just constantly recording. And so their file storage would fill up really quickly. Well, you Jaron Myers 14:18 know how? You know, my family's story was security cameras. No. So my mom worked at Subway. Yeah. And that's what the subway security system was recorded on a VHS right. And so, you know, it's just as black and white video and she has to take the VHS if something happens she's got to rewind to do all that stuff. Right? Well, she started state and my dad and I'm three years old at the time my dad is watching me one night at the house and is looking for a fun little movie to watch. And he's looking through these VHS is and and one of the VHS is it's written Charles subway. What the heck and he puts it in and it is security camera footage of my dad walking into subway. That My mom had taken to show her friends who this mystery guy was. And so she has taken it's labeled Charles subway and she's showing all of her friends. This guy that comes in and is like, I'm gonna marry this guy. And then he finds out months into a relationship with her that she's been stalking him through VHS. That's Tim Stone 15:20 through VHS. That's incredible. Honestly, we laugh at it. It's no different than Facebook stalking. But it feels way worse. Because if there's a fear, yeah, Jaron Myers 15:30 I guess it's really not different than like showing someone's Instagram and like scrolling back, here's their ex, you know, like, Tim Stone 15:35 it's that Speaker 2 15:36 guy. Yeah. Also social media is something that they've volunteered voluntarily Jaron Myers 15:41 put out. Yeah, but why wouldn't a public true Tim Stone 15:47 smile, you're on camera. So like he did no. Well, so Jaron Myers 15:51 he was a regular A and for a long time, she just because he never knew his name. So he's irregular. And she never knew his name. And she just called him my future husband. Yeah. And so he'd come in every day get Tim Stone 16:02 some waking. Unknown Speaker 16:06 It's my subway cake. Jaron Myers 16:08 This is true, too, though, is that so her coworkers were all Joe can be the Hey, your future husband came in, and then none of them ever knew his name. Yeah. And then there's a ticket giveaway, some kind of competition or something to a country concert. And she's the manager. She gives two free tickets anyway. So she sees them entering for it. And she's like, Hey, you know, I've got those tickets if you want to go, you know, that's how she got her in. Well, in the meantime, her one of her older co workers had had like a heart attack or something was in the hospital. Tim Stone 16:38 So she let me give her a VHS if you're gonna look at Jaron Myers 16:45 the IMDb Rating is crazy. Rotten Tomatoes says Certified Fresh. It says no, so she shows up to the hospital with us. Yeah. And the buyer had a second heart attack to be like, Oh, my God, you know, so that's hilarious. Yeah, now they're getting they're not. They're not my brother got married this weekend. Tim Stone 17:16 i Yeah, that's right. I was there. Yeah, Jaron Myers 17:19 I was I brought it up. He gave no indication. This whole month that he's going to be there. Do you know what happened? No, no. So my brother tells me this. We're on so many side tangents right now. Well, whatever. I don't care. My brother. We're it's his wedding week. Right? We're at this big Airbnb. He did the same thing that we did. Got the Airbnb leading up to the wedding and we got to get pizza the first night and he just I don't know where it's just like, man, our officiant backed out. And I was like, Oh, really? He's like, Yeah, so I had to hire some guy in Branson to do it. Sounds like random Branson, some Branson officiant and I was talking about I was like, I can, I'm ordained and he's like, Yeah, but only even my best man. So I was like, Tim could have done it. And he goes, it's probably too late to ask him. I was like, okay, whatever. So we get to the wedding. And then I see Tim's name on the table stuff. And so I was like, Tim Berry were invited to this. Not like, I guess, you know, like, Okay, sure. Keynes's says inviting my friend's wedding. I like that. It's so so I look up Tim's location. He's there. And I was like, You didn't tell me we're coming to this wedding. And he's like, oh, yeah, I just wasted no, we're gonna make it or whatever. And I'm even telling Bri I'm telling Bree that the officiant has backed out. I was like the officiant Panko. They just hired some random and she's like, Oh, really? That's pretty crazy. Well, so then we're lining up, and I go to walk down the aisle in my dress. But Tim's freaking officiating their wedding? And has known about this for months. Yeah, Tim Stone 18:56 we planted the night of your wedding. It's so immediately after you Jaron Myers 19:00 said the kingdom has it wouldn't be pretty funny if Tim married both of us. Tim Stone 19:04 I did it was pretty fun, did it? It was it was so stressful because I don't think I don't think we did a good job with planning our, our side story for you. Jaron Myers 19:15 You know, I don't know why. He said I never questioned it. I never even I just assumed Tim Stone 19:20 you would have been like who's officiating rehearsal. Jaron Myers 19:23 The person who was officiating was not there. Yeah. And I was like, I would have thought you would have sniffed it out. I was like, Is your officiant not here? Like usually they're here for the rehearsal part. Yeah. Yeah. And he's acknowledged they couldn't make it tonight. And I was like, Okay, I don't know. Interesting, Tim Stone 19:38 but I pulled it I pulled in the parking lot. And you guys were taking pictures. I wondered Jaron Myers 19:42 why you were in a minute black suit and bray was you're putting on a whole tie. I was like, do for my brother's wedding like Tim Stone 19:48 and I was. I was struggling with that tie. Because I was surfing barbecue, bro. You made a joke about it. You're like, Have you ever tied a tie before? But I was so stressed because I was like, I was like, he knows he knows what's happening right now and I'm trying to tie this tie and act cool, but I'm like he knows he knows. I'm like I'm giving it away right now. Jaron Myers 20:04 I did not know. And I couldn't get that. Her best Easter outfit Jaron Myers 20:13 Oh, now you're back on topic Jaron Myers 20:21 good. Yeah. Tim Stone 20:23 I saw, I saw you and I drove right past to try to like pull into the parking lot to where you couldn't see us. Jaron Myers 20:29 And you would stand there look, and I went, No, I look at your car. And I was like, What are they doing? And then I honestly figured you were changing. So I was like, I'm gonna give him some space. I walked back inside. Yeah. And then I was like, This is too much time. Tim Stone 20:44 Yeah, I was like, we just need to camp out here. Jaron Myers 20:49 You're like, Oh, hey. Oh, hey, what's up, man? Oh, I had no idea. The whole time was crazy. You guys pull it off as great and impressive. And you married him speaking? Tim Stone 21:01 I did. We're married now. Congrats. Hey, thanks for watching this episode of things I learned last night. If you're enjoying this, let me recommend one of my favorites. Emperor Norton. It's this dude who just decided he was the emperor of the United States. No one agreed. But some people did agree. It was weird. You should check it out as a lot of fun. But other than that, thanks for being here. Tim Stone 21:33 Speaking of pulling it off, so they got these cameras. And because they were early cameras with us, people would have to go and they would have to pull out the VHS and erase it. If it like check to see if they got any footage of him in there and erase it and then put it back in. So not a lot of footage was captured in these early years. Right. A Jaron Myers 21:55 time where people were VHS recording their shows. That's like how you Tim Stone 21:59 Yeah, TiVo? Tivo came out. Jaron Myers 22:01 That's how you DVR stuff. Tim Stone 22:03 Yeah. DVR. Interesting. That's an interesting time. That was I still DVR stuff sometimes just for like, I don't ever watch it. It's just no I don't I don't ever plan on going back and watching it. It's just for like, a habit. Yeah, it's the experience of like, let me go set that recording. Yeah. It there's something about it's quaint. Yeah. In 2007 they caught the first footage of the North pond hermit going through. It was like a local community center. Okay. Jaron Myers 22:35 Oh, no. 2012 the black and white footage just makes it spooky. As it is. Yeah. So 2012 Tim Stone 22:41 This was actually 2012 I was off on the date. Yeah, by like a lot. Jaron Myers 22:45 That's all right. Going through the community center. So just a normal dude. Tim Stone 22:50 Yeah, it looks like it just super normal dude. And then after this, they start capturing him on footage a lot. Because around this is when people started getting security cameras that could save to the cloud. Sure you and they had motion sensor, so you could record 24/7 They started to figure it out. There was some patterns. Okay, he would show up primarily on overcast evenings. And he would show up primarily at homes at vacation homes, where people weren't at their vacation home. Such as the overcast matter. It does. And we can get to that in a second. logic Jaron Myers 23:23 to the moon. Unknown Speaker 23:24 He was he was AWARE. AWARE. Tim Stone 23:27 Well, yeah. If the moon's out and he comes in your house, you'll notice he's very hairy. Unknown Speaker 23:34 There is signs of Whoa. Unknown Speaker 23:38 Am I ever X Box? Unknown Speaker 23:41 I guess. Yeah. If you ask. You're Jaron Myers 23:43 a seven foot monster. You can ask anything you want. Tim Stone 23:47 What do you want? You want the Xbox deal? He plays a lot of Call of Duty that Jaron Myers 23:53 the black ops not even like a new one. He's still trying to play online. No one plays, plays it was just him. Yeah. And one other guy Unknown Speaker 24:01 gets real mad. Tim Stone 24:09 So they start catching them on on more and more footage. Okay. And they they pick up these patterns. And eventually, because by this time, this has been going on for 20 plus years. Yeah. And so the local police department Jaron Myers 24:22 he's like, it looks like he's like in his probably 50s 60s And Tim Stone 24:25 he's an older man. Yeah. And so the local police department and that's Jaron Myers 24:29 great because like we're not even 30 Yet, you know, I guess it's good to remember that you didn't start that until he was like in his 30s Yeah, maybe early 40s You know Yeah, yeah. So there's a whole second life we can live. Speaker 2 24:43 We can go be hermits if we want. We can dominate Jaron Myers 24:48 the frickin whole community abandoned part of Maine Speaker 2 24:54 Hello, abandoned domain. It's me. Your new hermit Hello. Jaron Myers 24:58 We have Have I am the emperor of this place. Tim Stone 25:05 I mean, you probably could. And I am Jaron Myers 25:07 the main guy. main Speaker 2 25:09 man of Maine. I'm the main main man. Yeah. Jaron Myers 25:18 So he grow my hair out my main. You know, I was gonna Tim Stone 25:23 make that joke, but I was like, Okay, we could leave it. And then so the local police department they call the Department of Homeland Security and they're like, Hey, we're getting burglarized like crazy up here. Jaron Myers 25:36 They call the Homeland Security and Department of they call a pentagon. Hey, guys, we don't really know what to do with this. We're gonna go call the local police. Okay, we're the pusher. Okay. Sure. Tim Stone 25:52 Yeah, we talked to them and they said they don't care. Speaker 3 25:55 They said they don't like they were. They were alright. Is it? Tim Stone 25:59 Oh, find somewhere else to go but eat him up. Jaron Myers 26:03 We don't care. We don't Tim Stone 26:05 care. So the department Homeland Security was like, Okay, we'll send you a care package. And Jaron Myers 26:11 they sent you post about us. Use the hashtag gifted. Make sure Unknown Speaker 26:17 you open up with hashtag add, Jaron Myers 26:18 you know, there you go. Tim Stone 26:19 Hashtag add things to the Department of Homeland Security for sponsoring this post. Jaron Myers 26:28 unbox this package from Homeland Security with me. We've been having some recent strings of burglaries. Get Ready With Me Get Ready With Me to capture the local Jaron Myers 26:44 I like this. Unknown Speaker 26:47 So they can Jaron Myers 26:50 do that video for that lady. Yeah. Tim Stone 26:54 That's a good that's a good bit. I like it. You need to write a note for that real quick. Save it in your phone. Do a voicemail. Jaron Myers 27:00 That's exactly what I was doing. Dang it, Tim. Tim Stone 27:02 I do voice memos. Whenever I have book ideas. We can listen to one of the after the fiddle. Jaron Myers 27:07 Get Ready With Me to capture that lady. It's a video that I'm you know, the Homeland Security sent me a box and unboxing video. All right. Let's see. I recorded one this morning. What do I got here? People have thought I was 30 Since I was in the seventh grade. When I was a youth pastor. I got in trouble for flirting with the college girls and a camp but I was they were older than I was. Took that in the shower. Tim Stone 27:46 So they get this package. They open it up. And they're surprised to find that it's a bunch of smoke detectors. Like what are we going to do with all these smoke detectors to call up the Homeland Security and Jaron Myers 27:55 set them on fire? Oh, you're gonna torch the for sure. We watched the footage. Tim Stone 28:03 And they're like they're like idiots. Those are the smoke detectors with cameras. They're hidden cameras set them up in everybody's house who's getting burglarized their motion sensors they will start capturing say the footage the camera will alert you and they're like you thought you wanted us to help Jaron Myers 28:19 sorry, hold your hand and explain this to you. So they set up this is smoke detectors and pins What am I gonna write notes their cameras their camera wear them in the meeting? Tim Stone 28:32 What am I supposed to do with this bomb? Jaron Myers 28:35 This very sophisticated Speaker 2 28:37 it's such a sophisticated like it's so good. I don't know what to do with Bombay I have the Bombay petroleum consoling please Tim Stone 28:57 so they started setting up all these these choke detectors in people's houses. Yeah. And one of them trips. This is in 2013 And so the police they rushed this house and they find Jaron Myers 29:10 this guy oh my gosh. creepier than he was in the first one Christopher Thomas night also he could out read those cops Yeah, Unknown Speaker 29:21 well this is this is this is made between Tim Stone 29:23 court. So this isn't like the actual day he got caught there. Oh, we have no pictures of when he got caught. All right. So this is him going to court. I don't think those I'm gonna Jaron Myers 29:32 send a link to those that police department say I'm going to send them our job headstock guys had is way too small for his head. And he needs to know but he isn't gonna live like that. You know? Yeah, he looks like a Unabomber guy. You know? He Tim Stone 29:46 does. He does. So they obviously they take them back to the police station. They start interviewing him. And he's like, Jaron Myers 29:54 Yeah, I've been stealing. He confesses Tim Stone 29:56 to well over 1000 burglaries Holy Cow over the course of 27 years. And he leads them to his camp. So he has a camp in the middle of the woods. We have pictures of it. Yes, we do. He has a camp deep in the middle of the woods. And it's interesting listening to the description of this camp from the police officers that he escorted up there. Because they said that this camp is in a part of the woods that they called the GRC. GRC up there. It's pretty darn good. Careful. They said the deer don't even go there. They said because it's too thick it like it's too dense to get through. Okay, so he's in a clearing is where he set up his camp. But they said to get through it. There's not game trails, there's not actual trails, like you're literally like crawling through bushes the whole way through to get in there. And then he found a clearing deep within these bushes and set up a camp. This is actually on private property. And he had been living here for 27 years. And no one knew. Jaron Myers 31:03 You you thought of that joke way earlier. He's got like, he's got trash cans. Yeah, in this picture. You see spray paints weird stuff on like, why does he spray paint this stuff? Like who's that? Well, wait till you see my art. Tim Stone 31:20 Okay, these clotheslines had been set up for so long that the tree has been around around them. Yeah, yeah. And I still have grown into the tree. Yeah, they're grown into the tree. And they're actually higher than here initially set them up. Like you notice those are pretty high clotheslines, because the trees grown. That's why not crazy. And so here's here's the story of what happened. They were like, they're like, What? How did you get here? Is this show? I think so. Jaron Myers 31:45 So he's up there and like, yeah, yeah. Tim Stone 31:50 I mean, it's like Central Maine. So here's, here's what happened. Hey, in January 1986. He had he, he was in his early 20s. And he grew up in an interesting home. He grew up in Massachusetts, and a lower middle class family. And their family was strange to say the least, they would for fun study thermodynamics. As a family, they'd be like a tonight's activity is thermodynamics. And they were just get some library books and learn about thermodynamics. And they built to a greenhouse in their backyard. And they discovered that if you buried gallons of water, then it stayed a good temperature longer. And so they buried 1000 gallons of water in their backyard to get it away. So they could keep their greenhouse watered without having to use tap water. So they could save money in the winter. Which seems like a very nominal savings. Yeah. Jaron Myers 32:49 I spent. I spent 30 days in a row, burying 1002 gallons of water. And not even big tubs like Speaker 2 32:59 individual gallons. They're actually quarts, so I could save Jaron Myers 33:03 $13. And there's like no one else. Like no one else. Tim Stone 33:12 There's a picture of him in high school. He was he was a kid that didn't really get along with anybody that have any kids friends. And after high school, he moved to Florida for a little bit where he worked at a mechanic shop, and then saved up to buy himself a Subaru. And he drove that Subaru hatchback from Florida to Maine until he just got tired of driving. And then he got out of his car. And he set his keys in his center console. And he walked into the woods until he found that spot. January 1986. This is a crazy person and he stayed there for 27 years worth of the cargo. I I'm assuming at some point someone found it and was like, well tow that I guess. I don't know. He has no idea what happened in the car. What's really interesting about this, okay, none of his friends. None of his family ever filed the missing persons report. They were just like, yeah, he's gone now. Yeah, he it's been 20 years. We haven't Jaron Myers 34:09 moved to Maine. Well, I mean, by that time, like you don't know that someone's not doing something. You know, if someone says Am I'm leaving town, I'm gonna go make a new life. You just go. Alright, I'll never see you again. Tim Stone 34:19 Well, no, this is the 86 like you would probably expect your son would call you at least once. Jaron Myers 34:26 I don't like to if someone goes like, hey, you know, I'm moving to like, I mean, why? If you're a person who's like, I'm just gonna drive it that feels like there's some conflict or something happened that made you want to flee that life. You know, that's Tim Stone 34:39 what it seems like. And so that's what's interesting is they interviewed him. And he's like, No, I was just bored one day. Yeah, they're like, there's three reasons typically that people do this. You're on the run. It's religious reasons. They go out to like meditate and pursue religion. And it was like panic attack Jaron Myers 34:52 about the development of the world and they're very afraid of new technology and they just want to become a recluse. Yeah, or you got warrants? Tim Stone 35:01 Yeah, yeah. Or you're like running from something like hiding from something or someone or like, yeah, yeah. And they asked him about that he was not a religious person, he was an atheist. And so they're like, well, that's not why he was there. They asked him like, if how he felt about society. He said, he doesn't really have a problem with it. He just wanted to be I Jaron Myers 35:17 don't know how to turn out. Tim Stone 35:20 And then they asked him if he was he wasn't. So all those three main reasons you wouldn't typically, like find someone to do this. It wasn't him. Okay, ask them. They're like, so why did you do that? And he's like, I just don't know. I just did. And Jaron Myers 35:33 oh, okay. Tim Stone 35:36 So he didn't have a good motive for doing it. And the police never got a good motive out of him for why he did it. Sure. So they started asking him about his experience, like how it was, and he was like, well, he said, the first few months I was up there, like I started out by like, foraging and like getting food from plants and like, trying to kill him. He didn't kill him. Kill. Yeah. And he said, but that sucked. And so he had no way. He had a moral dilemma, because he didn't believe in stealing, like he didn't want to steal. But he also was like, This is great. And so he decided, I'll start some light burglary, I'll just take food. And I'll just take supplies when I need to survive. And I'll only take it from vacation homes. So those people are rich, you know, whatever, who cares? They have a second home. So he would sneak in and take only what he needed. Jaron Myers 36:29 Get it, brother. I'm with you. Tim Stone 36:33 And then take it back to his camp and survive in the camp. What's interesting if you watch him, it's Jaron Myers 36:40 I don't think I could be a homeless person. Okay, I thought about this. Yeah. Like it, you know, because people give. We've never made it home for a restaurant without giving our leftovers to somebody. Yeah. But I was like, Man, I don't like beans. You know, like if someone gave me a Chipotle burrito, and they're like, Hey, I caught you this I'd be like thanks. And they would leave Tim Stone 37:07 Yeah. Star it'll follow them to their car and throw it on Jaron Myers 37:19 there this has happened before. Where it happened to Reagan. She tried to give like a like a granola bar. Yeah. To a guy in Los Angeles. He literally took it and he went oats and honey Unknown Speaker 37:38 you don't get to be picky. Yeah, how much cholesterol Jaron Myers 37:44 doing dude? I couldn't do that. Tim Stone 37:46 Trying to get my macros bro. Jaron Myers 37:49 McDonald's, come on. You're like okay, sorry. Just trying to give you calories man. Tim Stone 37:56 So, he Jaron Myers 37:58 I couldn't eat roadkill. I couldn't do that. But honestly, it's if I break it rich ever been to a rich person's home? Yeah. Tim Stone 38:06 almondmilk college we stayed at that rich person's home when we were on tour. And I Jaron Myers 38:10 gotta say that we can say my ex girlfriends. We don't gotta be like, we don't gotta be like, ooh, caller was there that rich person's Yeah, my ex. Unknown Speaker 38:18 And literally I couldn't find anything to eat so I thought Jaron Myers 38:24 we just ate cookies dude because all their food sucked all their food was like freakin like here's here's salted soy beans are one of the rich people eat crap dude. Some crackers with 15 calories. I don't want that. Unknown Speaker 38:43 I need more calories. Speaker 2 38:44 Me Ritz crackers. Give me the real stuff. Give me the goods margarita mix the hard stuff. Tim Stone 38:58 He what was interesting is he exhibited some things that seemed like he was trained for this. And I'll tell you, I'll tell you why. Jaron Myers 39:08 Here his siblings? Tim Stone 39:10 I actually don't know. I haven't. Yeah, think about that. Jaron Myers 39:13 They're in the woods, or in some other ones. So I'm saying do you think is do you think his parents were like his parents? Hey, Tim Stone 39:19 in January 1986, they got all the four siblings together and they said it's your time. Now we see who can make the time Jaron Myers 39:26 when the four siblings live together a piece. And then the Fire Nation attacked. Tim Stone 39:32 This was this was the way they said whoever survives the longest gets the inheritance. How will we know? We'll see. That's how good your instincts are. Yeah, you'll know. Jaron Myers 39:45 And he's like, freak, I know he's out there. Hey, thanks for being part of this episode. If you want to help us do more of this, you want to help us grow our show. One of the easiest and best ways to do that is to join our Patreon It's a way for you to financially support the show. And you get a lot in return, you get access to our Discord channel, you get bonus content that comes out, you get exclusive merchandise and like live zoom hangouts where we're both just hanging out eating pizza, just getting to know each other. The biggest thing is, is we want to know you more as an individual and as a friend. So thanks for supporting our show. If you don't support us financially, we're not pressed about it. We're not like mad, but I'll find you. So text tilam to 66866, to keep yourself from being found. All right, because if you don't I want you. Tim Stone 40:37 That's like when, when Tony and Michelle laughed, and they said, when we said, Jaron Myers 40:42 Yeah, we were like, are you guys gonna open another Chinese restaurant? And Tony just goes, you'll know. Tim Stone 40:50 We had a favorite Chinese restaurant in Springfield, and the owners, they got deported. So they just shut the store down. Is that what happened? Well, they didn't technically, they know that they couldn't renew their green card. They wouldn't let them renew their green card. So they essentially, the building owner Jaron Myers 41:05 wouldn't make the updates to the building that needed to happen. And they didn't have the money to do it. Interesting. And so because that new players came in, and they remodeled the whole thing. Yeah. Because there was a lot of updates that had to Tim Stone 41:18 had needed to happen. I didn't know that. I thought it was I heard that they had to leave. Yeah, it was Jaron Myers 41:24 also someone racist. Who told you that? It could have been probably Tim Stone 41:29 part of this. I do. Remember they said they were going back to Australia. Jaron Myers 41:32 I won't say we're going to Australia, but yeah. What? Why did they go to Australia? That's Tim Stone 41:38 where they're from? That's not where they're Jaron Myers 41:39 from? Yeah, Tim Stone 41:40 that's what Tony said. Tony said they were from Australia. They're not from Australia. Yes, they are. 100% 100% they were. They might not be originally from Australia. That's where they were before here. Jaron Myers 41:52 Don't they have a daughter? Yes. And she lives in Australia. Yes. So they're going to with their daughter in Australia. Tim Stone 41:58 They've lived in Australia before that, though. Sure. Anyways, well, they're Jaron Myers 42:02 not clear. They're definitely not from Australia. Speaker 2 42:07 I they could be. They could be No, put them in a box. Speaker 3 42:13 It was very cryptic. We, we talked. We were like, Tim Stone 42:17 we'd like He's like, he's like, we'll be back. He's like, we'll be back. And we're like, Tony, we asked him for his number. We said, Can I have your number so you can let us know when you're back or something like that. He literally Jaron Myers 42:26 was like, you'll know. Unknown Speaker 42:27 It was the last thing he ever said Jaron Myers 42:30 is, you know, his sister owns we could ask his sister. She owns the cashew station on Camp. Battlefield. Tim Stone 42:36 That's what I thought happened. I thought we went and talked to her. And she told us Oh, yeah, they they couldn't get their green cards for needed and they had to Jaron Myers 42:44 be there. We did ask, we need to go. So our favorite restaurant was chopsticks. And me and my best friend. Were sitting here talking about chopsticks. And they told us they were going to open something new eventually. And I was just like, Do you know anything about that? Speaker 3 43:02 No, I can ask for you really quick though. That would be awesome. No, they are not as far as I know. Okay. Jaron Myers 43:12 Dang. Okay. Did they did they move to like Australia? That's what we're trying to figure out the rumors that we heard trust earlier. All right, well, we're big fans. So in some capacity lessons that we miss. Speaker 4 43:26 Karaoke chicken and beef. We do make that here. Okay. Are you forever No, we did not. Unknown Speaker 43:37 Okay. All right. Jaron Myers 43:41 Well, thank you so much that that helped us a lot. Yeah Unknown Speaker 43:49 that's incredible. They did Tim Stone 43:54 I vindicated Tim Stone 44:02 okay. So he exhibited like someone who was trained Unknown Speaker 44:20 bro, this episode is off though. Jaron Myers 44:26 It's very in the weeds, if you will. Geez, man. Tim Stone 44:32 So yeah, he exhibited traits, like someone who was trained. Okay. So one of the things that they found out right away is that he picked the locks to the houses that he broke into. And he when he left, he picked them back locked. So he would go back out and he would pick them into being locked. Like reverse pick, you know, I'm saying, Oh, okay. Yeah. So he would lock up with his lock bits. That's nice. And so early on in the early 80s. You could tell like, there was like scratches stuff all over the locks because he was rusty grayed out it Yeah. And then he got pretty good and so no one could even tell like there was tampering, and he would pick his way into the locks. There was one sighting of him that they brought up. Someone cited him in the 90s. Jaron Myers 45:15 And he's like, Yeah, I'm pretty blurry in that picture, though. Unknown Speaker 45:20 Nobody better pictures of me. Jaron Myers 45:22 I mean, like, they put that out there. They're like, we found them. And I was like, did they? And then there was like a whole team that came out from Discovery Channel, and they were like, they were like, I don't think they're looking for me. Speaker 3 45:35 I grabbed back a couple of times. But yeah, that really spoke to me. Jaron Myers 45:41 There was town meetings. Speaker 2 45:43 Yeah, I think they, nevermind. Unknown Speaker 45:48 They, so that was the sign of Jaron Myers 45:50 never going out when the moon's out again. Tim Stone 45:56 There's a sighting of the 90s. They said, Hey, so in the 90s, some Hunter said that they saw someone walking across the street. But that kind of fits your profile. And they said, but they were walking backwards. Full speed. And they're like, was that you? And he's like, oh, yeah, that's me. He's like, I walk backwards everywhere I go. Unknown Speaker 46:19 They were like, well, why? Unknown Speaker 46:25 Because it's funny. Jaron Myers 46:30 Oh, why did they work backwards? Oh yeah, they just do that in Australia. They work backwards. Unknown Speaker 46:39 Yeah, it's kind of like driving on the left side of the road. I walk backwards. Jaron Myers 46:43 That's the same thing to say. So the reason the the more you the more questions you get answered us go. Speaker 3 46:50 Oh, I understand now. Now I get it. Oh, man. Jaron Myers 46:55 We should just release him. Wait. This guy buddy. Slowly backs away from the jail. That's the thing. He's like I'm so he's like, Can I walk backwards? Can I please like, can Tim Stone 47:11 you please turn around? Jaron Myers 47:16 Well, that's freaking weird. Now. He's not walking. Paradise song. Tim Stone 47:20 The important thing is they clarified he's not walking slowly. He's not like moonwalking. He is full speed walking backwards. Like, let's do Jaron Myers 47:30 that in this footage too. Because imagine, oh my gosh. Imagine you rewind your VHS, right. You're like, something's happened. Something's Afoot. And you rewind it. And you just see some of you just see your front door open and you go the other way stuck and rewind. Like what is happening? And he's just across your house. What did he say? Why? Tim Stone 47:58 Yeah, so the reason for that is he said in case I left footprints, people would think I was going the other way. Would they? Well, if your your toes are facing that direction, and you're going that direction, Jaron Myers 48:15 I know this guy's got a weird gait, I guess. Okay. Tim Stone 48:22 So yeah, he walked backwards everywhere I went, but then he started learning to do overcast the reason why he would do overcast is because it would rain and it wash away its footprints and so the evidence would be gone that he was there. Oh, man. Yeah. So Jaron Myers 48:35 you know what else got washed away Tim Stone 48:42 your Jesus walked backwards in every town. He went to Jaron Myers 48:48 those footprints in the sand. That's where I was walking now. Tim Stone 48:54 Don't go that way. Nothing happened to that direction. Nothing happened over there. Do you don't need to worry about it. I walk Jaron Myers 48:59 as far as the east is from the west. Go east. This is too many Bible jokes. I'm sorry YouTube commenter who's upset about the number of Bible jokes we make. So, Tim Stone 49:13 um, and then he never lit a campfire, because he didn't want the smoke to attract sure he came. But here's the thing he is in Maine, is that through winters? The propane was for cooking. He did not use any source like a fire for heat. Instead what he would do is in the winters when it will get down to sub zero temperatures, he would wake up in the middle of night and he would walk to keep his body heat up. And he would just walk around his camp Jaron Myers 49:46 backwards so that way he'd be able to Tim Stone 49:49 take taken lapse. Yeah, I found out that the thermodynamics Jaron Myers 49:53 worked better. Wait till you see that on the trail cam. I don't know what's worse the Skinwalker or if it's just freaking Tim Stone 50:05 you think that supernatural if you see it, like you don't see that and think that that's a normal human, you think that's a ghost or a demon or something in subzero temperatures walking backwards in the, in the woods. Okay, but he did it, he survived, he would fatten himself up every fall so he can make it to the winter. And so it's interesting, especially towards the end when they started capturing more footage of him. In the fall, he was really really chunky in the in the spring, he was very skinny. Because he would fatten himself up to make it through the winter. Jaron Myers 50:37 Like a bear, bear. So Tim Stone 50:40 pretty good survival instincts. Seems like he was trained. Jaron Myers 50:44 That's what I'm doing to. Tim Stone 50:47 Oh, I'm just prepping for the winter. I'm just putting on my winter meat. Jaron Myers 50:53 It's the worst thing I've ever heard you say? Putting on my winter meat. That's gross. Tim Stone 51:01 So yeah, so they, they arrested him. They, they interviewed him and they he took them, they took them to trial. And it was a six month on trial. So he's in jail through that whole trial cheese. And we heard a lot of cases 1000 cases of burglary and a ton of cases of trespassing, especially on the property that yeah, lived on. They said that there was several 100 Perhaps even 1000 propane tanks around his camp that he's never been exposed video. Yeah, he just threw him who it would be empty. Just throw up. And so like, it's really interesting. I can't find an actual picture this I saw on a documentary, a quick shot panning out there be free and it is insane. It looks insane. It's literally 1000s of propane tanks just like peeking out of the dirt. Like because the ground has just grown around. And like it's just tanks as far as the eye can see. It's bonkers. Wow, I'm really Jaron Myers 51:57 turned into promain Unknown Speaker 52:01 Welcome to pro may Jaron Myers 52:03 not I'll say like that. Sorry. promain. Tim Stone 52:06 You know, I heard that there was a big outbreak with romaine lettuce. Jaron Myers 52:11 I want to end this. So Tim Stone 52:13 they went to this log trial. And the public was divided on him. Some people will Jaron Myers 52:20 remember like he's just fiver was just let them any like entirely got something wrong with because there were some people Tim Stone 52:23 who were started putting signs on their front door that said, Please don't break in. Just tell us what you need them. We'll leave it on the doorstep. Yeah. And so like, there are some people that he was kind of like a folk hero, honestly, in the community, but then some people hate it. Like some people felt very violated. Because I mean, it is he's stealing from you so and he's walking backwards. And so during his testimony, he was asked, he said, he said how much contact have you had with the outside world? And he said, Well, I have a radio. So he's like, I know who the Kardashians are. And they have pity on him Jaron Myers 52:59 with the Kardashians or even famous on the radio, Tim Stone 53:03 it's crazy that this man did not have contact with another human for 27 years and still knew who they are. But no, he didn't say there was one he's like, Jaron Myers 53:13 they're actually the main reason I didn't come down. I thought about coming down in like 2012. But then I heard about who Kanye and Kim were, I was like, I'm gonna stay Tim Stone 53:22 I'm gonna stay out here. He said there was there was two instances in the course of the 27 years where he spoke to someone. One of them he was on a trail and he passed another hiker, and they just said, Hi. And he was like, Hi. Unknown Speaker 53:38 And they're like, Hi. Tim Stone 53:48 And then there was a fisherman who was fishing at the pond and so on. And he said, please leave me alone. And the guy said, no problem. The Hermit said that. No. He said to the fishermen, he said, please leave me alone. And fishermen said no problem. Jaron Myers 54:04 If you didn't say anything, I wasn't going to Speaker 3 54:06 Yeah, honestly, the fact that you asked me to leave you alone makes me want to not leave you alone. Curious. It seems like you're doing something wrong Jaron Myers 54:12 there. I was in the bathroom the other day. The next day, the urinal. Hey, can we not talk? Unknown Speaker 54:19 I wasn't planning on it. I Jaron Myers 54:20 didn't know. I wasn't gonna say Unknown Speaker 54:21 was it? Yeah, Jaron Myers 54:22 we're here. Yeah. Tim Stone 54:24 You started the conversation, even though it was an opener Jaron Myers 54:27 Christopher Thomas night. Tim Stone 54:30 What if I just walked backwards out of this bathroom? How far away? Do Jaron Myers 54:34 you think I could stand for this thing? Please leave me alone. No problem. Tim Stone 54:42 So 27 years. That was the only contact he had with other humans. That's like eight words. Please leave me alone. Not five words. Five words. One hand with the words alright. In and 27 years. bonkers, Jaron Myers 54:57 you know he's talking to the trees out there. Oh, 100% Tim Stone 55:00 Yeah, he was bargaining with them. He's like, he's like you guys need this quick wrong. I can almost not reach my clotheslines anymore, guys. Jaron Myers 55:05 This isn't a fun game. Unknown Speaker 55:11 I keep telling the trees to stop taking Jaron Myers 55:12 like the trees away and monkey in the middle with me. I'm sorry, what? Trees, way monkey in the middle with me. And I never get to be Unknown Speaker 55:22 in the trees. The trees think we're still monkeys. Jaron Myers 55:25 The trees are mean to me. Okay. Tim Stone 55:31 The other day I was walking out of my cap, the tree came up behind me and it's pulled my backpack straps real tight. It's in Jaron Myers 55:40 the woods, little turtle. And I was like, artists do that backwards. Tim Stone 55:51 So the jury, the jury, I don't know if it was because they felt bad for him or if they just didn't think his crimes were that bad. But they sent him sentenced him to seven months. And he had already served six. So he served one more month after the court and then he got rehabilitated into society. He had court mandated mandated therapy he had a day for I think was three Jaron Myers 56:14 years that got him an apartment. He slept in the carport. Tim Stone 56:18 Yeah, he moved into a small town in Maine. And he works as a mechanic there and he's still there mechanic thing. And he's still walks backwards. Jaron Myers 56:31 I don't want people to know where I'm going. Unknown Speaker 56:32 I don't want anyone to know where I go. Here's Tim Stone 56:38 I think I want to read a quote to you from the police officer who arrested him, okay, because it will just listen to this. Listen to this quote. It says it says as the officer couldn't help but be amazed at the way he moved through the forest. He described him as moving like a cat silently with agility, grace and dexterity. I am pretty sure there's a scene in a documentary where one of the officers who arrested him, they he captivated all the officers that arrested them. One of the officers, female cop, that's an important note. She She went as far as to choose describing how impressed she was with him and his survival capabilities. Okay. And then she talked about how after he got arrested, there's a few times where she visited him in jail. And she was like, I don't know. She paused her story in the middle of her story, and said and I need to say like we had a professional relationship. Like I only spoke to him if I had a reason to be speaking to them. And I was like, that Unknown Speaker 57:40 is very sad. Unknown Speaker 57:43 The facts Yeah, that you Jaron Myers 57:44 were just I do need to say it's true professional. Tim Stone 57:48 You're talking about how impressive he was. I Jaron Myers 57:51 mean, his legs just shoot, too and the eye contact the whole time as he ran away. Speaker 2 58:02 Just strictly professional, strictly professional relationships. Tim Stone 58:09 But he was amazing. He was Jaron Myers 58:11 he stole more than just some food. He's stolen my heart it was Tim Stone 58:21 very suspect very suspect, huh. And I think that that might have something to do with his short sentence. I don't know. I'm just conjecture here. Oh, okay. Anyways, so that's that's the North pond Herman Christopher Thomas Knight. Most impressive people who lived in the woods for 27 years. Jaron Myers 58:37 That's crazy. Fall deaf. What that's a fiddle off backwards. Tim Stone 58:48 Things either last night is a production of space Tim medium produced by Christian Taylor audio by Alex Garnett video by Connor bets, our graphics and our logo by Caleb Goldberg and our social media is run by Caleb Walker. Our hosts are Jeremiah and Tim stone. Follow us on your favorite social media platform at tilam podcast is Ti LL and podcast. Remember to tell all your friends about us and we'll see you next Tuesday for another episode of things I learned last night. Transcribed by

In the heart of the Maine wilderness, a tale unfolded that captured the imagination of many—the story of Christopher Thomas Knight, famously known as the North Pond Hermit. Knight’s journey into solitude and survival has left a lasting mark on the annals of unconventional living. The Vanishing Act: Christopher Thomas Knight’s Disappearance In 1986, Christopher Thomas Knight disappeared into the … Read More

Black Knight Satellite – The UFO Orbiting Earth for 13,000 Years


Episode Transcription

Made by robots, for robots. Only read if you're weird.

Unknown Speaker 0:00 Hey man, what? What's up? Hey, man, thank you. Tim Stone 0:08 Have you ever heard of the Black Knight satellite? Speaker 1 0:13 No, no. Black Knight satellite? Yeah. Yes. They mentioned it in The Fairly OddParents theme song. gray goo Sokolova was Black Knight satellite Unknown Speaker 0:30 Yeah, that was pretty good right there. Tim Stone 0:32 I'm pretty impressed at how well that fits. No, it's not from that from something entirely different. Honestly. It could be in there. Sure, Speaker 1 0:38 but it isn't there. I don't think that's where I know from I think it's Grey Goose Tim Stone 0:42 is what you're thinking of. Unknown Speaker 0:44 No, Greg Tim Stone 0:45 is not a goose is in it. Grey Unknown Speaker 0:48 Goose is not. Tim Stone 0:52 I said that as an adult. I'm like, why was that it there? Speaker 1 0:55 Gray moose. Right. Green mousse. Green mousse Java juice. Shoot. I can't think of it's not Grey Goose. The Grey Goose is mentioned in Royals by Yeah, but by that girl from the ring. Tim Stone 1:12 I don't care about that. Oh, okay. Here it is. Here it is. OB tooth rubber goose green is guava juice. Unknown Speaker 1:19 Black Knight satellite. Tim Stone 1:21 It's close. giant snake birthday cake. large fries. chocolate shake. It's interesting. Cake. Unknown Speaker 1:26 Birth. Birthday cake. Tim Stone 1:28 giant snake birthday cake large Unknown Speaker 1:30 Black Knight satellite. Tim Stone 1:32 It's interesting to me. Because this is there's not another verse in the song. That is even remotely close Speaker 1 1:39 goes it goes. giant snake birthday cake. Black Knight satellite, we didn't start the fire. It's all the same. I Tim Stone 1:48 just respect that. This was very clearly he needed another verse. And was just like, Ah, Speaker 1 1:54 well, yeah, I mean, the whole song was that the fairies can make anything appear. Tim Stone 2:00 Oh, I guess that's true. And so he's giving him so he's like, Speaker 1 2:03 trying to make birthday cake. Large fry chocolate shake, Tim Stone 2:06 but but the first line obtuse? Why does he What is What does he mean getting an obtuse triangle? Like what is the Speaker 1 2:13 rest of its obtuse? Robert Q's obtuse? Roger goose? Tim Stone 2:18 No. Obtuse comma. Robert. That's a separate thing. Unknown Speaker 2:21 No, no, it shouldn't be but it is. What does it rubber use? A large rubber tooth does Tim Stone 2:28 not mean large. Urban Dictionary Speaker 1 2:34 how would you go Urban Dictionary? Why do you need to see what the kids say? What it is? Tim Stone 2:42 Oh, interesting. Unknown Speaker 2:44 What is Urban Dictionary say that it Tim Stone 2:46 is a lot I just didn't know what dictionary. So obtuse what I was thinking of is Speaker 1 2:51 the obtuse angle but yeah, the angle which is the what angle Tim is Tim Stone 2:55 between 90 and 180 which would be a Speaker 1 3:00 would you categorize that as like a large angle? I mean, I guess it's a wide angle there's a right angle. Yeah, and there's a cute Unknown Speaker 3:07 Yes. An Unknown Speaker 3:09 obtuse angle and then obtuse I Tim Stone 3:11 guess it's a wide angle you're right. I guess it's a wider angle but I that I've never heard someone use it that way. Anyways, the other one is once you are is annoyingly insensitive and slow to understand Unknown Speaker 3:26 just really wanted to take that shot today or Tim Stone 3:28 yeah, you're really coming off like an obtuse rubber goose right now Unknown Speaker 3:36 all right. Tim Stone 3:42 Got to point it out. Okay, let me tell you a weird question. No, I will not let you What is the theme song? It should have no I got a weird question for you Do it now. Use rubber goose green mousse cake large fries shot but shake by that time. I love that all fit perfectly Speaker 1 4:14 blurred last night. It's a show that gives you a fright. It's things I learned last night by the Unknown Speaker 4:23 things I learned last night Tim Stone 4:33 I don't think I'd make it as a cartoon person Speaker 1 4:43 Okay, so the Black Knight satellite. Tim Stone 4:47 Oh no. So this is my mind. What is it? What's up when you meet someone new and like your house for the first time? Speaker 1 4:55 We're both married. So it's not No not like that? No, like we know just like Make someone new just like a regular person you meet somebody new Tim Stone 5:03 obviously not a woman just a regular person Unknown Speaker 5:29 Okay, so I don't think you had to say it like that though. Speaker 1 5:39 You make a new friend. Yeah. You go to their house for the first time. Okay. Tim Stone 5:45 Do you look through other stuff I feel like I'm feeling like it's like a bad thing that you should Speaker 1 6:01 do. Did you sue my house 100% Tim Stone 6:05 I snooped your apartment I snooped your apartment in Springfield I snooped your dorm room, I stopped your parents house and I'm just like, What? Are these cabinets? Speaker 1 6:15 Okay, so I think there's levels of snooping that I would like to clarify so if you go to someone's house yeah bathroom fair game whatever you want to lock in the door people don't care how long you're in there. Yeah, they care Tim Stone 6:36 there's a point Speaker 1 6:38 where they start to care Yeah, they go there for a minute Yeah, now you're saying that you Snoop gas your bedroom I don't even go in people's master bedrooms. Yeah, Tim Stone 6:50 typically I won't now Tim Stone 6:59 know when I was young I would I learned Speaker 1 7:05 the way you're saying stuff is so bad when I was younger I do. Yeah. I now that I'm older I don't go in master bedrooms anymore. Tim Stone 7:15 Yeah. Unknown Speaker 7:18 But when I was a kid, there was just some curiosity Tim Stone 7:20 that I can't like I'm like What do you got those chores man Unknown Speaker 7:25 you don't hear Speaker 1 7:28 you don't hear that at all. What do you got in those drawers? And you Unknown Speaker 7:40 know weird thing I've just gotten them Tim Stone 7:43 there like it's not a weird thing about it though. Like I'm not gonna do anything Tim Stone 8:00 I know it's I know people aren't like it's problematic. I know. I know that. Drawers is paying I know that Speaker 1 8:10 problematic to go around being like what you got in them drawers? Sure. Tim Stone 8:21 Like I'm just curious Speaker 1 8:25 just curiosity. We're not stupid anymore. Tim Stone 8:31 I know what you say I go you ever do that? Tim Stone 8:46 Oh my gosh. I saw knives before like in droves. Unknown Speaker 8:55 about things that aren't the black Speaker 1 9:00 I only want you to talk about the Black Knight satellite. I don't want to hear anything else from you right now. Tim Stone 9:07 So Black Knight satellite is we'll start with a picture of it. Here's the Black Knight satellite theoretically I Unknown Speaker 9:13 told you what I found in my grandma's drawers Tim Stone 9:27 No, I don't remember that. Okay, Unknown Speaker 9:28 there was a lot of drug paraphernalia. Tim Stone 9:35 See, sometimes it's good to know Yeah. Black Knights and the Black Knight satellite This is it. This is a photograph of it from the space station. I hold on this was during the construction of Space Station. Yeah. Unknown Speaker 9:51 What is this like? Is this like a or do people own this? Tim Stone 9:59 Are you asking This is an alien thing. Yeah, it might be an alien thing. Unknown Speaker 10:02 Okay? Do people own the whatever Tim Stone 10:04 we're doing? Nobody owns this forever. No, Speaker 1 10:07 no, no, it looks like if you took a leather jacket off of the hanger, and it just held it by the collar of the jacket, and you're just like that's straight up the bat. That's a great. That's a great visualization, what this thing looks like that is a ribbon. Just put that on a blue background, because you know, they're in space. I don't think they went. And so Tim Stone 10:34 you know, here's another angle of it. That one's a little grainy a praying mantis, another photo scheme. And then here's another angle of it from the History Channel. That's Unknown Speaker 10:48 okay. So Tim Stone 10:51 here's, here's the concept, this satellite, this this photograph. And really all these photographs were taken at one time, they're just different moments along its flight path was taken from a spacewalk during the construction of the International Space Station, which they were assembling up in space. Sure, and then got his DSLR out, took a photo of the satellite as it floated by this image has since been declassified, but a good description of what it is hasn't been given to us and so it's become known as the Black Light satellite. Okay, UFO lore. And oh, Speaker 1 11:29 shoot, dude. What the UFO people are gonna find this and we did a whole thing about how you're, you're doing it in green? Unknown Speaker 11:40 Dang it, dude. Unknown Speaker 11:42 How's it every time? Tim Stone 11:45 Every episode, bro, it's, Speaker 1 11:46 you know, that's gonna happen. You know what the topic is? Yeah, Tim Stone 11:50 maybe this is like a self conscious. Maybe some conscious self sabotage. Speaker 1 11:55 Maybe you do this? Maybe I do. Because it's like some kind of punishment you like the negative comments that we get on YouTube? Tim Stone 12:01 I do like it. Yeah, see people? I'm not gonna lie. I don't know. I see people like online that talk about like negative comments like bothering them. And I've never like weekends, we'd get some Speaker 1 12:14 yet and they're usually pointed at me, man. I know. There's UFO ones are like if the guy on the right would shut up. The guy that left trying to tell the story and the guy that rice was making jokes all the time. I can't imagine that that doesn't bother you. That's crazy. No shade. You can just read that you go I read that letter brush right off my shoulder. I was like, Man, these people are my friends and my fans. I can't believe that people don't like the things people say about them on the internet. Tim Stone 12:42 That's thrown me two more of those are definitely directed at you. Yeah. I've never had a problem with it. It doesn't bother me. But I definitely do have like a for Speaker 1 12:51 now. You didn't like that. Have you been like that same pick a Tim account that existed? Tim Stone 12:55 No, I I didn't have any issues with that. You didn't like it like that? I didn't know who it was. Yeah, but I didn't mind and you were like, What the frick is this? Yeah, I wanted to know, I was the mystery of it. I was like, I was like, I don't need to know. Yeah, Unknown Speaker 13:09 it was a fun little mystery. I was like, He's gonna get caught anytime. Tim Stone 13:13 Yeah. Yeah, that's how criminals feel. You know? Yeah. Speaker 1 13:22 Hey, thanks for listening to this episode. If you like our show, please leave a review. Leave a comment if you're watching on YouTube and go check out other episodes. Here's one of them. I hate the Lonnie Zamora incident. You know me just not a big fan of the alien episodes. But if that's your jam, that's out there. So go check that out just for fun episode. I think you'd like it. I hated it. So anyway, back to this episode. Tim Stone 13:50 Anyways, the Black Knight satellite it all started with Nikola Tesla. Unknown Speaker 13:56 Okay. Tim Stone 13:58 It really does. The story goes back to Nikola Tesla. He was in 1899, conducting some experiments with radio signals. He wanted to see what radios did. And so he was playing around with the signals and stuff like that. Kinda pretty accurate, actually. And he received what? Something that nobody knew about yet, including him until he received a signal that he said okay, either this is from this radio signal came from the upper atmosphere, it came from outer space. And he was shocked to have received this obviously, because no radio signals could exist without human hands, manipulating them and so receive a radio signal from space. And so he reported this and the scientific community at this time, the scientific community had issues with Nikola Tesla. They were like he's a little crazy. Yeah. But every once in a while he says stuff that like should pay attention to what he says right? But like we don't like him, Speaker 1 14:58 and why didn't they like him? Do you know your About because he was crazy. Oh, there's like he's a weird guy. Tim Stone 15:02 Yeah, he had some theories about. So without going too far into it, he had some kind of, like the vibrations like, you know, there's people who are like the vibrations of the universe, you can connect to the vibrations of the universe, and I'll tell you everything about everything. He was kind of one of those guys. And so he he believed if you could connect to those vibrations, you could understand everything. He's one of those guys so you could also Yeah, but he also thought that you could get energy from it. And so he was trying to like that Tesla he would have Speaker 1 15:30 like dreads and be living in a van. Yeah, in this world right now. Yeah. Tim Stone 15:34 Well, I don't know because big spoons with his mind I don't know if he would be doing that because he was he was at least smart enough to figure out how to get funding so he got people his projects you could build he had the tesla coil in Colorado Springs. And he was building these these like, really intuitive energy sources that were working and I think that was the bigger thing is he was kind of challenging the status quo and threatening Yeah, established energy industry. But it was also kind of cuckoo at the same time, it was very much a bad sign Sure. Anyways, years later, we will realize we would figure out the radio signals that he was capturing were pulsars. You know what those are? Yeah, yeah. Which I just a note for the astronomical community. Renamed pulsars and the pulse stars Speaker 1 16:32 pay now these are polar stars. We used to call them pulsars. Hey, now now there are polar stars that we can't do anymore. Vegas Tim Stone 16:48 is not such as a love. Speaker 1 16:53 Okay. I made a joke about Lord earlier with her royal song and I called her the girl from the ring and you just didn't even I said it's a song with the girl for the ring. And you just Tim Stone 17:11 ah Tim Stone 17:17 I like that. I totally missed that. So anyways, so a lot of people are like, oh, yeah, these were pulsars that he was sure. Maybe not. Will come maybe Speaker 1 17:28 what channel wasn't on 100.5 93.3 He just dials in because hey, we're back with the K love pledge drive. It's going on for a millennium. You can just donate whenever you can just go ahead and open your little open your little wiggly phone and call up there. And Tim Stone 17:53 you're saying this is the aliens Caleb? Yeah, this is not earth Caleb traveling time. No, I thought it was alien. K I'm traveling Caleb. Yeah, this is Alien. Caleb. Yikes. Unknown Speaker 18:05 Positive encouraging. Definitely real Tim Stone 18:08 positive, encouraging Beaubourg? Tim Stone 18:19 Maybe pulsars, maybe something else? I'll tell you in a minute. It's okay. Spoiler pilot Black Knight satellite. And then there was a guy named Juergen halls. He was an amateur radio operator, who was experimenting with radio signals as well. Yeah. And noticed he could get radio signals to echo back at him if he shot them into the atmosphere. But what was interesting is you would expect that if you were echoing off of something, it would be obvious like intervals like that was bouncing back at something the same interval, but they were random. And so he was thinking these are getting repeated back to me not being echoed back to me. Sure. And so something's hearing this and they're sending the same tone back they're like mimicking me. It's like when you knock on a wall and your neighbor knocks on the wall back or the hat man. Speaker 1 19:10 They go chicken Unknown Speaker 19:21 meatballs. Okay, Tim Stone 19:23 cool. Well, Sam marinara. Oh my gosh, Ivan. Okay. So this is this is something that is a real scientific phenomena. Sure. He discovered it. This amateur discovered it and then science was like, Hey, let's look at that Unknown Speaker 19:37 science. Look, we discovered that science Tim Stone 19:38 was like That was alright. Yeah. Speaker 1 19:39 Okay. All right. I thought of that. First. Tim Stone 19:43 They named it long delayed echoes, or LDS. But here's what's interesting about it. They said you can send a radio signal signal anticipates and at random intervals that we can't trace down a pattern. It'll send it'll echo back, the same tone We'll get echoed back. But we have no idea why. Because it bounces off something. Yeah, so there's theories about why it happens. But we still have no idea what's going on. There's an Speaker 1 20:09 alien up there. There's just 20 is just the aliens like, fine like the guy. He's got to keep putting in the numbers cuz he's like, I don't know what's gonna happen if I don't? Yeah, yeah. All right. Quigley's are saved again. Tim Stone 20:30 We saved the quickly. Don't do that. The long delayed echoes, we don't know what those are. So sure, maybe Black Knight satellite. This is this will all come together in a minute. I've got to lay a lot of these Sure. Unknown Speaker 20:49 It'll come again. Sorry, I'll get to in bits. Okay. So Tim Stone 20:52 in 1954, there was an former Navy pilot, who went to newspapers and said, hey, the Air Force has been tracking these two satellites that have been orbiting Earth. We've been tracking them, we don't know where they're from, or who's they are. What's interesting, is we know now that nobody's successfully launched a satellite into orbit until 1957. So this is three years before any human hands got a satellite in space. Sputnik one was the first one. Okay. And so at the time, everybody was panicking. And they were like, Oh, the Soviets got a satellite up. They did it. And they've got it orbiting, and they beat us to it. And that's, he told newspapers and Speaker 3 21:30 the Soviets were like, we thought you did that you did. And then the aliens forget Unknown Speaker 21:36 some dude in Florida like I did it. Tim Stone 21:42 Space guy, just slingshot, slingshot. Yeah, it's pretty surprising how far you can get little stuff to go really far crazy. If it's long enough, they could go so far. Just gotta put a big enough rocket on it. Yeah, Unknown Speaker 21:57 you got to put an obtuse rocket. Tim Stone 22:02 Just such an annoying rocket, Unknown Speaker 22:03 would you keep going? We got a lot of groundwork. So Tim Stone 22:05 he spoke. He he's talking about this group in the government. Okay, after this whole event happened. And he called them the silence group. He was like, he's like, there's a group within the government that doesn't want you to know about these satellites. And he's like, they're not our satellites. Okay, not made by human hands. And they want to keep it silent. That's why they're called the Science Group. Okay, and so kind of honestly, like, the men and black. Sure, similar concept, you know. And then there was a guy named Duncan Lunan, who was a science fiction writer. And stay with me for a second he's a science fiction Oh is one of these guys is a science fiction writer who there was this, his Unknown Speaker 22:52 whole job is to make stuff up. That's like the job description Tim Stone 22:57 they would be they would be Speaker 1 23:00 Sergeant Winslow versus the Black Knights Tim Stone 23:09 in space, you tend not to just do what you'd call the try to steal Unknown Speaker 23:24 come with this fall. Tim Stone 23:26 So Duncan, there was a signal that was a relatively famous signal in the 70s that we received from space. Most likely a pulsar, but he took this signal and he studied it for years. Sure. And he solved it and transliterated into English. And said this is a map of the boaties star system which is a distant star system. And so the signal the tones were coordinates identifying the star system and he said they're trying to tell us that they come from this star system. What Yeah, which is interesting. Unknown Speaker 24:13 So we got the booties Tim Stone 24:18 here's what's interesting. We'll dive down this rabbit hole for a split second Sure. I wanted to cover this in an episode but I haven't had a reason until now. The bowtie system is a galaxy Alright, it's not a galaxy it's a star system within the boat is void. Okay is the largest void that we know about in like the observable so Speaker 1 24:41 those stars are in the middle. Yes, of this void of this Tim Stone 24:45 void. Well, what what what's interesting is is most most like subsections of space that you can kind of estimate like just the normal density of gas galaxies, like how many star systems you could expect to see in an area of space. This is an area that is nearly 330 million light years in dynamic diameter. There's a massive section of space. In a space this large, we would typically expect there to be roughly 2000 galaxies in this section of space. But obviously looking at it, you don't see that many. They estimate there's only 60 that sit within this void. Obviously, very strange, because you look around this, like the rest of the galaxy doesn't have sections of space that are this just open with nothing in it. They say that if Earth, our our star system was in the center of bodies void, we wouldn't know that there was another galaxy that existed until 1988. Because we won't have instruments that could perceive them. That's how giant this void is. Okay, it's absolutely bonkers. And so this is significant. Because if this signal is true, that their highlight whatever this signal was coming from an alien race, I was saying they were from this star system. Sure. Theoretically, that could explain. Bodie is void of why this is here? Because we don't know exactly. There's some pretty good theories. And I could tell you those in a second. But one of the theories is Dyson spheres. And if that's a Dyson spheres, vacuum. Now remember that episode, we talked about him? Not that vacuum? Unknown Speaker 26:36 Like who did it cover the vacuum? And speaking of the vacuum? One of our sponsors? Yes. Yeah. We talked about it in the Tim Stone 26:45 if you haven't heard the episode, there is a theoretical technology that is yes, that civilizations could create to harness energy from stars. And it's like a sphere that wraps in the garbage of scale. The Carter set sail. Yeah. Yeah. And so the Dyson Sphere wraps around the star and sucks the energy from the star, which would dim the star because it's sucking in insurance. And so if there was an alien race, that was Speaker 1 27:12 figured out how to harness the power of their stars, yeah, then they Tim Stone 27:16 would inevitably spread outwards. And just continue to build these Dyson spheres around stars, which is interesting, because you can kind of see the edges are dim, like they're not, it's like they're sucking the energy out of the stars, they haven't completely stamped them out yet. So it's an interesting concept, if that is what is actually happening there. Speaker 4 27:40 Hey, thanks for being part of this episode. If you want to help us do more of this, you wanna help us grow our show. One of the easiest and best ways to do that is to join our Patreon. It's a way for you to financially support the show, and you get a lot in return, you get access to our Discord channel, you get bonus content that comes out, you get exclusive merchandise, and like live zoom Hangouts, where we're both just hanging out eatin pizza, just getting to know each other. The biggest thing is, is we want to know you more as an individual and as a friend. So thanks for supporting our show. If you don't support us financially, we're not pressed about it. We're not like mad, but I'll find you. So text Tillandsia 66866 To keep yourself from being found. All right, because if you don't, I want you Tim Stone 28:27 The leading theory by most scientists right now about what happened to the boat is void is that it's kind of like if you like, pour some soap all over your countertop, never do this. Unknown Speaker 28:41 And it's gets to my friend's house. You know, used to buy soap Tim Stone 28:50 This guy needs just needs to get real free. Speaker 1 28:53 I met someone knew vitamin or invited him over to our house. And then he took our Dawn dish soap. And then just for a long time, it was like, I'm doing a booty Boyd. And you're like, Oh, it's a booty void. Tim Stone 29:14 Then, you know, when he was done, he said, Hey, look. We were like, No, Unknown Speaker 29:20 that's okay. He Tim Stone 29:22 made us come out there. And he showed us that gouter was just covered in DOD two Unknown Speaker 29:29 stars go damn Tim Stone 29:31 it. But the explanation is that if he pours himself at a counter, you kind of have those bubbles. Yeah. And if those bubbles come together, they merge. And so they said over millions of years, there were a bunch of voids and they've all just sort of merged together to create interesting, really big void. Speaker 1 29:47 So there's some kind of pressure or pocket. Yeah, this Tim Stone 29:51 and what's, what's interesting is you can't really see them super well. There's some dead ones that kind of start to move through the middle. There's kind of like almost like a lie. And then so the idea is that those are the bubbles kind of merging together still forcing those out. So, or aliens are taking the energy from the stars sure Speaker 1 30:09 why it is probably the second one? Yeah, it's probably that's Tim Stone 30:12 the most likely possibility. The reason why these are all connected, because people say, the theories are saying that the explanation for all these signals is it's coming from the Black Knight satellite. And sure, that's where we're hearing these radio signals from this is watching us over watching over us. And it's been here for a long time. And the reason why we know it's been here for a long time is because of that. That guy who translated it, translated it and it said, it's been here for 13,000 years. Geez. And the reason why he knows that is because the this map, the star map, this is the Unknown Speaker 30:48 science fiction writer, right? Yes. Tim Stone 30:52 So the star map, the star map, one of the planets on it is out of position when it should be. And so he went back in time, like, Unknown Speaker 31:01 he didn't go back in time, one of his characters, one of his characters went back in time through the record, Tim Stone 31:07 because obviously, like throughout time, stars move based on the wobble of the earth. And so he went Speaker 1 31:12 through based on the wobble, yeah, while baby wobble baby wobble baby Tim Stone 31:16 started the wrong spot. So the end went back to the record and where that planet lied in the system would be 13,000 years in the past. To the wall. These stars aren't where they go. There's a big old hole in space. That works. Hey, that. So this thing got, it's all up here. This thick guy Unknown Speaker 31:53 you hear this stuff that I go. That's okay. No, that one can stay or a different time. Tim Stone 31:59 So, so people are proponents of shaping Unknown Speaker 32:02 your beard. Tim Stone 32:04 I've always shaved my beard. Yeah, but you've been doing a good job Speaker 1 32:07 lately. You've been better at shaping and a little bit shaving whatever's on the cheeks here. Yeah. And then shaping it. It's just looks even Tim Stone 32:17 good. Just bringing it bringing it down a little bit. Good. Thank you. Speaker 1 32:21 The Black Knight satellite was needed for the other rest of it to grow in right there. Tim Stone 32:25 Now let's do this for you to cut out the rest of it. Anyway, the Black Knight satellite the people the performance of the Black Knight satellite say okay, this thing came here 13,000 years ago to monitor us and it's been watching us sending signals back to monitor in space sending signals back to the bodies void, just kind of watching us and what they're doing. Who knows? There's actually some interesting theories. Could be science could be military use cases. My favorite is we are basically like, this is their animal planet. Yeah, we're their reality TV. Unknown Speaker 33:01 Here his two creatures Tim Stone 33:04 just like that. Unknown Speaker 33:06 Recording what they call podcast Tim Stone 33:09 getting ready for the morning commute. So the this has been here for 30 Unknown Speaker 33:15 seconds because the Earth is only 6000 years old. A long time. And then one day I was like whoa Tim Stone 33:23 what is that? You guys aren't gonna believe this? Speaker 1 33:27 Can you imagine if aliens do come to earth pig and they get in touch with Ken Ham Yeah, I'm saying like that's Tim Stone 33:36 they they land on the White House lawn and the President is like you should talk to President Speaker 1 33:41 all the time is an idiot who goes You should talk to Dr. Ken Ham. And then they're forced to go talk to because you here's what happens is they're gonna believe the first story they're told. Yeah, all right. Yeah. And the first story they told is this is the real Ark. We found it we've turned to this museum. Yeah. Crazy. And Tim Stone 34:05 here's all the animals in it and then the satellite has been been watching over us for years and people have been allegedly citing this thing Sure. Both from the ground and from space ever since Unknown Speaker 34:16 I wake up in the middle of night and it's in my room Tim Stone 34:21 and it's telling me it's subway satellite, like like a landmass? Okay, here's the thing. So this is there's a lot of people who really really believe in the Black Knight satellite. This is a legitimate alien outpost or satellite that's watching us and reporting back to the moon is void. But here's the deal. This has this image has been declassified by NASA. They've declassified all of these images. What the black man satellite people just kind of brush over is the explanation that's come with these images. Unknown Speaker 34:55 Yeah, Tim Stone 34:57 she's what so these This is I think, a recreational Oh, that's Unknown Speaker 35:02 definitely not a real one. Tim Stone 35:04 This was a series of photographs that was taken during the construction, or the assembly of the space station. And what this was was a thermal blanket that was removed from some covering on a piece that they were assembling. And it just kind of started floating out into space. Okay, which is why it's kind of flipping around. And then every shot you see it, it looks totally different. And then this one looks Unknown Speaker 35:30 like fabric. So I was kind of right. You were Tim Stone 35:33 Yeah. But it's a thermal blanket. So somewhat reflective. Speaker 1 35:37 Well, what are we keeping the space station warm? Well, you got to keep the, you got to keep it covered like a Corvette and a carport. Now, well, you Tim Stone 35:44 got to keep the parts covered, because it's cold in space. You got to keep them covered. You got to keep them protected from the sun into the eyes, go out and get your glass on him until you get your gloss glossiness on. Yeah, so this was just this. This was just a thermal blanket that was dropped in space and it took a picture of NASA declassified it and when I was like NASA declassified an alien spaceship. That's Speaker 1 36:07 what I'm saying is that frickin just because it's classified all of a sudden, it's like all you're hiding this liquid now that we're there. Yeah, Tim Stone 36:13 it's classified because you can't talk. You can't, can't talk about blankets and talk about blank. The public kid is not ready to hear about this blanket. That's what the owner of the Snuggie said until he came out with it until he got a patent. And it was at the Speaker 1 36:26 public. And I'll tell you what, I saw the first commercial and my dad lost his job idea, Chris. It's a blanket with articles Tim Stone 36:41 is right. The public wasn't ready for that. They weren't ready for that kind of knowledge. And what's what's more interesting is that when this came out, this whole backstory was created, right? That connected Nikola Tesla and the youth that other UFO researcher and LTE is and all this other stuff that was not connected to Unknown Speaker 37:03 Nikola Yordan and Dunkin. Tim Stone 37:07 Yes, actually. Dunkin guapo Speaker 1 37:13 Well, I remember you're going because like, that's a name that should make a comeback. I don't. I'm Jared, this is my wife, Reagan. This is our beautiful kids. We've got New Orleans. Tim Stone 37:23 It's like it's a combination of your two names your Torrington, Unknown Speaker 37:27 Brittany and your Oregon. Tim Stone 37:31 Everyone would literally think that you were just trying to put your names Speaker 1 37:34 a bit lately, where I because I do about the kids name stuff. So I just been asking like, Are there any millennial parents in here and people go who I know your kids got stupid names. Everyone was like, Oh, no. What are they? Your kids have stupid names. And every mom goes, Oh, and then I go, I'll decide what are your kids names? And this girl? This lady goes, well, my eldest Kyle. And I said, Oh, I said, Okay, that's a normal name. But the worst he's not going to be at any old cause. And she goes, he's gonna die young. And I was like, No, you don't get to say. And then she goes, Yeah, my second is Frank. What was it? Kylie? No, it was like Asher. Oh, yeah. And I was like, you know? Tim Stone 38:27 I think that's just cool, because you can shorten it to ash and that is stupid. Okay. Unknown Speaker 38:33 Well, your name your kid Asher stone. Tim Stone 38:35 I don't think ash or stone flows? Well, Unknown Speaker 38:38 I don't think so either. I don't think any name flows. Well. You shouldn't have kids. Tim Stone 38:45 Thanks, appreciate that. Unknown Speaker 38:47 Stone doesn't flow. Well. That's why she hasn't changed her. She's just at the heart tell you Tim Stone 38:56 legally. Okay, but Duncan, here's the interesting thing. Duncan Lunan. The guy who translated the signal, Speaker 1 39:01 did it. He's a science fiction writer. Well, one. He's Tim Stone 39:05 a science fiction writer. But two, he didn't translate the signal. He's just doing the fictional art. So he translated a signal. Oh, he translated a signal and came out and wrote about it translate this signal. And it was like in the 90s or something. Everyone was like, this guy figured it out. And everyone's like, crazy. Couple years later, he's like, Yeah, I made that up. And then fiction. Yeah. And then Speaker 1 39:25 he's like, Guys, it's literally in my, you know, I was a young adult writer then. And now I've grown up. I realized that you guys didn't realize that was fiction. That Tim Stone 39:36 was fiction. That was fake. That's not real. He he the Black Knight satellite. People pick that up. And oh, he's talking about the Black Knight satellite. And he's like, I never said that. And he's like, also, is it also the one that I was translating was like a signal that came from near the moon. And this was coming from near Earth orbit, the Black Knight satellites. It was like it's not the same thing. And it's like been very vocal. He's got a blog. been very vocal on his blog or check about the fact what's his blog called? It is called Speaker 1 40:11 Black Knight satellite get it? I'm pretty Black Knight satellite get it right 100 Gig right call one 800 Dig right. Tim Stone 40:29 Yeah, he's he's like I never I never said it was that and he's like, You guys just decided it was that and so this is just the whole Black Knight satellite story is this hodgepodge of ideas that got mixed together and blended together to be like, Oh, that's the thing. It's not a thing. And here's the whole moral of the story. Here's why I'm bringing this whole thing up. Sure. Aliens are really helpful. Speaker 1 40:48 And when you make these stories where you're crying wolf Yeah, then people aren't going to believe us that we Tim Stone 40:54 when we do things like the Skinwalker Ranch we do things like Black Knight satellite. It makes you look crazy. There's legitimate stuff out there. We don't have to go. Yeah, all these wires to this weird connection. So Speaker 1 41:07 you're trying to you're trying to appeal to the alien audience to say stop rational. Yeah, Tim Stone 41:15 I waited until the end of this episode where none of them made it to the No, it just bothers me man. It bothers me that we have something that is as legitimate as aliens are. That is so publicly illegitimate because of crap like this. It drives me It drives me nuts. It drives me nuts. Just like math. And all these people who stuck to it this pivot there's a lot of people give bath a bath me. Speaker 1 41:44 As an interviewer, what I've learned is that if you just let your guests talk, if you just sit there silently, they'll say some insane stuff. Because aliens are real. And like a lot of people give them a bad rap dude. Just like common core math. Speaker 1 42:09 This derail is so fast at the end, let's get it back on track and get us into the federal office. What do you Tim Stone 42:24 think last night is a production of space Tim medium produced by Christian Taylor audio by Alex Garnett video by Connor Betts. Our graphics and our logo by Caleb Goldberg and our social media is run by Caleb Walker. Our hosts are Jeremiah and Tim stone. Follow us on your favorite social media platform at Taillon podcast is Ti LL and podcast. Remember to tell all your friends about us and we'll see you next Tuesday for another episode of things I learned last night. Transcribed by

Have you ever heard of the Black Knight Satellite? It’s a mysterious object orbiting Earth, surrounded by countless conspiracy theories. In this blog post, we’ll delve into the enigma of the Black Knight Satellite and explore the various conspiracy theories surrounding it. What is the Black Knight Satellite? The Black Knight Satellite is an enigmatic object in orbit around Earth. … Read More

The Hat Man – Unveiling the Mystery of Nightmares


Episode Transcription

Made by robots for robots. Only read if you're weird.

Tim Stone 0:00 Hey man, what's up Tim Stone 0:06 happy Halloween. It's Halloween Today is Halloween. Oh, this is Today is Halloween? Unknown Speaker 0:13 Do you know what that means though? Tim Stone 0:14 That means it's our sixth birthday. Unknown Speaker 0:15 Yeah Tim Stone 0:16 Happy Birthday Hey, happy birthday Unknown Speaker 0:17 happy birthday Tim Stone 0:19 I'm afraid yet Speaker 2 0:22 All right, I don't like the energy of this at all. I would like you to take a step back sorry Tim Stone 0:29 I'll come down Unknown Speaker 0:30 blueberry cantina Tim Stone 0:31 I scared yet yeah. Unknown Speaker 0:32 What are we talking about Tim Stone 0:34 that man over Speaker 2 0:42 Okay, so you're saying the hat man not the hat man. Oh, thanks. I'm glad you brought it up so my head is abnormally large and I have to custom order hats from this website called odd job slashed Hill Tim Stone 1:05 Do we have a love clip so that to send to him yet? Speaker 2 1:08 I know we got to keep doing this for like 15 years and then we can be the hey this joke outlasted you're gonna say they'll be long gone Tim Stone 1:18 by the time maybe not alright, this is gonna be a surprisingly normal thing you're going to be disappointed and how not crazy this is. So I ended up naked in the lobbies a lot actually. Pretty much stands for like the proxy, a hydrogen or something like that. I don't know. Unknown Speaker 1:41 I'm trying to see that. It's like things I learned last night Unknown Speaker 1:54 that's why no one listens to our show. Tim Stone 1:56 Have you heard of him? No. Oh, so the Hanged Man is? Unknown Speaker 1:59 Is it the guy that's in my dreams? Tim Stone 2:02 Yeah. So you have heard of the hat man. Speaker 2 2:05 Well, I mean yeah, I guess is that what it is? Tim Stone 2:10 It Do you have any new dreams to fedora? Is this a real? Is this a real thing? Speaker 2 2:13 Yes. The record the recurring dream that I have. Oh, well he says it's finished. Yes guy has a hat he's got he's dressed like a mobster. Tim Stone 2:19 Does he looks like this Speaker 2 2:25 bra my joke this when I tell you the shiver that just came over my whole body I don't I look legit don't want to do this. Tim Stone 2:36 We got a vote. I made that I had someone design that for this moment. We're not talking about that, man. This is a little bit was that your Halloween prank? No, no, this is really the subject but I wish I would have thought ahead that much to joke joke you like are we really talking about the heavy? Yeah, we're really talking about the Hanged Man. That's a real real thing. Someone else designed to this is off the screen. Okay, sorry. Speaker 2 3:02 I knew I like legitimately I am not a fan right now. And I want to get to the story. Okay, so that I can be a little less afraid. Well. Probably gonna be more of what you just did was like Mike was like your counselor going this man? That's I mean, Tim Stone 3:21 let's hit this. Speaker 2 3:25 Bro. I don't know if you can I don't think it'll show up on camera. If you're able to zoom in and see literally the moment that my my whole body like hair stands up. I don't like this. Tim Stone 3:36 Okay. Wow, this is this is great. I'm so excited. never really listened to Yeah, well, I'm looking forward to it. Because this is something that's been around for a long time. Unknown Speaker 3:46 I'm having a panic attack right now. Tim Stone 3:48 Yeah, interest, interestingly enough it and I don't know if I have conclusive proof of this. But it seems like the experiences of the Hackman are typically in our age range somewhere born between like, the 80s and 90s. Okay, was is what it seems like. But that man is honestly very similar to your experience. Yeah, cool. See the hat man, typically in dreams, okay. It's a why it's kind of like this man type of thing. It's like have you seen this? Or you're right. I've never seen this have you all the way a lot of people see him in the in their dream. Speaker 2 4:32 I swear to him if we get to the end of this episode, and you go I made all this up just to scare you. i I'm gonna be the Hanged Man in your room, dude. Man. I am like on the verge of tears right now. Tim Stone 4:48 People see them in their dreams. But a lot of people see him not just in dreams. They see him in real life. Speaker 2 4:54 I'm glad he's stuck in my dreams. That's a good yeah. I enjoy it. When I wake up, I'm like, I beat you. I bet you Yeah, for Tim Stone 5:04 some people he's not. Here, I'll give a description. I'll give a description for our listeners. So the idea of the Hanged Man is that there's a situation that happens to a lot of people where they'll, either in a dream or typically late at night, they'll see a man standing, usually in a doorway, but maybe in a corner or some other portion of their room. Just kind of observing them typically described as a malevolent presence. Not really usually doesn't say anything to people just sort of watches them and people stare at them. And then for a couple of minutes, it doesn't move. Like maybe it's a shadow and my mind is playing tricks on me. And then it just like walks out of the room and like shuts the door, something like that. Some people the hat man will speak to them. Yeah, I will say eerie, strange things stuff. Something like it is finished finished. Very short sentences are like don't go to this specific place. Or Speaker 2 6:06 mine started reciting the subway sandwich menu to me one time woke up and it was like meatball marinara, tuna rotisserie. Calm. I was like, Tim Stone 6:22 What do you say your Speaker 2 6:23 first Italian BMT and I was like, What is happens? I Tim Stone 6:27 mean, he's really long. Unknown Speaker 6:31 There's a the subway club. They're different. Buffalo Chicken, Tim Stone 6:37 the all new subway pizza, Speaker 2 6:38 spicy Italian. My wife comes to me. And she says this is real. She comes to me last week. And she goes, I made up a sandwich at Subway. And I said, Really? She goes yeah, it's just pepperoni and salami. Oh, the spicy she was no I made that up. I said you didn't like on the board? Oh, I made up a sandwich. I really want to get I got Bacon Lettuce and Tomato Tim Stone 7:04 Sandwich would you get it's like a horn. But it's like round and like really little. Speaker 2 7:10 I was trying to get you said that at a concert. Where you're just like watching a band play and you go, you lean over and you go Tim Stone 7:22 I got an idea Unknown Speaker 7:32 like I just made that up. Tim Stone 7:39 It was my idea. He's already got it. Okay, now you don't understand what I think of subs they appear. Speaker 2 7:47 So he's saying stuff that's like short sentences. Maybe not saying anything? Yeah, Tim Stone 7:51 usually pretty cryptic. Usually sometimes like a warning. Speaker 2 7:55 Is there an explanation for why this is happening at the end? Kinda some theories, Tim Stone 8:00 theories, right theories. We got a lot of theories, actually. Unknown Speaker 8:02 My idea is that he's real. Tim Stone 8:04 Freaking might be Unknown Speaker 8:07 happy Halloween. Tim Stone 8:08 Yeah. And so he shows up in people's dreams. What's interesting is once people see him once they usually start seeing them a lot. Jaron Myers 8:16 I hate this. I want to stop. You're making this up. Tim Stone 8:21 I'm 100% serious. Once people see once they usually start seeing some sort of regularity. And Unknown Speaker 8:29 golly, man, I'm sweating. Tim Stone 8:32 I mean, it is kind of hot in here. Okay. And it also might be that Unknown Speaker 8:40 okay, so he shows up multiple, Tim Stone 8:42 multiple times throughout the throughout people's lives. And on rare occasions, there's some like rare outlier occasions where he'll show up with a posse like this, like there he is with a couple of friends. Speaker 2 9:01 Okay, straight up, though. I'm not joking. I mean, mobster, right? Yeah. Because you can't see his face. Yeah, the guy in my dream has like what I would describe as like a ballgame work face where it's Tim Stone 9:12 just like, yeah, that's the thing the face that is described as you can see the eyes typically they're like glowing eyes can't see like, make out features. No mouth. Oh, yeah, that's what's described. Unknown Speaker 9:24 I don't like that. I'm part of this. I Tim Stone 9:28 want to be honest, when I started researching this, the other night didn't make that connection. I did not make the connection that this is the same thing that you experienced. I didn't make the connection. We talked about it in the Slenderman episode. Yeah, way long ago that my brother used to talk about the man with no nose. And I'm like, I wonder if it was Slenderman or if it was the hat man that I need to I need to call him and ask him if it was if the guy had a hat. Hey, Speaker 2 9:46 the guy you were that traumatic experience you had as a child when you woke up and you felt like you saw sort of your room. Oh, I actually had forgotten about it till you just brought it up. Coco Coco TD and would you say that was a normal size hat or Like a large hack, Tim Stone 10:00 like Did he have a big enough head where Unknown Speaker 10:04 the guy is just like job Tim Stone 10:11 hey, like what if we say enough in this episode that I can pretty much guarantee Unknown Speaker 10:23 that's not the promo they wanted. Tim Stone 10:26 Hey, but if it sells Speaker 2 10:30 okay, but you see I'm saying like it's a very mob looking like multiple shadow figures. Yeah. Did we talk about this? Like I think that you know of course people believed in ghosts because I got candlelight. Tim Stone 10:42 Yeah. About that and Speaker 2 10:44 if you go to like a candlelight dinner or the power goes out and you see the Yeah, the stuff flicker on the walls. You're like, Yeah, Tim Stone 10:51 we were talking about that in Orlando because Brady and I went to Disney we did the Haunted Mansion, right? Yeah. Room where it's all candlelight. And I was like, Well, no doubt people believe. Speaker 2 11:00 Shadows. Yeah, I mean, of course, people believe in ghosts. Yeah. Tim Stone 11:03 Cuz you got the shadow light, or the candlelight. And then yeah, they flicker in the shadows just move around. And you're like, Oh, that's a person. That's yeah, it makes perfect sense. Unknown Speaker 11:14 Honestly, with the lights on, Tim Stone 11:15 but so they would say that this guy was clearly the leader that whenever he showed up with a posse, the hat man was clearly the one in charge. And you could tell because of his hat. Speaker 2 11:26 And he brought Vin Diesel and the rock was to clearly bald guys. Tim Stone 11:34 So for a long time, this was kind of where it ended. Like it was like people would have these dreams or these kind of waking nightmare type experiences. Where they would see the hat man. But then something interesting happened around 2016 I don't know if you've heard of this, the Benadryl challenge happened. Do you know what that is? Unknown Speaker 11:54 Is that when you territory take a Benadryl and try to stay awake? Tim Stone 11:57 Well, so this some people learned that Benadryl the like active ingredient and Benadryl it Unknown Speaker 12:04 is meth is Tim Stone 12:07 is dp H, which stands for like the proxy per hydrogen or something like that on our Unknown Speaker 12:20 proxy Tim Stone 12:26 Okay, I have no idea Speaker 2 12:31 that you went for it. I hate that you're like the proxy, which honestly would have covered the PE you didn't have to proxy covered. Didn't have to try to include it in the hydrogen. Also, there's a p at the front, it's pronounced fighter. cheats. Hydrogen, cheese. Okay. What is TP? What is DPH? Do, Tim Stone 13:08 ma'am. So it's a deliriant. So okay. Benadryl is obviously Speaker 2 13:16 an allergy thing where you try to take it you just tried to push through the sleepiness? No. So it's because people have done that with Nyquil. People say you get like real messed up if you take a NyQuil and then you just push through it. Don't let it let you fall asleep. I can't Tim Stone 13:28 imagine taking like a normal dose of NyQuil and being able to sit down Speaker 2 13:34 to power through that is crazy amount of well, I know and they say the other side is free. We try it. No, no. Tim Stone 13:44 That is insane. I can't Okay, anyway, maybe we should Speaker 2 13:47 but only like we'll put two bills on the table and only one was a Nyquil. The other one's a placebo and Tim Stone 13:52 the other person just here's the thing I fall for placebos. Unknown Speaker 13:57 The other one is just a proxy for hydrogen. Tim Stone 14:05 So, so there's potential challenge. Obviously, normally, the normal dose for this is like 50 milligrams, and that's just for like, normal. Like, I got an allergy or like, oh, Speaker 2 14:15 right into my allergy pills. Yeah, that type of type of stuff. That was me realizing I didn't do my allergy, like, Tim Stone 14:21 I'll guess. But when you start pushing that dosage up three 400 milligrams, it starts to make you hallucinate because Speaker 2 14:31 believe it Yeah, it's crazy. When you start taking medication and nine times where you're supposed to does some pretty crazy stuff. File the baby every doctor on the planet could tell you that. Well turns out if you take more than the doctor tells you to stuff happens Tim Stone 14:47 while a bunch of teenagers realized oh, hey, I can trip really hard on Benadryl and that's an over the counter drug. Yeah, it's it's super easy to get their hands on it. Speaker 2 14:56 mushroom pizza, ate all the mushrooms and they were like, I think I feel It Unknown Speaker 15:08 is having an allergic reaction they're literally dying Tim Stone 15:16 so high right now DPH wavy Yeah, I love pot Mushrooms, mushrooms. But the this was an overview of the drugs was really easy for them to trip. Sure. And so they kind of got a bunch of teens are getting into it. And as they started using, they started Unknown Speaker 15:41 calling, drilled for sure Speaker 2 15:49 hey, thanks for listening to this episode. If you like our show, please leave a review. Leave a comment if you're watching on YouTube and go check out other episodes. Here's one of them. I hate the Lonnie Zamora incident you know me just not a big fan of the alien episodes. But if that's your jam, that's out there. So go check that out. It's very fun episode. I think you'd like it. I hated it. So anyway, back to this episode Tim Stone 16:18 they started increasing their tolerance so their dosages had to go up to be able to start to trip. Well, what was interesting is speaking of Speaker 2 16:27 tolerance. What I was just thinking if you take that much Benadryl every day, the experience is not the same. Yeah, you know, yeah, that's what I keep thinking about. Like, I drink like freakin 800 milligrams of caffeine every day. Tim Stone 16:44 Oh, I wonder if caffeine makes you see that man too. Speaker 2 16:48 Bro. I'm not joking when I'm like, I will do whatever it takes and ever see that guy again? Well, also whatever it takes a diversity you for doing this. Tim Stone 17:01 So when a decent size of the population that was doing the DPH the Benadryl challenge. They were there was a population of them on on Reddit, there's a group on Reddit that Speaker 2 17:14 was wondering where this this seems like the tide potters? Tim Stone 17:17 Yeah, a very similar concept. So they're on Reddit. They're kind of and they would kind of every after every experience, they would do a almost like a blog on Reddit about what they experienced on their trip. Unknown Speaker 17:31 Today is Thursday. Tim Stone 17:35 Also known as national Thursday, also Speaker 2 17:37 known as Yeah, now you know, what are tick tock? That's a super nice joke. But Tim Stone 17:46 so they would kind of blog everything that that was happening on Reddit. And as Speaker 2 17:49 Yeah, you got to scroll through all the backstory before you get to the recipe of Benadryl. You know, oh, my Tim Stone 17:54 gosh, I can't stand that. Are you referencing my tweet today? No, Speaker 2 17:58 I'm referencing just, you know, recipes in general. Trust me, because you tweet about it today. Tim Stone 18:04 I tweeted at Google today and told them to blacklist sites that do that Google's fault is it is no no, no, no, no, no, no. Google has the power to bury them in their algorithm. And they should because that's keyword stuffing is what they're doing. And that's against the rules on Google. And so they should not be allowed to be on the first page of keyword Speaker 2 18:20 stuffing is actually what I called my Thanksgiving this this year. It's funny you brought that up so the recipe comes from my grandma who she's also known as the hat man. Ridiculous. Tim Stone 18:38 So so when the dosages started approaching 600 milligrams, okay, more and more of these blogs on Reddit started Speaker 2 18:49 getting darker and also incoherent posts and you're like you're either sick or below ribs. Italian BMT and like Tim Stone 19:04 they're just writing this stuff the hat man. Speaker 2 19:09 Ha ha ha ha jah jah jah jah jah el el because you fell asleep Tim Stone 19:17 they're not doing it during the trip. They're doing like a post. Unknown Speaker 19:20 Yeah, but it was their whole goal for for sure. You think so? Tim Stone 19:24 I don't know. I've never done it. I don't know. Should we try? One of the other one gets a placebo. Unknown Speaker 19:32 Yeah, well gets a vitamin C. Tim Stone 19:34 That's the thing about it, though. To me, that stresses me out because one pill is 50 milligrams and so for them to be taken like Unknown Speaker 19:42 they're, they're taking like, a lot of comfortable Tim Stone 19:45 amount of pills. Anyways. And so they're kind of doing these little Speaker 2 19:50 low pay and take my pills was one either. Gonna dude today's is off. Tim Stone 19:55 They're doing their little blog and at 600 milligrams People started to notice that they keep referencing this dude with like a brimmed hat. That showing up in their hallucinations. Yeah, but before that, it's just like spiders and like basically Speaker 2 20:09 to be clear, it's not like not like it's more of a fedora mobster hat. It's not. So I cowboy hats not like the hats that girls wear to Nashville. Yeah, Nashville hat. It's not though not those. Yeah. It's not the I've never been spooked. It's not the bachelorettes around the corner and the hat man. Yeah, have been spooked by some ukiyo nerds though, because Whoa, there's a posse of them Tim Stone 20:49 so they started realizing that this was the hat man that was happening in a lot of people's dreams. Sure. And then a kind of subgroup of this Reddit was like, hey, like, let's figure out who he is. And so they would intentionally go on these trips and they would intentionally take Unknown Speaker 21:05 to be like, who are tell us your name? Tim Stone 21:09 What is What do you call yourself? And he said, Speaker 2 21:12 You're new here. I'm just used pastor would love to know your name man. Can Tim Stone 21:16 you fill out of this good Speaker 2 21:20 dude, it's so good to see Have you met my friend Tim Stone 21:28 sneaky as youth pastor flex Oh, no. All you gotta do is just felt this car drop it in the hat when? Tim Stone 21:43 Yeah, so they they kind of started chronicling, okay, hey, at 600 milligrams, you start to have a chance of seeing the hat man at 900 UCM every time and so they started a dosage where it was like, Okay, let's just keep moving this up to G and it became a Unknown Speaker 22:00 thing. Are they doing this on their own? By themselves? Tim Stone 22:03 Yeah, they're just kids on Reddit, the Reddit kids. Speaker 2 22:06 What do you do if you've come home and your kid is downing 18 Benadryl tablets? Because like those aren't those aren't easy to open. Yeah, he's got us he's young. Unknown Speaker 22:17 I mean, you gotta make a pile. Yeah. And then your kids just like like freaking m&ms You his hands it doesn't melt in his hand you know? It's just Speaker 2 22:32 and then freakin probably not with water though. They're probably downing him with Monster Energy Drinks probably. Monster an official sponsor. Tim Stone 22:45 Well, they started getting beamed out like here's here's the actual I think this is a T shirt so Speaker 2 22:49 can't take Benadryl because I owe the hat man money and I don't want to see him. Cheese. Tim Stone 22:56 But it started to get maimed out and became like a kind of a joke on Reddit. Sure, but kids were getting like legitimately addicted to Benadryl. Speaker 2 23:04 We know that I did not take 900 milligrams of Benadryl to see that man Tim Stone 23:10 no people do see him naturally. There are natural occurrences of the hot man and then there are these which are Unknown Speaker 23:16 artificial synthetic. Tim Stone 23:20 And so these kids, Speaker 2 23:21 I got an all daddy my hand knows all Patti and Hattie Natty. Natty. Here's the thing. Tim Stone 23:36 This community, he's after Speaker 2 23:39 me more than I'm after him. And that's kind of why the power dynamics. That's where the power dynamic shifts. Yeah, Tim Stone 23:44 yeah. That's interesting. That's an interesting that's actually a really interesting point that I haven't thought about because a lot of these Redditors are the only ones where they get like, positive stories of the hat, man. Speaker 2 23:54 I'm gonna turn on him. Where are you bro? I show up in history. We don't find you he wakes up still sleeps in the hat. So when he lays out a bed, it's like Tim Stone 24:10 he doesn't tilt that for it. He just Yeah, it's like kind of Unknown Speaker 24:13 detached to his head. I assume. He wakes up Tim Stone 24:18 his neck a train drill. From it's like he's like I got a kink in my neck. I gotta go to the chiropractor every morning. There we go. Are there at your odd job hat he doesn't even know what a baseball cap does his job come up to you get real close. whisper in his ear you say? I got an idea Speaker 2 24:41 for sandwich. six slices of pepperoni and six slices of salami, provolone cheese, toasted with spinach, green peppers and onions. Vinegar and oil, salt pepper. Tim Stone 24:58 I call it Spicy Italian Speaker 2 25:05 spicy Italian. He's like, I'll never come to your dream again. It was too late for that. You walk out at length now, Tim Stone 25:19 you immediately sprigs up it goes over to his laptop. And he says, Dear hat Reddit I saw him again Speaker 2 25:29 I saw Jaron again they all know my name Tim Stone 25:38 they know your day. Yeah, they know everyone's name. Yeah, yeah. Cuz they're, you know, demons. So, this this group gets addicted. Yeah. And to both trying to see the hot man and the drug. And it becomes like a Speaker 2 25:53 Is that something you fight? You find your kid? Yeah, you come home your kids down in 18 Benadryl pills. Yeah. And you go, what are you doing? Yeah, well, hopefully not like that. You know? Like, like you. Tim Stone 26:06 Calm down. You go, Hey, Speaker 2 26:08 what are you doing? And they go, I'm trying to see, man. It's like we're gonna take you to the hospital fun little facility. And you might have to stay. It's like summer camp. You're gonna stay there for a little bit. No, you're not going to see your friends Tim Stone 26:25 call the guy in the white coat. Grandpa if it makes you feel bad. Unknown Speaker 26:30 If it makes you feel better doctors like Tim Stone 26:32 keeps call me grandpa. Yeah, I Speaker 2 26:34 told me. Oh, that's the only reason we're still doctors like Cathy's, like fully rigged. Like he's just been here for six months. And actually the first month he quit talking about the hat man, but he's been calling the grandpa and asked me to go home for the last five months. The dad's like now yeah, we gave him permission to call me grandpa. Like, yeah, and the doctor is like, easily 15 years younger than you are. Why is he calling me grandpa? Tim Stone 27:05 He just thought it was funny. Speaker 2 27:09 I just figured repay you? I don't know. The kid looks you in the eye and says I'm gonna see that hat man. You panic. Let's go to grandpa grandpa's house is over. He's gonna drill pills. To friggin pop it out. He's coughing Tim Stone 27:26 I want to see him. Oh my gosh, was probably a good time for disclaimer, don't do this. Speaker 2 27:33 Probably a great time for a Patreon ad. So you can join us on Patreon. Where we have a cold like we it's basically a Reddit just for us to discuss like, you. Tim Stone 27:45 I'm still thinking about I think I've said this in the discord the other day, but I'm still thinking about I listened to I don't know some episode where you mentioned the discord. And you call slack discord with slacks. Yeah. And I think that's the funniest thing in the world. I didn't laugh very hard in that episode. But you didn't really know if I laughed really hard. And I keep thinking about real Speaker 2 28:02 life. What he taught is that was happening outside of this retirement in real life. Tim Stone 28:09 Kind of a bubble here. Okay, this is the you know, okay, so the Benadryl Unknown Speaker 28:14 Okay, glad we're off of our 20 minute side rant, Tim Stone 28:16 the Benadryl people got really into this. Yeah. And it became a serious problem. So much so to where that's why if you buy Benadryl most stores now you need an ID. You have to be 18 or older to buy Benadryl now. Yeah, because it became like an issue. And I loosely mentioned it a second ago, but I do feel like we should say it's like a serious thing. Like people have died from OD on this stuff. And it? Speaker 2 28:42 Well, I'm glad you're telling me this after we did a whole 15 minute bit about frickin 18 pills in her mouth. I mean, it's a punk style. Tim Stone 28:51 But it does make people do. Yeah, really dumb stuff. And don't end it. And it's very addicting. So don't try it. Anyway, so the hat man happens on these drug hallucinations. happens on in dreams and in. What's the sleep paralysis? Have you heard asleep? Or you wake up and you can move? Yeah, it happens a lot with cases of sleep paralysis. And it's become more and more common over the past few years. A lot. A lot of cases have been. The hat made is more common now. Yeah, it's starting to become more and more common because it does seem Unknown Speaker 29:27 like it started. I mean, that that read itself was like 2016. Tim Stone 29:30 Yeah, well, we so what's interesting is in 2016, after the right stuff, a guy put together a website called the hat man project, and where people could kind of submit their stories of their experiences with that man, and they've got 1000s of submissions. It's tough to say how legitimate all these are. I've I've looked at some of them and some of them I don't know, their suspect. Sure the subs, the spelling's all over the place and some of the stories are just like, Ah, this feels like you know, when you're reading something like that, and you're like this feels too perfect like the story feels too perfect to be real. feels too manicured. You know? I don't know a lot of them feel that way. So I don't know how many of them are legitimate. Speaker 2 30:12 But a lot of that in my dream. i It seemed like it was happening a lot when I was in high school. Yeah. So I want to say my freshman year high school was the first one. And then one time at Evangel. Yeah. But like, I don't really is not that I remember. Tim Stone 30:28 Yeah. Interesting. Speaker 2 30:30 So, right. And like by a lot, I mean, like, maybe four or five times total. Yeah. Which is a lot. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it was like once a year there for a while. Tim Stone 30:40 That's interesting. Unknown Speaker 30:41 I'm due for another visit. Yeah, Tim Stone 30:43 I mean, that that was kind Speaker 2 30:44 of like the dentist you go a lot for you know, a little while and then you don't go for like 10 years. Tim Stone 30:49 Yeah. And then you show back up and they pull up there. You're messed up. Yeah, but do you really that like no one else knows. Everyone else is like your teeth looks Unknown Speaker 30:57 in the hat ministries being like Tim Stone 31:06 his teeth, he's got so much gums. Floss. That's, I think that's what they do is like, Speaker 2 31:13 do you pray? I was going to a fight yesterday. And that's actually that's actually like, what I thought I was like, dang, how? How cool would it be to just caulk your head like this? To get into a fight, someone squaring up and you just go do you pray. Just punch kid lights knocked out of you, you know, saying like, freakin Tim Stone 31:47 well get the data, like your Unknown Speaker 31:56 friggin beat the heck out of you, man. Tim Stone 32:01 That's really funny. Thanks for checking out our show. If you like it, and you want to support it be a part of what we're doing here, you can do that by becoming a patron. What happens there is you get to be in the community, we have a discord with our hosted producers, we have a lot of fun. We're super active in there every day, you get access to add free content a week before everybody else. And we have a zoom every month with our patrons. We hang out we eat pizza, we get to know you a little bit better. It's a blast. And there's a ton of other different benefits like merch discounts, birthday messages, things like that, that are super cool. If you want to be in that you can just text HiLine to 66866. And that'll get you right in there. If not, we're just super glad that you're here. And thanks for watching our show Tim Stone 32:51 so on this this guy's site, or even on Reddit, a lot of these stories where people say Oh, this happened to me when I was a kid. And so those years and 90s and there was a huge volume of that. So nowadays interesting there's there's still people who was happening. Speaker 2 33:08 Vaguely stuff like that when I was a kid but I wouldn't have associated that. Like because I guess I associated that guy with the recurring dream that happens where you go in and and murder innocent people. Yeah, maybe they're not innocent. Who knows? I don't know the backstory. I just hit me. Oh, guys, I'm just one of the bald guys. But I can remember like moments of like, you know, you think like, I remember one time I woke up. And I thought it was my mom in the hallway right outside my room. And I remember being like, Oh, what are you doing? Yeah. And then there's walked Tim Stone 33:42 away? Yeah, yeah. When was the hat, man? Speaker 2 33:45 I don't remember specifically if there was a hat on my mother. I don't, but I couldn't I you know, remembering that I remember that very clearly. But I don't I remember. I remember it. Thinking of my mom. But maybe it wasn't my mom. I don't know. Interesting. So then a lot of very similar experience at a Hampton Inn in South Bend, Indiana. You know, Tim Stone 34:16 is that real? Unknown Speaker 34:22 No, no, I thought that was funny that it's funny. So, so the man in Tim Stone 34:31 the 80s 90s A lot of people said they experiences this. Sure. So more people started sliding into the chat and saying, Oh, I don't I don't have a story of that man. But like pre 80s like 70s 60s 50s I experienced something similar, but it was more of just like a shadow figure. Like I just want to say yeah, it wasn't hot man. And so that kind of gets us into a handful of theories of what's going on here. Okay. So obviously there's the possibility that this is just a dream. are some figment of everyone's imagination? That's a possibility. Sure. And then the the drugs I mean, Speaker 2 35:06 well, it's the sheer dream that people have like your teeth falling out. Yeah. Tim Stone 35:09 This man or Senator like there's there is a power of suggestion thing where it's like it becomes something in the Zeitgeist and culture like you're gonna see it. Like, like when you buy a new car you see that car everywhere. People are talking about it on Reddit and you spend a lot of time on Reddit, then you start to dream about this guy, because Sure, it's just kind of in the back of your mind. And so if that's possible, and that's, I mean, I would say a lot of people who've experienced this, that could be it. But for cases like yours, like obviously, like you didn't notice no thing. And so there's a couple, a couple of possibilities for that scenario. Okay. One of them. Have you heard of gin? Unknown Speaker 35:47 No. I don't even know what that is. Tim Stone 35:52 Good. So gin are essentially Tim Stone 36:03 Jared are essentially like demons in like Near Eastern. Speaker 2 36:08 Oh, okay. Okay. I know we're talking about what Tim Stone 36:11 a lot of a lot of times today you would think like Genie sugar. That's kind of where it's derived from, but they're more demonic the jinn. And they go back to ancient times, in Latin cultures. They're described as like Incubus and succubus. And so these are the same things. The concept is it comes to you in your sleep, and it wakes you up in your sleep, and harms you in your sleep and makes it to where you can't wake up or hurts you or kills you all within your sleep. Okay. What a lot of people think is that is just an ancient explanation for sleep paralysis. Which if you don't know what sleep paralysis is, sleep paralysis is something that doesn't have a ton of research around it yet, but sometime in like the 90s, early 2000s. Medicine was able to say, okay, yeah, this is definitely a thing where there's some sort of connection in your brain, where when you when you go to sleep, like it paralyzes your body. Yeah. But there's a thing where you wait, while you're still in REM sleep, you can wake up like you can become conscious, but your body's still paralyzed. So you can't move, right, you're still physically asleep, but you're conscious. And there's not a ton of research into this yet. But there's some theory that you can be fully conscious in that sleep paralysis, but also still be in a dream state. So you can start to dream while being fully conscious, right? And so that would explain the shadow figures because you're seeing nightmares in your room in your space. While you're fully conscious. Your dream, Speaker 2 37:42 you're still dreaming, your brain is still creating images. Yeah, yeah. And so Tim Stone 37:47 the kind of explanation for like the jinn and the Succubus and things like that is, that was an ancient culture, who didn't understand all that they just knew that some people would wake up in the middle at night, and there would be something they're sure interacting with them in some way. And then they and they couldn't move. They they had like total power over them. Until they then woke up, right. And then the thing was gone. And so could it be just part of sleep paralysis? Sure. Could it be a demon? Sure. Could it be chin? Sure. Unknown Speaker 38:24 There's gonna leave it open. You know? Tim Stone 38:27 You just got to do your own research. Unknown Speaker 38:29 Could it be alien? Tim Stone 38:30 Aliens? Oh, that's a good question, actually. Because here's something that some people have pointed out. Looks a lot like the men and Black does it not Jaron Myers 38:42 I don't like the way you say. Oh, looks like you know, looks a lot like the Men in Black does it not? Speaker 2 38:52 Why do you say like that? Well, that's how we talk like you're some Brooklyn guy who's just like, Oh, we got him we got him in the block. God redhead Jaron Myers 39:01 it looks a lot like the man in black if you ask me. Like a frickin 50s detective who just like really followed a hunch. No, but looks a lot like the Men in Black to me. Tim Stone 39:17 He does though. He looks just like him. Here's the thing. Some people think it is it is a man in the black men and black aren't aliens. Yeah, they are not. Okay, all right. Let's take a second let me teach you a little bit about the men in black for a second. The Men In Black are totally aliens. People think the Men in Black is a government organization it's not so the whole story of men and black is that the reason why there's this cover up around the aliens is hard to do Speaker 2 39:45 and cut it pretty hard. Cuz you're just like, cuz I don't care. If you could just like go on. I love that. Tim Stone 39:56 The reason why there's like this cover up. It's not the government cut covering it up, it's the AC. I remember, and the men and black are aliens or Androids or something. And they're made to look like us made to look like people we could trust that come and be like, Hey, you gotta leave this alone. But they're controlled by aliens, whether they're Androids, or whether they're aliens and somewhere in skinsuit. But if you if you look at firsthand accounts of people who have experienced men and black, Speaker 2 40:20 their face opens up and they're, like, controlled by the thing or whatever. Tim Stone 40:24 Well, I mean, I don't know about that. But people people will say like, oh, well, I've tried to like, like, there's stories where people will have the Men in Black show up at their home and you're talking about real life stories. In the movie, I'm not talking about the movie. The life of the dreams, Unknown Speaker 40:39 fictional movie, I'm talking about real life I happened and Tim Stone 40:42 they'll offer them drinks to offer them food and they don't know what to do with it. And so like they'll they'll try to eat but it's clear that they've never done it before. Or like, or they'll I'm sorry, have you ever done this before? Unknown Speaker 40:57 How bad do you have to do it? To look like you've never done Tim Stone 41:07 never before. Speaker 2 41:08 That's a fun bit. When you go to a restaurant sit down and we just look at it and go Tim Stone 41:17 cut up the broccoli it just kind of like shove it in your ear a little bit Unknown Speaker 41:32 do disappear the server goes all right. Tim Stone 41:44 Are you ready for the bill? What is Bill? Unknown Speaker 41:49 Whose bill? Tim Stone 41:52 Was the thing like they'll say stuff like that? They'll be super monotone their skins weird. Their lips are weird. Speaker 2 42:00 That's what the YouTube comments say. Skins weird. Their lips are weird. I like these guys, man. Tim Stone 42:12 Okay, and black are the aliens coming to cover up their own. So this is the aliens coming to people in their sleep to either give them a message or to be like, Hey, you're digging into the alien thing a little too much. You need to back off Unknown Speaker 42:25 the conspiracies in the Benadryl? Tim Stone 42:27 Yeah. Have you ever thought about Benadryl? So that's a possibility is that it's actually the minute Black could be aliens could be the minute Black could be demons could be just hallucinations. Or? Honestly, here's what I think. This is gonna be a surprisingly normal thing. You're gonna be disappointed at how not crazy this is. Unknown Speaker 42:51 Okay. That's one of your intro quotes. Tim Stone 42:58 80s 90s is when this got like started to really or I should say, we don't know exactly the timeline. We know people who live were born 80s 90s Sure would reminisce about this when they went back into this blog to say oh X Movie Kid. There was a popular man who wore a hat Yeah, came in people's dreams and killed people in their dreams. Oh, I liked the Unknown Speaker 43:21 first one better. We don't get to see them. Okay, so about that. Tim Stone 43:25 But literally the story of Nightmare on Elm Street as he existed in the dream world, not in real life and dreams anymore fedora and he killed people in their dreams, and then show us the next you stuck in your dreams. His Speaker 2 43:38 skins weird. His lips are weird. Tim Stone 43:44 And so I think what happened? Here's what I think happened. Yeah, I Speaker 2 43:47 think people always that actually tracks because we'll always see Tim Stone 43:51 weird shadows at night in the ribs. I don't want to that has always happened. I think people will always in corners or in doorways. You like wake up at midnight and be like, oh, there's something there. And I think I think your brain tries to explain it do you use when possible explanation was Freddy Krueger then it became a popular one. That became something that existed on the Internet somewhere. Someone took a bunch of Benadryl saw it and made it and like had a hallucination and then talked about it in his Reddit. Speaker 2 44:22 So like if you are intending to hallucinate something Yeah, then you're much more likely probably going so Oh, dang it I just had a good follow up but it's gone now. The guy just the hat man just came in out of my head don't Tim Stone 44:39 say that a little bit. Yeah. Unknown Speaker 44:42 Oh I thought I borrow some more time maybe a comeback Tim Stone 44:55 and maybe you will no no Speaker 2 44:56 for real though. So do you think that when you wake up because As your body is in like a cuz I mean like I'm just thinking like, you know, people were saying like primitively like if you wake up in the woods, yeah. Like your body is on the highest alert. Yeah. And your your brain is doing the fastest assessment that it can. Yeah, because you've been unconscious until this moment and now it has to catch up. Yep. And so it's as also that's, you know when you wake up you're at your highest alert. Yeah. Yeah. Which is why the alarm a lot of times you'll jump or whatever Tim Stone 45:30 which is why I sprint down the hall every time the alarm in my house. Yeah, yeah just freakin going for it. I got a breath from that. But yeah, I mean like you wake up and your your brain is trying to make sense of everything around you and if there's a shadow or something, you know that you're not used to. That's why sleeping in hotels is difficult actually. Yeah. Because you wake up and your brain is like I don't recognize this place. Yeah, we should get out of here. We should go. Yeah, yeah, that's how I ended up naked in the lobbies a lot. Actually. Pretty. I'm not allowed to holidays anymore. Sorry. My brain told me I shouldn't be here. What are you? What are you doing? My brain she was said I shouldn't be here. Please. We agree. You should not be here. My brain grace. Goodness. I that makes sense. That's actually a really good. Yeah. I don't know why you saw him though. Speaker 2 46:34 I don't either. But I would like so. I don't like let's just say next is Halloween. All right, we've lived this month. This is my least favorite month. Because I don't like that scary. Movie Trailers are basically the scary movie. I'm just trying to enjoy a frickin show that I like. And then I got to watch The Exorcist. I didn't I don't want to sign up for this. I straight up that's that's what I'm saying. I did not sign up for this. I don't want that. I do I have to go through every year. Every October I have to go through and I have to block all these things on Twitter. Cuz they show these freaking videos. Yeah. Tim Stone 47:12 And as a scaredy cat. He's Speaker 2 47:15 telling you, I'm sorry. I'm telling you I sleep in hotels rooms by myself. And I do think that your brain goes this is unfamiliar. I don't like it. And so freakin Yeah, it's myself. Yeah. With also the images of Did you watch the brother this week? Not yesterday. Okay, well, it's you know how they every once awhile do an episode like the buddy games what he did. It's an episode but actually the whole episode is a commercial, Paramount's movies. Well, Paramount's doing a new exorcist movie. And half of Big Brother this week was a frequent exercise commercial. And the game is exercise themed. And so the little girl the exercise girl is showing up in the game. Tim Stone 47:52 Yeah. Speaking of complaints, though, Paramount plus driving full driving, because when you land on the the show, yeah. shows you recent episodes. Yeah, it just starts. How come? No one there was like, oh, spoilers. Yeah, they don't care. It happens all the time. Yeah, it drives me freaking Speaker 2 48:11 also that people who are making trailers for movies have also given up on spoilers, because what I'm saying is that the entire month, the Tim Stone 48:18 twist in the, because this is the best part. Speaker 2 48:21 I know. And they're like, we're gonna you know, and that's, that's maybe that's because we don't trust movies anymore. But it really is an issue where they're like, oh, by the way, it's a crazy twist at the end. And you're like, Well, I don't want to watch it now. Yeah, because you gave away the fun part. Yeah. Anyway, that's me. I was real passionate about that. And the next time I see the hat, man, I'm in a fistfight. I'm just gonna get up and I'm gonna actually I'm gonna go to his dreams and I'm a fist fight about his dreams. Tim Stone 48:48 Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna cover Oh, actually, nevermind Speaker 2 48:59 I don't like it. That sounds like you had an idea that you're gonna do to me. That's not a fun time. Just that will give me enough anxiety to last a month. That's great big fan. I'll be all the way in but Happy Halloween Happy Halloween Tim Stone 49:20 right next time you see that happen, you should feel Tim Stone 49:29 things either last night is a production of space Tim medium produced by Christian Taylor audio by Alex Garnett video by Connor Betts. Our graphics and our logo by Caleb Goldberg and our social media is run by Caleb Walker. Our hosts are Jeremiah and Tim stone. Follow us on your favorite social media platform at tilam podcast is t i o n podcast. Remember to tell all your friends about us. And we'll see you next Tuesday for another episode of things I learned last night. Transcribed by

The Hat Man is a mysterious and menacing figure haunting people’s dreams and waking hours. Imagine a tall, dark silhouette wearing an old-fashioned hat, like something from an old film. Witnesses often describe this unsettling entity as having piercing, glowing red eyes. But what is the Hatman? Hat Man Encounters: Real-Life Stories The Hatman has left many people baffled and … Read More

Adolphe Sax – The Remarkable Inventor of the Saxophone


Episode Transcription

Unknown Speaker 0:00 Don't leave all the bad stuff in. Speaker 1 0:01 Alright man, have you ever heard of Antoine Joseph Adolph sacks? Unknown Speaker 0:09 Are you done? I don't know if Unknown Speaker 0:11 you had more Antoine Joseph Adel sacks. Unknown Speaker 0:13 Yeah, he goes by Ayran. Unknown Speaker 0:15 Oh, no. Speaker 2 0:16 And associates, Aaron Sachs and Associates. Live Eris X associates. This is Travis Kelce. He's in my commercials for some reason. And I'm a lawyer. He's a lawyer. Unknown Speaker 0:27 He's a lawyer in Springfield. That's what I thought. Speaker 3 0:29 That's how I thought, okay. No, not him. Different eight off. He was born in 1814. A long time ago before his name became out of 98 Unknown Speaker 0:38 years before the Titanic 98 years. Speaker 3 0:42 He's in a significant person. Because well, let's Unknown Speaker 0:48 just tell the story. Speaker 3 0:52 I can't think of a better word for the saxophone then just sexy. And everyone's like, what is that I've never Unknown Speaker 1:00 heard so in train anything like that in Speaker 3 1:02 my life. Every wedding, I sneak off and try to find my way to the roof. And I really liked it. It was kind of like poetic, Unknown Speaker 1:09 that was never heard. Last night Speaker 3 1:23 so Adolf Sachs was born in 1814, in a town called de nom, Belgium. And this town was a French speaking Belgian town to a father who was a music manufacturer, like a instrument okay, Unknown Speaker 1:45 I couldn't remember the word Unknown Speaker 1:48 music, either music or musical, you know, Unknown Speaker 1:52 it's got that word. Yeah. Unknown Speaker 1:56 He's a beat builder. Speaker 3 1:58 And so I grew up in this home with a dad making musical instruments mostly woodwinds, but a little bit of stringed instruments. Okay. Was his dad's his dad's job. And his parents were what the modern public would call neglectful. But what the people in that time would call parents absolutely normal parents. It's the Unknown Speaker 2:19 kid who's kicking them out of the nest. Unknown Speaker 2:20 The kids the problem. Unknown Speaker 2:22 89 set them on the road with a stranger. Speaker 4 2:23 Yep, maybe he'll find a swamp or stuff. Maybe Speaker 2 2:28 he'll find another family. So he'd be getting a Shrek Have you seen that? Like the Shrek the Musical? Unknown Speaker 2:34 No, I haven't seen it. Have you though? I haven't actually watched like the musical. No, I've seen trek. Okay, obviously. Speaker 2 2:42 I don't remember dish. There's the movie Shrek start like this, where he like his parents are like, it's time for you to get out of here. Speaker 3 2:47 I want to be honest, the only part of Shrek I remember. Is all star by Smash Mouth. Unknown Speaker 2:53 Oh. Unknown Speaker 2:56 That's the only one. Speaker 2 2:58 Okay, so it opens on a swap? No, instruct the musical, which is very much worth your time. First, now. The opening number is, you know, it's his birthday. And his parents are like, now you're older. And now it's time to go away. All right. And it's like, like they're teaching them that the world's gonna hate him and pitchforks and all this stuff. And they're just like, Alright, get on son. Interesting. And it's just this little kid walking like this ogre kid. Speaker 3 3:36 I'm gonna learn that and I'm gonna hire like the cast of the original show. It's time to get ready. Turns 18 There are gonna be a lot of old party. Speaker 2 3:44 So I mean, like the Catholic there's some people who are like in their 40s I'm, they're gonna be like, you know, 70 by the time that happens Unknown Speaker 3:51 even better, and you can barely get the words out Speaker 2 3:59 Yeah, he paid our travel. That's why we're here. What you paid, they're trapped like you you hire, you're saying that you're gonna. I just wanna make sure that I understand your dreams. Because you're assuming that by the time your kid is 18, you will have enough income to hire the original Broadway cast of Shrek the Musical. Unknown Speaker 4:20 Yeah, I'm manifesting it. Unknown Speaker 4:27 You say so you sit down with your financial plan. Unknown Speaker 4:30 This is the goal. Speaker 2 4:32 What's your like? What's your like? 20 year plan? Oh, I'm glad you asked in 20 years, I'd like to hire the original cast or Shrek the Musical. For what are you my financial planner or a guy who asks a lot of questions. Okay, that Speaker 3 4:47 that's for my party planner and my party planner alone to know Yeah. I would expect confidentiality from you. And professionalism. I Speaker 2 4:55 hate the idea that in 20 years, you'll have like a party planner. Like somebody who's just obtain your regular party planner. Being rich must be so calm. You know? I'll call my party guy. Unknown Speaker 5:08 I got a party guy. Speaker 2 5:09 Oh, never say party parents go now it's time to go away. No, they Speaker 3 5:13 didn't. He's he's not even two years old yet. Here's the deal. In that day, everybody was like, Oh, your kids cursed. Let me tell you everything that happened to them. And you'll be like, Oh, you're bad parents. So here's the first your kids curse. Okay, so he's not even two years old yet. Like just learning to walk. He falls out a third story window, goes into a coma, but wakes up eventually survives. goes on with his life. A couple years later, he's three years old. He's in his dad's workshop. And he was dead Santa. No, he makes instruments remember? Oh, yeah. His music Unknown Speaker 5:52 shop. Speaker 3 5:55 Yes. And his dad had left some sulfuric acid out. And the kid, three years old thought it was milk. And so he drank it. So had pretty severe sulfuric acid. Unknown Speaker 6:10 Curse got him. Speaker 3 6:13 survived that couple of years later, he swallowed a needle and managed to pass it totally fine. Which is pretty, it's safe. Criss Angel. Unknown Speaker 6:28 That's where this is where he got it. This Unknown Speaker 6:29 is his inspiration. Unknown Speaker 6:31 He was the grossest part of the show. Speaker 3 6:34 He also burnt himself on a hot stove and got an infection from it because that was I guess, really common back then. It Unknown Speaker 6:43 was all this happening. Speaker 3 6:44 I mean, he's a child child. Yeah, this started at the age of one and it ran through his childhood. Speaker 2 6:50 He's more than just unlucky. Like he's he's kind of dumb. Yeah, Speaker 3 6:53 yeah, he He then got hit in the head from a roof tile that fell off of a building that he was standing by. And have you ever like like the old school like roof tiles like that? The Plaza has? Yeah. Tiles. Yeah, have you ever held one of those? They're heavy they're very heavy. Yeah, so it knocked him unconscious. And he went into a coma again was in a coma for a little while but survived that woke back up went about his life. Speaker 2 7:17 How was his cognitive ability at this point? Do you know like if he's fallen out but here's what here's what Speaker 3 7:24 we know from the his later life his cognitive ability was probably pretty fine. But I think whatever his like Don't be a person who sucks like receptors in his brain shut disconnected because he was kind of a tool the rest of his life. So I guess some cognitive damage. Like you still you relate. Unknown Speaker 7:48 I'm don't remember any of this stuff happening to me. Unknown Speaker 7:56 Have you talked to your doctor about that? Unknown Speaker 8:02 He also he drink varnish three different times. Unknown Speaker 8:05 Three different times. Yeah, Unknown Speaker 8:06 yeah. Speaker 2 8:07 I'll tell you what, this sounds like a guy who knows how much gasoline you can drink. Yeah, you would. Speaker 3 8:14 I mean, he's, yeah, he also drink arsenic. And then, on one fateful day, he a towns person in his town found miles from his house, floating facedown in the river, just getting carried by the current. So he dragged them out and the aid off, laid there for a couple of moments and then just kind of coughed up all the water and then got up and went about his day. Unknown Speaker 8:44 And his mom said was like, Thanks is mom, his mom, which way to my home? Unknown Speaker 8:49 Which way home? Speaker 3 8:52 His mom said about him that the boy is cursed. He's going to live a life of long suffering. The town called them the ghost, which is super cool. Unknown Speaker 9:04 Because he never died. He was I mean, I don't know what it was. Speaker 2 9:07 That did that develop. Like I'm an invincible kind of feeling. Is that? Is that what it is? Speaker 3 9:11 Was kind of cocky. Okay. And so in high school in high school, he got really into music. And he he like, became, I don't know what the word is. At this time. Being a band nerd was cool. It was kind of like playing guitar. Yeah, it was like, Speaker 2 9:31 Oh, you play clarinet? Yeah. Wow. Yeah, you're in clarinet Speaker 3 9:35 club wins. Yeah, yeah. And so he was kind of like, you know, a rock star, sort of, sort of. So he's living that life learning learning music and his dad. He's apprenticing under his father whose music Unknown Speaker 9:50 guy music manufacturer moves, Unknown Speaker 9:52 a beat boxer, Unknown Speaker 9:53 I'm sure a beat manufacturer and so they call them Speaker 2 9:59 Arby's. cuz he's got the beat. Unknown Speaker 10:03 Okay that's Speaker 2 10:08 pretty good my soundcloud my soundcloud name is Rossby you don't have roast But the ease are threes. So it's a roast B three three F, which is also the past so now you ever to capital R zero. At symbol Speaker 5 10:41 Yeah. As people would never guess it people never Speaker 2 10:48 roast and no new. Unknown Speaker 10:54 That's so good. Speaker 3 10:59 So this guy, he starts like kind of hobby making instruments. Okay, it's just kind of like, you know, let's go invent the French horn. Because I did. Because I did that first. I beat him to there. Close. He, he made a bunch of instruments kind of like when you were a kid, and you made instruments out of like tissue boxes and stuff. But he was making real instruments. So not a lot like, actually, now that I say that a lot. Okay. So he's building, he's building all these instruments. And in his late teens, he enters into a Belgian xx xx exhibition, a Belgian musician exhibition. Unknown Speaker 11:41 The Belgian musician exhibition. Unknown Speaker 11:44 He was remission. Speaker 5 11:48 I got stuck on a commission. I couldn't start with those. Okay, so Speaker 3 11:53 he interested in to this thing with a new instrument that he had invented, called the bass clarinet. Here's the thing. He didn't invent it. The bass clarinet existed, but it was not good. Everybody agreed that the bass clarinet sucked, because it wouldn't stay in tune. It was very quiet. And it was like hard to play. And it just didn't sound good in general. And so the bass clarinet was like, not popular instrument. He made this bass clarinet, they like curved upwards. So like it was louder, and then it could hold it tune. And it actually sounded good. And so he built this bass clarinet. Unknown Speaker 12:31 I understand where we're going. I think he didn't or okay. Speaker 3 12:34 And so it makes us bass clarinet. And at the exhibition, everybody's minds are free to do Speaker 2 12:39 that. So sexy. They would you say, What did you just say? That's that was the slang back. Yeah, so sex. Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Speaker 3 12:49 And everybody was like, Wow, this sounds great. This is really good. We love it. And then they pull them aside at the end of the exhibition. And they said, Hey, by Speaker 2 12:57 the way, the bass cleaner already exists. So you know, we just wanted to let you know, a little secret. You're Speaker 5 13:05 just what did you get dropped from a third story window as a child. Unknown Speaker 13:10 I was actually robbed. Yeah, Unknown Speaker 13:12 I walked. Unknown Speaker 13:13 I jumped. I Speaker 2 13:14 did that myself. That was nobody else's fault. Speaker 3 13:18 They told him, they said, they said, here's the deal, bro. This idea? Great idea. We love it. We love you. You're great. Sounds great. Looks great. Feels great. Everything about this is great. Okay, this deserves the gold medal. And he's like, sweet, and they said, but we're not gonna give it to Unknown Speaker 13:34 you because the other guy paid more. They said, Speaker 3 13:37 because you're too young. And if you win the gold now, then what are you going to do the rest of your life? Unknown Speaker 13:43 No. What are you going to work towards? Yeah. Speaker 3 13:45 What else you could accomplish if you don't win the gold. So we're going to give you the silver and Unknown Speaker 13:53 just to keep you hungry. Speaker 3 13:56 And he told them, he told them he said he said if I'm too young for the gold, then I'm too old for the silver. And he refused to accept it. Speaker 2 14:05 And I really took his saxophone and went home while I was a bass clarinet. Yeah, but he had been to the saxophone, right. It's a bass clarinet. At that point. Speaker 3 14:15 This is a bass clarinet. Oh, this is not a saxophone Unknown Speaker 14:22 is that one that's excellent was gold plated. Speaker 4 14:25 You actually might be actually or he's like it's a woodwind instrument, Unknown Speaker 14:29 but it's gold but Unknown Speaker 14:31 it's gone. Unknown Speaker 14:33 I'm not old enough for it. Unknown Speaker 14:37 Sorry, I'm too young for that Unknown Speaker 14:45 Oh, Unknown Speaker 14:46 don't touch my socks. You're too young Unknown Speaker 14:59 so he Yeah, Unknown Speaker 15:00 it's a bass clarinet, Unknown Speaker 15:02 bass clarinet. Okay. Unknown Speaker 15:04 So he very frustrated about this whole situation says, Unknown Speaker 15:08 Well, I don't want to do it. Then I quit. Yeah, he Speaker 3 15:10 says he says, I can't be around all these stupid Belgians. Any longer you people you don't know music. You don't know, waffles. What am I here for? And so he says, I'm moving to. Okay. And so he packs up with $42. Belgian dollars Belgian $1,800. I don't know what that is. Unknown Speaker 15:32 Hey, when does this episode come out? Unknown Speaker 15:35 October 24. Oh, why? Speaker 2 15:38 Oh, I was just trying to promote some shows, but they've already happened. Bummer. Yeah. Speaker 3 15:45 So, so he moved to Paris, with 42 bucks Speaker 2 15:49 to put it out earlier. Go ahead and promote October 15. I'm in Franklin, Tennessee, with John Auriemma. October 22. I'm in Denver, Colorado. Unknown Speaker 16:09 Are you going to give a call to action or invite them or Unknown Speaker 16:12 are you can? In wishing where there Unknown Speaker 16:18 can live in your regret. Unknown Speaker 16:21 All right, you missed it, loser. Speaker 3 16:25 So he moves to Paris. And he says he says that's where Speaker 2 16:28 it was. Paris was on. Oh, there you go. Speaker 3 16:33 He moves. He moves to Paris. And he says this is where I'll have my big break. Yeah. He says I don't need to try to please these people at these competitions. Sure. Get people excited about this. He says you know who I need to win over the army. Okay, and he says he says I'm going to Speaker 2 16:50 French army. Yeah, he said the French Oh, he did make the French horn. Speaker 3 16:53 He said the French aren't going to see this. I skipped ahead. Oh, no. Is it the French are gonna see he didn't make this the French horn. I think that had been around. Boy. Long. Yeah. looks old. It looks very old. That's that's an idea. That's an old old idea. That's an idea that people had back before our brains were Unknown Speaker 17:14 old idea, dude, it's Unknown Speaker 17:15 such a bad idea. Unknown Speaker 17:17 He couldn't agree the French horn. He's too young. Unknown Speaker 17:21 Is Bronze Age, bro. Unknown Speaker 17:24 Bronze Age idea. Speaker 3 17:27 So he, he says I'm gonna I'm gonna convince the army. If the army loves my music, then the world will love my knees. Speaker 2 17:36 Okay, what does the bell have to the army is like, Hey, what's your favorite band? You're gonna like this. Unknown Speaker 17:43 If it's not Nickelback, we kill you. Unknown Speaker 17:45 I like tech time. Okay, all right. Speaker 5 17:50 Well let that pass. You know why? Why? Unknown Speaker 17:53 Because I'm an Army guy. Hey, are ya? Yeah. Speaker 6 18:03 Army army army guy Unknown Speaker 18:09 as a call back, so. Speaker 3 18:12 So he's in Paris, and he's trying to get into the making instruments, okay. And he he's showcasing this bass clarinet at offense and stuff. And people in Paris don't like immediately they like he comes Speaker 2 18:26 space clarinet for a second. Sorry. It's bass clarinet. There's a space where you can have space. Remember how we're watching Big Brother right now? Yeah. Murad Cameron's trying to float that nickname Space Cowboy. He's really trying to get it to stick. Unknown Speaker 18:39 I love it. Speaker 2 18:40 Shut up. Stop there. I'm the Space Cowboy. Unknown Speaker 18:43 It's pretty great. Your cam cam Speaker 5 18:48 which if you think about it, some of the stuff he's done pretty Space Cowboy. Speaker 2 18:52 I'm gonna go into big brother cuz I'm gonna get on Yeah, especially now that we're we're going to live out there. Yeah, I'm gonna say I'm the ghost. Ghost. That's pretty pretty cool. Pretty sick. Speaker 3 19:04 And then you have to be the scariest person in the house. Oh, yeah. You need to convince production to like, build a fake wall that's like fabric Unknown Speaker 19:13 behind you could face through. Unknown Speaker 19:16 Get to see from across the house just Unknown Speaker 19:22 Hello guys. In the backyard, Unknown Speaker 19:25 the ghost. Unknown Speaker 19:28 Ghost of season 26 Unknown Speaker 19:30 We need to vote this guy out of the house and immediately Unknown Speaker 19:36 cast my vote to evict the go Speaker 2 19:42 Hi, Julie. You look wonderful tonight. I guess my votes it's official with 15. Will leave the house tonight. Unknown Speaker 19:57 She she comes in over the speaker and she's like Houska posts they all boo me as like yeah, you guys good yeah Speaker 1 20:16 Hey, thanks for checking out this episode. If you liked this, we've got a lot of great ones. Let me recommend a recent one hitch bot. Basically some Canadian scientists said what if we made a robot that hitchhiked across the country? You think it can make it? Spoiler alert it's a fun episode. I like it a lot. You can need to check it out. One of my favorite reason jokes is in there. So check that one out. But if not, thanks for being here Unknown Speaker 20:46 Space Cowboy Gaby often Okay, so he's Unknown Speaker 20:48 testing out his bass clarinet. He's Unknown Speaker 20:51 trying to be like, Hey, Speaker 3 20:52 he's going door to door. No, he's one of these events. And he's playing it and people are like, that's pretty cool. But honestly, you're not from around here. And you're also kind of a tool and you're really young. And you've got a lot of scars on your face. Yeah. freaks us out. And so he pretty much immediately and your names Speaker 2 21:08 too long by just choose one dude. The Anthony Amasis I ate off. It just sounds like his parents looked at the name book. And they were like the first seven will do. Unknown Speaker 21:22 Because video that was what? Yeah. Speaker 3 21:24 What are you What? Yeah, what? They ended up having 11 kids, they use three names on him. I'm curious at what point they like, slowed down. And we're like, just one just one. Yeah, they even named the 11. Yeah, Unknown Speaker 21:36 he has no name. That's Unknown Speaker 21:39 it. What's your name? Unknown Speaker 21:40 Ghost kid. My name is boy, a lot of callbacks. My name is Unknown Speaker 21:49 the 11th. So which is also cool. It's pretty safe. The the Speaker 3 22:00 Paris beat builder community said, Hey, we don't like you pretty quickly. Because he had really good ideas and they were jealous. I think it was also a tool. And he was also really young and he came in and he was like, he's like Hey, I got better ideas and all of you and they were like we've been doing this for 40 years and Speaker 2 22:16 curves at the bottom. You should call this the croissant clarity. And he was like this is stupid idea that Clara saw it levy gay. You should Unknown Speaker 22:31 we okay. We should Unknown Speaker 22:36 call it the croissant. Unknown Speaker 22:41 There's a specific person in our life who I'm Yeah, I know. Some of you. Unknown Speaker 22:52 Okay, so he Unknown Speaker 22:54 it's his wife. He's Unknown Speaker 22:57 he's probably the steak and he's getting his bat Speaker 2 22:59 a lot of sorry I am. I am making this back. This is my phone today. Dude. He's getting Speaker 3 23:05 so much hate for this. And all of his inventions. He's got to feel it. For example, while we're here. He invented this. This is called the trumpet. Speaker 2 23:16 This this is a Whoville instrument. Looks like one of the art installations of the Kansas City Airport. It Speaker 3 23:21 does is absolutely theirs. If you're wondering, yeah, do Dr. Seuss drew this? It looks like a Dr. Seuss trumpet. It looks like a trombone if there was 13 of them that got tangled up in a really bad car accident. Speaker 2 23:32 It was like a trumpet if that happened. Well, I mean, it's long. I mean, how does a person hold? Where's the Speaker 3 23:39 I think? I think the mouthpiece comes out see the bat Yeah, comes out. Speaker 2 23:43 To hold it like a trumpet. Yeah. And then like, I guess around Speaker 3 23:47 yeah, I couldn't imagine. I mean, this has got to be heavy. And it's too Speaker 5 23:53 loud. It's yeah, just a little Yeah, but you got a second Yeah, there you go. Unknown Speaker 24:02 Gotta learn how to make money Unknown Speaker 24:09 what's the point of that? Does it sound like Speaker 3 24:11 so here's the thing that you harmonize. Here's the thing he focused on a lot was that's Speaker 2 24:16 no go back to that. This is and hear me out here. This is brass pipes. Yeah, like bagpipes? Speaker 3 24:28 Ah, but brass I like I like where Speaker 2 24:31 brass types because I'm saying like the you know how harmonizes with itself? Speaker 3 24:35 Yeah. You might be right. Actually, it might harmonize with itself. Unknown Speaker 24:39 Yeah. Cuz he's got, I mean, it's got to, you know, Speaker 3 24:42 here's another he did a six piston trombone. So yeah, but here's the thing. What are his main focuses because this was before amplification. And so a lot of instruments is instruments. These instruments were pretty quiet at the time, and especially a lot of wind instruments because, I mean, they were This trumpets that you pointed seven pointed straight down. Yeah, sound went straight down. And so he was reengineering stuff. So it went straight at the crowd. And so he was changing the shape of a lot of these things to still get the same sound but the sound waves travel a little bit better. So like amplifies, okay, the cones on the outside of them a lot bigger. So they'd be louder was kind of the thing that he was known for doing. Yeah. They had chocolate, he had chocolate and little sprinkles on it. Speaker 2 25:33 I'll do the dumb parts. This is by sprinkling through the info let me do the stupid stuff. So the Info Wars Speaker 7 25:45 are trying to put sprinkles on our trumpet trying to put too many trombones together, looking over the trombone, please. There's a certain amount of Trump which isn't what God wanted. Unknown Speaker 25:57 God wants one drop out and one. flirty drop my phones. Speaker 7 26:04 Were hands all over it still really? Weird he bow. Unknown Speaker 26:12 So you made some enemies? Speaker 3 26:14 Yeah, people were out to get him. And then he had this revolutionary idea. Okay. He said, What if I'm playing my guitar. And there was a thing I could step on that would like, repeat whatever I just played, I don't know, like, loop it. And then I could let that go. And then I started slapping my guitar, like a beat on my guitar. He's making this up. And then I could maybe yell into it. He's mad. And it'd be like, he's stupid right now. No, yeah, he had an idea to put a bunch of stuff together. And so he basically was like, what if we had a woodwind instrument? That was also a brass instrument. And so he made the saxophone. And so it mixed two totally different kinds of instruments together, and no one had thought of that yet. And the music community was like, What the fuck is wrong with you? That's Unknown Speaker 27:02 going for gold. Speaker 3 27:05 The Music The music community took it like people doing loot pedals, because they were like, That's not. That's not how that works. You're not supposed to use that instrument like that. Okay? Or you're not supposed to use those materials. That way. You're using it wrong. But everybody else in the world was like, This sounds awesome. I love this. Put it in step up three. Unknown Speaker 27:27 They just hadn't heard the SNL intro yet. Unknown Speaker 27:30 How does that go? Unknown Speaker 27:36 You know, oh, sorry. We can't we're not Unknown Speaker 27:38 gonna have that. Yeah. So with that, hi. No. Speaker 2 27:43 I can see your face for you. And I'm ready to make fun of them. And then you let me go because you were like, dang, dang, he hit it. You didn't know that. I was in an acapella group. All right. Didn't Unknown Speaker 27:53 know that. Unknown Speaker 27:57 It's pretty obvious, brother. Yeah. You Unknown Speaker 27:59 don't have to tell me. All right. Speaker 3 28:01 So the actual music community was like, this is the dumbest thing I've ever seen in my life. And my fans, but everybody else was like, This is so sweet. Yeah. And so the first time he debuted like, Speaker 2 28:10 August Rush, yes. No kid playing the guitar like this. Yeah. And everyone else is like, Oh, what the crap and then Robin Williams is like you got spunk kid. I'm gonna put you in my shelter with all my other kids. That movie is weird. When you really think about your entire mount. You see that movie? Like he's just got like all these homeless kids together? Speaker 5 28:28 No, I don't. Oh, yeah, it Speaker 2 28:32 was it was Robin Williams real life. played himself in that. He had a group of homeless children together that were all music savant. Yeah, sounds pretty good. Unknown Speaker 28:42 How did you find them? Speaker 2 28:44 The music brought them together. That's kind of the point of the Do you not know if you've ever seen August Rush? It was like a huge movie. And like, I don't want to tell them five maybe. Unknown Speaker 28:55 Yeah, well, I wasn't a bad kid. So Speaker 2 28:57 there's the kid is the kid from Bates Motel and that artistic Doctor show? Oh, yeah. Which is a horrible representation of what autism is. It's also true. But yeah, he plays a guitar like this in the park. Because a homeless kid. Yeah. And then Robin Williams is like, Hey, I've got other homeless kids and you guys can be in a band. And I get all your money that you know, basically, it was like exploiting the children. Unknown Speaker 29:21 But anyway, a different version of school rock. Speaker 2 29:23 Kind of, yeah, but he like he's like some kind of music savant or whatever. And he writes the symphony. And then he ends up getting the the New York City Symphony to play it in. In I can't think of what the Central Park I played in Central Park. That's his mom and his dad, who, you know, hey, they're not together anymore. Oh, yeah. And rise from their graves. It was really weird at the end, Robert, no, he's on his dad here the symphony, and they both show up at the park and they rekindled their love Oh, yeah. And they found their kid. I don't know Unknown Speaker 30:01 how that's hard. Speaker 2 30:04 I guess I should rewatch that movie. It doesn't Well, now that I'm trying to explain to you a little, but it's been so long, you know, the ending scene though. We're like, the symphony is playing his music. And the parents are like, This just sounds like they it's almost like they like the I know this song. You know? And then he's, they're conducting, it turns around, it's literally he's just and there's his parents, you know? And then they kill Robin Williams on stage. exploiting these kids, it was a wild twist a weird movie, dude. And they pan out Speaker 2 30:55 the Madagascar animals are in the movies just blending together. It's kind of like, really, when you think about it. It's like they took a brass and woodwinds and put it together together. You know? Oh, my God, who? pillars of the music industry? Unknown Speaker 31:18 Together? Yeah. Speaker 3 31:21 So he had this idea for the saxophone. It became the saxophone. He wasn't calling it the saxophone at the time. He was calling. There's a name. Come Unknown Speaker 31:27 on. We'll figure that out later. Speaker 3 31:30 He, he said this is this is good. This is yeah, really got something here. Yeah. But he's like, but I don't have a patent on this. And he's like, I want to show it off. But he was nervous that the crowd that hated them, the local Paris, Munich. We're gonna steal his idea. So he goes and does a showcase with it. But he stays behind the curtain the whole time. So that way, no one can see it. He's like if they can't see it. If so it's like an orchestra. Oh, sketchy. Let's do the thing. Speaker 2 31:56 And there's a weird, middle of the stage. And he's just back there, like, Unknown Speaker 32:02 and everyone's like, what is that? Speaker 2 32:03 I've never so entrain, anything like that in my life? Is he doing that with the curtain? Currently the instrument and then he just goes, he just goes, thank you. Unknown Speaker 32:15 Jesus loves you very much. In today's lesson, Unknown Speaker 32:21 we started to get felt puppets of ourselves. That's a whole I Speaker 3 32:23 forgot about that. This showcase that he did was a very tactical showcase. Because he knew the king was going to be their king of France. And he said, If he hears this, he said, I know that's my end. What the? That's my end. What do you see? What's his deal with your okay? And so, lo and behold, showcase ends immediately the king's like, give me the guy behind the curtain. Unknown Speaker 32:45 I think it's more just mystery at that point. You know, he Unknown Speaker 32:50 does see behind the curtain. Speaker 2 32:51 I do. I do think that might have played a factor in it. Like I mean, much like undercover billionaire. Yeah. Where it's like, oh, crazy. We got so busy at our barbecue stand. And it's like, yeah, dude, you have a camera crew. Yeah. It's like crazy that we got the Kings attention. And it's like, yeah, you're hiding something from him? Yep. Speaker 3 33:09 Yep. It's just like, if I am at a wedding, I sneak off and try to find my way to the roof. Every wedding. And I found my way to the roof about eight weddings. This is a real thing. Unknown Speaker 33:20 This is 100% of real thing. I've Speaker 3 33:21 been on the roof at about eight of the weddings I've been to most weddings have roof access somewhere most wedding venues. And so you can get out there. The question is, do they have a padlock on the hatch? A lot of them do? Did she not all of them do? Unknown Speaker 33:38 You didn't do that at our wedding. Yeah, Unknown Speaker 33:41 yours was different. Because it was Unknown Speaker 33:42 because I was with you the whole time. Like you're not getting on this roof. You will Speaker 3 33:47 not make it on this room. No, yeah, I didn't try it there because it wasn't like a venue. But venues venues typically will have like a closet somewhere with a ladder to the roof. Sure. And so yeah, I've done that at like eight weddings. Okay, so this isn't a Unknown Speaker 34:04 thing. We're like, just party tricky. Unknown Speaker 34:06 Do you see it? It's not a party. Unknown Speaker 34:08 I usually do flirt with the bride's mom. Unknown Speaker 34:12 I do what I do for the roof. A Bartha roof. Is that cool? So what's your number? Unknown Speaker 34:28 In front during the first days everyone's just I'm such a distraction. Geez. Well, the beta leaving that in. So so the curtain is there. And the king is like, I gotta know what Speaker 3 34:51 I gotta know. And so he talks to him. And he says, he says, Hey, he's like, Have you ever thought about the army? And he's like, actually, yes. And he's glad you brought it up. He said, I want to be the army beat builder. And he says, You got the job, sir. And so he fires the guy who's currently doing it. And now he's the guy who's going to make all the music for the army. And this was still at the time when armies had musicians that would like go out to war with them. You know, I'm talking about Speaker 2 35:19 Yeah. Because that's how they would didn't identify what like, that's how they give signals and stuff. Speaker 3 35:25 And he really genuinely believed that the saxophone was going to be like the turning point in war combat. Yeah, that that was going to inspire the troops to Unknown Speaker 35:37 new or machine Unknown Speaker 35:40 he's Majan that here's the thing for now Speaker 3 35:42 because the exactly I don't know of a better word for a saxophone. There's Speaker 2 35:46 you got it. There's the one of those called dang it read. Yeah. Why did you know that? And I didn't for a second. I'm a musician because you gotta like lick it. You know, he's like out there on the frontlines just Unknown Speaker 36:09 tuning in. Unknown Speaker 36:11 Now you tune it before the battle. You gotta be prepared. Unknown Speaker 36:13 Oh, yeah. I mean, like there's not friggin this cannons. Yeah. You know? Speaker 3 36:23 That's the thing to me. Because like, you think of like those wars, where they had musicians and it's like, the drums and the flutes. And it's like, it's like, kind of that's kind of watery. But Unknown Speaker 36:34 the saxophone ads kind of worry. Yeah, Speaker 3 36:37 the saxophone. I can't. I can't think of a better word for the saxophone than just sexy. Like the sound makes. And on the Speaker 2 36:50 I think I wrote I saw Alex write that down. He's putting that in. No, you can you can say it. He's just gonna put it in the intro. Because he's gonna have you go. I can't think of a better word for the saxophone than sexy. There's just something about that sax, but Unknown Speaker 37:08 the instrument the instrument like I just pictured the light smooth. What's that? Unknown Speaker 37:17 You know, I'm talking about Speaker 2 37:18 what you were just singing sounds like a game show and true. Unknown Speaker 37:22 No, it's the Unknown Speaker 37:31 Yeah, yeah. Unknown Speaker 37:32 The Price Is Right. No. Unknown Speaker 37:35 Keep doing it. Keep doing it. Unknown Speaker 37:40 And I just picture like that on a battlefield. Unknown Speaker 37:43 Yeah. Did you bite it? Doo doo doo doo doo doo doo. See? isn't that scary? Speaker 3 37:55 I mean it is. But also with the sound of like explosions and death and war happening all around you with an instrument that's like pretty provocative Unknown Speaker 38:09 like just imagine hearing that like lick the Unknown Speaker 38:14 over some dude who just like Speaker 4 38:24 like, it just I don't think it fits the I think it's like read the room, man. So anyway, the rest of Unknown Speaker 38:33 the rest of the music community. Speaker 2 38:35 Yeah, is furious and he's succeeding, furious that Speaker 3 38:38 he's getting they're furious that he's gotten his saxophone on the battlefield because they wanted their phones on the battlefield. I don't know Unknown Speaker 38:43 what you're making Speaker 3 38:52 Okay, and so they they begin this weekend along feud with the parents, musical world. And he in every disagreement, he gets in with anybody. He immediately challenges them to face off like, instrument face on Yeah, musical face off. And so they go back to back they take 10 paces, they turn around and play the best tune they can. And the winner gets shot. The winner shoots Unknown Speaker 39:25 the loser. Yeah. Unknown Speaker 39:27 And gets a gold medal. Unknown Speaker 39:30 And he's like, Isn't this what you wanted? This is what you want. I went for gold. Speaker 3 39:36 And so these duels get progressively more and more grandiose, like it started out just like a one on one like, yeah, Dueling Banjos situation. But eventually it turned into he's like, Speaker 2 39:47 Yeah, and he's got to finally beat the final boss at the end, which is the devil, Speaker 3 39:52 the devil of self. Now a couple years into this, the whole thing spiraling out of control. He gets into a duel with someone and he says he says I can have In a an orchestra of 11 people that will beat you in a duel if you have 1600. And they did it these people got together a 1600 person orchestra. And one because that's how. Speaker 2 40:12 Okay, let's imagine putting together a 1600 member orchestra and you're going around and it's out of spite. Like, it's like, Hey, you guys were put together a spite orchestra. Unknown Speaker 40:23 Fight is a cool baby. Speaker 8 40:25 Spite orchestra will be taking place on the town square 1600 Strong versus 11. Speaker 3 40:38 Last week, saxophones, he only got a silver medal. They call them silver. So Unknown Speaker 40:48 he won that duel, because I think Speaker 2 40:50 they couldn't figure out how to practice 1600 people. Speaker 3 40:54 Yeah, there's no 1600 person practice room out of angel. He could have they could have gotten big enough for it. No, I also, can you imagine I imagine putting that together anybody who's ever been on a worship team? And like looked at Planning Center, Speaker 2 41:08 bro. 1600 people on the worship team before that is rough the Unknown Speaker 41:12 crowded stage. Yeah. Speaker 3 41:15 So he won that duel. And after that duel, the group got together and they said, This is not how big Unknown Speaker 41:21 was the group of 1600 people faced off. You know, Unknown Speaker 41:24 there was a big group of people that didn't like him. Speaker 2 41:28 Essentially, an entire theater of people is just like, we want to destroy, Speaker 3 41:32 we want you ruined, we want everything about you. I hope you die. absolutely ruined. Speaker 2 41:42 Hey, it's me. Again, thanks for being here for this episode. If you like what we're doing, it does cost us money to do this. And so just think about that. You know, that's it. We have Patreon supporters. And it really helps us to make this show possible. Honestly, we're so grateful for everyone who listens to the show. But there's, there's people who want to make more of it happen and so they financially support the show. And you get a lot back for it. You get our private discord where we chat every day we're hanging out and just getting to bond and hang out. We also do live zoom Hangouts for our Patreon supporters. You get exclusive merch, it's a good time, there's a lot there's a lot in it for you. And it's a lot easier for us because we get to know you better. You know, you're not just a number and a stat board or whatever. But you know, you're our friends and we appreciate you a lot. So consider doing that. If not, then you can listen to this dumb little ad, because that's how we're gonna get money from you. We're gonna leech from you either way. We're gonna get paid. We're in this for the cold hard cash baby. Unknown Speaker 42:44 Anyway, here's an ad. Unknown Speaker 42:45 How do they how do they get it though? I realized I forgot to put a CTA in mind. Oh, dang, we're doing Speaker 2 42:51 Yeah, they can text Tillandsia 66866 Thanks, Jared Speaker 3 43:02 these people because this this epic loss and because they hated them so much. They wanted the army back on their side. They wanted their phones at war. They said we need to put together a coalition a coalition against Adolf sacks. Okay, and so they created the Paris musicians group. And the main goal was to ruin it off sacks. Like that was why they existed they would get together guys amazement is starts Speaker 2 43:35 to sound like something I want. You know, I would love if there was a coalition against Geron group. That's just can we set up like any anti Patreon? Can we like, is there like an option of like, hey, for five bucks a month? You can like, make my life harder. Speaker 5 43:56 That's pretty funny. What is the what is the perks? Speaker 2 44:01 Like for every subscriber, that's how many times I get slapped every morning? Every Unknown Speaker 44:05 morning? Yeah, someone comes in and slaps you and just, Unknown Speaker 44:06 I mean, yeah, Speaker 3 44:09 but for if you give $20 Then someone will drive around in front of you and drop nails out the back door. Speaker 2 44:14 Yeah. Or just drive around in front of me just slow. You know, you're a bit like that ruins my three under just stuff that really kills me, you know, by playing the long game trying to give me an ulcer. You know, that's pretty good. I like that. It seems like the people who work in my apartment are already on that Patreon game. Speaker 3 44:33 It tell you they tell your stories that you already told. And then just say um, but like, not good. Unknown Speaker 44:38 Oh, my gosh, dude, though. They Speaker 2 44:39 come to me when I'm mid story and they jump the end. I tell good stories. Yeah. And then people jumping in there. I was telling somebody the other day. I was like, you know, here's, we got a text from our neighbors and stuff and then someone jumped in with it. We're moving to Los Angeles. I was getting there. I'm Speaker 3 44:55 working on it. If you would let me work on it. That story made Speaker 2 44:59 it cool. and obvious who jumped in and i Oh, my bad. Speaker 5 45:05 If you're listening, you know who you are. She's so does everyone else. She's now Unknown Speaker 45:10 my lover. So they chose bad stories. Speaker 3 45:14 Their main goal in in their group was to financially ruin him. So that way he kind of do what he's doing anymore. That's wild. So they started suing him a bunch. And so they took him to court. The first lawsuit that they took against him was a lawsuit where they said he can't own the patent for the saxophone, because the saxophone doesn't exist. And the court either argument, and eight off sacks his defense was to do this. Speaker 2 45:44 Oh, his last name is snacks. Yeah, that makes a lot more sense. That's Unknown Speaker 45:48 where the name came from. Speaker 2 45:49 That was my bad. I was dumb earlier. I forgot that his last name was sex. Unknown Speaker 45:53 They really come up with the French, I'd like you to go Speaker 2 45:57 edit that part out where earlier, I was like, are we gonna find out why it's called the saxophone? Because I, I just feel like a big old dummy right now. Yeah, you should. So he was like, I got one. Speaker 3 46:09 Yeah, they were like, they're like, it doesn't exist. And then they the court was like, What's your defense? And he went, who? Speaker 2 46:13 And the court when it exists? It is real. Speaker 3 46:18 And so that didn't work. So he won that case? Yeah. And so then they brought another case against him. In this case, they said, they said, here's the deal. So the telephone does exist. Okay. But he's stolen. This has been around for forever. And the court says, Well, what's your proof? And they said, Look, we have four examples of saxophones that have the logos from manufacturers and dates on them all over the world, long before sax was even born. And what the court was able to find out through some investigative journalism, I guess, I don't know. There's some YouTuber who tracked it down. Guys Gone missing. These guys just bought four saxophones Unknown Speaker 46:57 from Aaron Zach from him and then Speaker 3 47:01 played on sax. And then they shipped them off to these manufacturers, and they said, hey, we'll pay you really well. If you scratch off his logo, and you put yours on and put some date like 200 years ago, how Unknown Speaker 47:09 many is he sell it? Speaker 3 47:11 I mean, he's like a real business now. Like he's selling these orchestras. He's selling them to the army, like he's manufacturing these. And so that case last because they were like you were he's like, this is my like, this is fraud. And they're like, what's fraud? They're like, we haven't made that law yet. But it 20 years from now you go to prison, as exactly what that conversation Yeah. And so that it worked. So then they just, they just kept bringing different lawsuits of like, a, your parent can't or because of this, or whatever, you Unknown Speaker 47:37 can be this ugly in Speaker 5 47:38 public. That's the rules. That's the rules. Hey, you can't be cursed and make stuff. Speaker 2 47:43 We were trying to find laws in Westminster, Colorado, because that's where my show is on October 22, that you missed listener. But we were trying to find laws and one of the laws we couldn't try. We were trying to confirm this is that it's illegal to get lost in Westminster, Colorado, and just waiting the hours of 9pm and 10am. To legal to be Unknown Speaker 48:06 lost. And that sounds Unknown Speaker 48:10 pretty. Unknown Speaker 48:12 It's because of bears. Unknown Speaker 48:14 Oh, okay. Yeah. No one's not. Yes. What are you talking about? It's Speaker 3 48:19 because of bears. Why would it be because bears eat people between Speaker 2 48:23 and they're saying like, hey, they're trying to victim blame you like if you if you get Speaker 3 48:28 out that late. It's your fault. We can't help you. Is that No, because the Child Tax late at night shot? Speaker 2 48:35 I was thinking it sounds pretty sundown townie. Oh, that does actually they're like they pull them over and then you lost. Yeah, it's like that's a weird law that has been in the books. That's worse. That's worse the way it was. Yeah. Yeah, dude. Yeah, it's a little worse than bears. Because they also traveled backs. Unknown Speaker 48:56 Take you up and there's a bear in the backseat. Speaker 2 49:01 I don't know there we were trying to look up was like, That was a weird one that was on there. Yeah, that's Speaker 3 49:05 crazy. So he's gone to these legal battle after legal battle after legal battle. It's just wasting like, they're just trying Speaker 2 49:10 to waste resources to try. Yeah, Speaker 3 49:13 yeah. And then one day, he had an idea. He said, Fine. I'm going to not have a patent. I'm gonna make it open source. It's free use. If you guys can build it, you can build it. And a year later, nobody was able to replicate it. And then because no one was able to replicate it. He was able to go to the court and be like, Hey, I'm the only one who can make this and they're like, Okay, you got the patent. Unknown Speaker 49:41 Which is kinda cool. Unknown Speaker 49:43 Kind of freakin sick. Like, Unknown Speaker 49:45 freakin sick. No, I probably fine. Speaker 3 49:49 Do it. Fine. Make it make it you want to make it make it make it Wow. And no one could. And so they were really upset of the Speaker 2 49:59 Divine knowledge given from a roof tile hitting you in the head. Unknown Speaker 50:04 God told me how to make this when he hit me in the head with that tile when Speaker 2 50:07 I was in that coma. I thought of like so many musical instruments, each of several of them highly unpractical. Unknown Speaker 50:16 You will believe what I when I saw that needle, Unknown Speaker 50:20 it was just going down there. And I was like, How do I get this out? Speaker 3 50:23 How do I get this out? So he he got away with a patent, and they were really, really upset about this because they said, Hey, he's got the patent. Yeah, the court thing isn't working anymore. And so they did the only logical next step. They hired an assassin. Yeah, I tried to kill him for sure. And the problem was, he's cursed the assassin. Yeah. For some reason, they said, I don't know if they gave him the wrong mark or the wrong picture, or the wrong person, they might have given them this image of him. And so that's, I mean, Unknown Speaker 50:58 that could be anybody. Here's a picture of what he actually looks like. Speaker 2 51:06 Okay, so they are cool guy who sits backwards on a chair. Speaker 3 51:10 Yeah. Yeah, he's definitely full of himself. I don't know what it was if the assassin gave the wrong mark, or if this was intentional, but the assassin attempted to assassinate his assistant, not him. And so he technically survived an assassination attempt. is a system survived to Oh, but he fired him. His performance was really bad after that. Unknown Speaker 51:30 He's like, Yeah, you're not the same as that. You lost that leg? Unknown Speaker 51:33 Yeah, you just haven't been the same after all that trauma. Speaker 2 51:36 Oh, my gosh, every day come in. I'm just, I'm trying to make saxophones and you're like, Okay, I'm really struggling with. I'm part of paranoid I think I'm being followed. You know, it's like, Dude, you survived. Get over already. Unknown Speaker 51:49 Every time they test it. Speaker 8 51:51 People just don't want to work these days. You know, Speaker 3 51:55 you get one attempt at your life. And now all of a sudden, you're lazy. Speaker 2 51:58 Oh, you want workers comp and you want benefits? If you want me to like, be on the lookout? Speaker 3 52:05 Do you think I was thinking about workers comp when I was floating facedown down the river? You need Speaker 2 52:10 brushes with death? Yeah, in order to fully comprehend the power of life. Unknown Speaker 52:15 Anyways, give me some gold to put on this. Unknown Speaker 52:18 You know why? Speaker 3 52:21 So they kind of pairs the coalition of people who hate to this guy. They kind of backed off a little bit because the assassination attempt felt like nothing they could do. Could do. Okay, Unknown Speaker 52:34 I'm sticking with that. Speaker 3 52:35 I said a phrase this morning. That I'm going to say a lot from now on. I really liked it. Cool. I was Unknown Speaker 52:44 go on. I don't want to hear it. Speaker 2 52:49 I said a little phrase this morning that I think I'm gonna add to my eyes. Cool, man. I'm glad to hear it another time. If you're gonna say it a lot. I'm sure I'll pick it up. Unknown Speaker 53:01 So he goes Unknown Speaker 53:04 say your phrase so Unknown Speaker 53:05 it's fine. Unknown Speaker 53:09 It's fine. So Unknown Speaker 53:10 his career Unknown Speaker 53:12 What was your phrase? Speaker 3 53:14 I was talking about how yesterday was kind of like a rough day and I was hoping today was gonna be a better day. And I said hopefully today is a better trip to the well. And I really liked it. It was kind of like poetic Speaker 2 53:27 that was a overheard hoping for a better soldier Winslow book. It'll Yeah, it will be in that first show. It is for sure. Hope that tomorrow is a better trip to the well. Speaker 3 53:37 Yeah. And then it gets shot by the dude with the sex. Speaker 2 53:41 So I want to make sure you're paying the seat you're the author of The tomorrow is a better trip to the well. Sorry to Winslow said as the sun fades Unknown Speaker 53:52 and then bang bang Speaker 5 53:57 Yeah, it was it was more like a bag. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, well, yeah, there you go. Okay, go yes. harmonized. Unknown Speaker 54:16 hate this Unknown Speaker 54:20 so yeah, he's survived the coalition. Okay. As he's gone through, Unknown Speaker 54:26 he sued them for attempting to assassinate him. Speaker 3 54:28 No. He's like, he's like, he's like, Hey, if you can kill me, you can kill me. Unknown Speaker 54:34 A year later. He's like, they can't kill Unknown Speaker 54:36 they they're not gonna Unknown Speaker 54:37 get I pat myself. Unknown Speaker 54:41 Can we do that? Actually, Speaker 3 54:42 can we put a patent into the patent office of ourselves? Can I patent me? Unknown Speaker 54:48 I'm one of the kind of one Speaker 2 54:50 of the guys I did think. Is it funny to me it is to sell mugs with our tilam logo on it. Instead of the TM just put the words patent pending. Unknown Speaker 54:58 That's very funny. Okay. Speaker 3 55:02 So he ended up being done in he lost his big army contract because the French Revolution Oh, so power switched over and they were like, Hey, we got a different guy who's heard the people saying yeah the new guy was like we want Metallica down down Unknown Speaker 55:28 down down powwow Speaker 6 55:35 we mean, so much more. Unknown Speaker 55:41 You see that well that they just put out? Speaker 3 55:44 Yes. They put out like a remix of beautiful that down. But they had a bunch of people cover it. Yeah. And they're big names. Speaker 6 55:50 JOHN BEILEIN did to live. Yeah, yeah. And I wow. surprised. Unknown Speaker 55:56 Surprised the John Beilein did that. Speaker 3 55:57 I'm surprised that they were able to get the names that they got brother Switchfoot. I mean, I know think but switch, switch. Switch for it was big in church and youth group culture. But it was it was one of those it was one of those was huge youth group culture. And they dip their toe in that everything. Speaker 2 56:12 No, but I think I think Switchfoot was one of those bands. That was for people who really liked music. Yeah, their stuff is almost like, you know, what's called place first album, rush of blood to the head or whatever it is. I mean, revolutionary. Yeah. For that time. Yeah. Switchfoot was also pretty revolutionary. That's why it crossover. Yeah. And so I think a lot of the artists these days grew up. Speaker 3 56:40 Maybe Maybe, it's just it's I mean, it's look at the tracklist it's pretty impressive. The names that they've got that add covered some of that stuff. It was hard to believe looking through it. Speaker 2 56:49 Yeah. Track 14 Is the cast of Shrek the Musical. Unknown Speaker 56:55 It was God. God, that's my strength. You Speaker 2 57:01 know, it'd be more like he had the end of the track. It's just silent for 30 seconds to strike the musical like mixer. Like, the song kind of fades out. It's silent. It's over. And then it goes to the next song. Speaker 3 57:18 Yeah, so he loses his career pretty much overnight. And he's he's already declared bankruptcy three times because the legal battles like he's the cost of the legal. The law, the cost of the law cost him a lot. Unknown Speaker 57:33 You're so annoying today. Speaker 3 57:37 But he was still like trying to invent stuff and make instruments and things like that. But then one day, Unknown Speaker 57:43 this will bring us peace. This will bring Speaker 3 57:45 us well he won't have war. He was he was a part of the war machine. Made him profit. So he was he loves going Speaker 2 57:51 to war machines. You see that missing plane the other day? Speaker 3 57:55 Yeah, that's you see that Alex? Wild suspect Speaker 2 57:59 that the government is just like hey guys, there's an F 30 live we can't find yeah if you could just look up maybe yeah, let us know if you see me at home if you see it just texting this Speaker 5 58:08 war machine texts jet to us Unknown Speaker 58:16 you know that would help us a lot. Yeah. Unknown Speaker 58:18 Takes jet to 1776 Unknown Speaker 58:21 and then you don't have to pay taxes Speaker 2 58:26 I'm so mad at million dollar jet but you're still mad at me. Like if I like I just mess up my two if I claim. Unknown Speaker 58:35 Yeah, yeah. No, it looks like Unknown Speaker 58:37 you claimed this Chick fil Unknown Speaker 58:38 A meal. Were you really on the road? Unknown Speaker 58:39 I don't know. We're where was that when you Speaker 3 58:43 tell me where the jet is. Find the jet. They did find the jet. Yeah, but you know what it was my saxophone saxophone took it down. Speaker 2 58:55 You could do that actually. in your backyard. You could take out whole airliners. That's why they won't let you get out. They won't let you get on the plane. Speaker 3 59:06 Yeah, well, that's the thing they make you put it on airplane mode because they don't know what's in your Spotify playlist. Those tones man. Unknown Speaker 59:14 So anyway, Speaker 3 59:17 so so he's still trying to invest are still trying to make instruments. But then his lip starts to swell his lower lip and long story short, it's a tumor. He has cancer and his lip. Yeah. And his lip and it ends up growing to a very large like pomegranate size tumor. Oh my god. Very large tumor, making it really difficult for him to live and play. wind instruments. Yeah. Unknown Speaker 59:42 And that can happen. Lip cancer, Speaker 3 59:45 I guess. You get it a lot if you like to tobacco. That's a really common tobacco chewers Unknown Speaker 59:52 gums. Those gum? Unknown Speaker 59:53 I mean, they get both. It's interesting. Unknown Speaker 59:57 Yeah, a lot of people get that little.on their lip Speaker 3 59:59 Yeah. Yeah. But they he after like five years of kind of suffering with it, he had the opportunity to get treatment. And so you could either have it surgically removed, or there was this hot new doctor. Unknown Speaker 1:00:18 This is a weird way to save Unknown Speaker 1:00:21 your doctor. You had a radio station on the go Unknown Speaker 1:00:25 Texaco, Texaco? Speaker 3 1:00:29 No, there was this doctor out of India, who had this like herbal medicine. And he was like, you want to try it? And so he was like, Yeah, I'll try it. Try it. And it killed him. Speaker 4 1:00:42 He died. No, it cured him. It cured the kids are. And so Unknown Speaker 1:00:48 the government doesn't want you to know that though. So Speaker 3 1:00:49 they don't want you Yeah. And so he drank this tea for six months. And as slowly started to go down until eventually he didn't have it anymore. And so not even cancer could kill this guy. And so he survives that. And then he goes on to invent his best invention yet. Wasn't the saxophone. He then went on to invent. I wish there was an image of this that never made it to production. But he's talked about it. So I don't know how far along in the invention process he was with this. Okay, we know, he invented what he called the Saxa cannon, which was what it sounds like actual cannon that he said will be able to demolish a whole city by firing a 10 meter wide round. Weighing 550 tons. I don't know if it will ever work. Okay, so. And it looked like this. That's what I was wondering here is the 13th trumpet thing in that awesome Unknown Speaker 1:02:01 that he wanted mass destruction. Unknown Speaker 1:02:03 Yeah, that's that was. That was his idea from the beginning. He would love the Unknown Speaker 1:02:07 1900s When did he die? Speaker 3 1:02:11 He died and he died of old age. Believe it or not, that's crazy. An 1894. He was 7079 years Speaker 2 1:02:18 old man. He almost made it. He made it. He would love the 1900s dude. Yeah, he was stuffed that they destroyed. He would have been Speaker 3 1:02:25 on the Manhattan Project. Oh, for sure. Like, hey, I don't know what we could use you for. But we'd love Speaker 5 1:02:35 it could you moisten up this bolt for this new key Speaker 5 1:02:45 we only know how to make nukes because of the saliva of x. Unknown Speaker 1:02:50 That's crazy. Speaker 3 1:02:54 Yeah, so that's where the saxophone came from. It was an instrument that was primarily used in combat. In its early days. orchestras picked it up too, but primarily used in combat. And the hard and fast music. Are they? Unknown Speaker 1:03:11 Like, what do you like? Speaker 4 1:03:17 I will. Okay, is it whatever do that again? Okay, do it one more time. No, not that. Speaker 9 1:03:26 Up, up, up, up, up, up. Up, up, up, up, down. Speaker 3 1:03:29 Yeah. Now do it. Do it again. But kind of elongate. Just a little sexy. Unknown Speaker 1:03:33 Yeah. Okay. Do it. Do it. Do it hotter. Speaker 9 1:03:43 Bah, bah, bah. Bah. Bah. Unknown Speaker 1:04:11 I know what it was. I'm a comedian. Unknown Speaker 1:04:14 Oh my gosh. Unknown Speaker 1:04:19 Yeah, dude, that's out. Jokes work. Unknown Speaker 1:04:26 That's good. That's good. Speaker 3 1:04:29 So yeah, many years many moons later. Jazz musicians found the saxophone. And it kind of became a legendary instrument after that. The saxophone is like the electric guitar of wind instruments. There's not a cooler pretty stated Speaker 2 1:04:43 goal when that isn't one of my biggest regrets. I mean, I got good scholarships, because I did low brass. But I wish that I had done saxophone. Yeah, Unknown Speaker 1:04:51 yeah. It's a cool, because it's just cool. You can pick it up. Speaker 8 1:04:55 Yeah, you know, I think that but then I remember a couple years ago, there's Speaker 2 1:04:59 another comedian in Kansas. City who was picking up the saxophone? And it was, it was weird. You know? Like, it's weird when someone Our age is like, yeah, picking up the saxophone. You're like, hey, no, that's that sounds like you're trying to make friends with a sixth grader. Unknown Speaker 1:05:15 No, yeah. No, it's a little weird. It's not it's not bad to have new hobbies. Yeah, get Unknown Speaker 1:05:19 a get a cool one. Like, Unknown Speaker 1:05:21 like trains by train sets. Oh, you know? Yeah, yeah, Unknown Speaker 1:05:28 it's not. There's nothing you know, Unknown Speaker 1:05:31 I'm learning that primarily for war. Unknown Speaker 1:05:34 As I'm learning Chinese Speaker 2 1:05:38 Duolingo. See, that's like, that's all I'm saying is like, it's like as an adult could spend their time doing something different. Yeah, no, Speaker 3 1:05:45 I don't think so. I can learn Spanish, or, but I will say I will say just Speaker 2 1:05:51 say like, you're learning an instrument. The first like, year is you going? Bah, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah. You know, Speaker 3 1:05:57 it's very hard to watch a little it's hard to watch. It's painful. Yeah, that's true. Unknown Speaker 1:06:04 Well, you got a spouse and spouse spouse. Speaker 3 1:06:10 Anyway, so he died. And legend has it that after he went to the grave, they buried him with all of his horns. Speaker 2 1:06:18 Yeah. And his son played a symphony. Yeah, York and he raised from the graves. Speaker 3 1:06:27 But as they came in to reunite for one last time, from after the grave, the from underneath this, this actual pit to the depths of hell opened up and falling into it. This people screaming there's fire blinds. Speaker 2 1:06:45 This is the war I prepared for it. Thought it was earthly war. It was a spiritual spiritual battle. Unknown Speaker 1:06:54 Yeah, and I got to see Speaker 1 1:07:03 things either last night is a production of space Tim medium produced by Christian Taylor audio by Alex Garnett video by Connor Betts. Our graphics and our logo by Caleb Goldberg and our social media is run by Caleb Walker. Our hosts are Jared Meyers and Tim stone falls on your favorite social media platform at tilam podcast is Ti LL and podcast. Remember to tell all your friends about us, and we'll see you next Tuesday for another episode of things I learned last night. Transcribed by

The Birth of a Musical Marvel Adolphe Sax and the Saxophone: a pairing that has left an indelible mark on the world of music. The saxophone, a versatile and captivating instrument, has enchanted audiences for centuries. But how did this unique creation come to be? In this article, we’ll delve into the life and legacy of Adolphe Sax, the saxophone … Read More

John DeLorean – The Fascinating Life


Episode Transcription

Made by robots for robots. Only read if you're weird.

Unknown Speaker Hey man, what's up? Unknown Speaker Have you ever heard of John DeLorean Speaker 1 John DeLorean John Z? DeLorean John Z DeLorean? Did He create the car? It fit a lot. Speaker 2 Did he? Got it? Stole my thunder there jumped ahead, trying to pocket that for a big reveal later in the Unknown Speaker big reveal hour. And you're not gonna believe this hour to believe this. He's created the door. Unknown Speaker The car is crazy. Unknown Speaker Okay. Did he that was a real question. Unknown Speaker No, yeah, he did. He did. Oh, yeah. Speaker 2 Here's the big John DeLorean. I don't know if I've ever said here's the thing that early in that episode Unknown Speaker is his son, man. I just want to make sure I get the lineage. Unknown Speaker For their heavy skip divers aren't strong. Speaker 1 I don't think some people realize how large my head is. Let me put it to the very last notch that it will go Unknown Speaker kind of like every girl you date is the same. Speaker 1 You see this? Terry? I want you to see this. You see this? See what's happening? Speaker 2 He got famous just for doing his job. Maybe if you're good enough two years ago. Last night Speaker 2 I hate so much that you made a Mandalorian joke, and you've never seen it. You haven't even seen the Phantom Menace. Wow. Speaker 1 Yeah, you're right. Forget it. While we're doing some weird. Today is a day where we're recording on 911. And I flew today and for some reason I've been flying on many nine elevens they're doing good. You're good. You're good. It's fine. It's fine. It's fine. This is all right. Alex says no, no, no, you don't have to. Okay, he goes. I don't know. Okay, so it's going through TSA this morning. And it's like their Super Bowl. Today is their day. Oh, God, you know, no, no, listen, like this is their day. There's nothing bad. It's fine. We can talk about it. Someone accidentally said today. You could see the look on their face. They turned white as it goes. Because this lady, we're going through TSA. It's very tense. They're very, I'm telling you like they are like on their game today. I mean, a would make sense. Well, this is the whole reason TSA was was yeah, this is where every teacher you go through has the big thing of like, it's got this ever forget kind of stuff. Yeah. This lady says, I think it's just the pressure of all this stuff. She's okay. Thank you. Is Unknown Speaker she an agent? Or is she No, she's Speaker 1 a passenger. She's a person going through and she just goes happy 911. And you felt everyone go Unknown Speaker watch the airline? Unknown Speaker And they're like, Hey, come back here. I think we need to do a search Unknown Speaker and see your bags. Oh. Speaker 1 It was that feeling that you had when I was like, Hey, we're recording on a day. That's what everyone fell in the hole. Everyone just did you just say Speaker 3 there's people that see 28 that were like, What did you do? It was Speaker 1 like whenever someone says like Happy Memorial Day, and you're okay, you know, it was like, it was like a happy 911. And she was oh, no, I mean, like to watch her fumble was very fun. Speaker 2 Do you think that will happen? Like with what Memorial Day is now like, do you think like when we're elderly? Oh, and like the last generation that I start to Speaker 1 I just think they'll eventually treat it like the way we treat December 7. Pearl Harbor Day? Yeah, just like saying actually. Yeah, I think about that quite a bit, actually. You know, is that that's one of those like, you know, where were you wanting to happen kind of days? And then the assassination of JFK? Yeah. Those are like kind of those tests at an interesting point. But it becomes one of those things that were kind of like, yeah, every year we remember it. Yeah. But eventually, I think it will eventually you don't remember. Yeah, but I mean, eventually something worse will happen. So all right. I mean, historically, that's a cool hat. Oh, yeah, let's plug them right now. It's a great time in golly, no, you made a weird dude. I was just trying to tell a good 911 story. You made it weird. Unknown Speaker That's the clip. That's Unknown Speaker Oh, man. Unknown Speaker Okay, so let's talk about Speaker 1 roads. Or go we don't need roads. You know who else didn't need roads anyway, so, Speaker 3 back to the future. Yeah. I just, it just makes me mad. I was Speaker 1 in it, dude. It was in the future. Speaker 3 What are you trying to say? You're trying to save this. Okay, whatever. Um, so John, Unknown Speaker Michael J. Fox Speaker 3 here's the thing. So he's the car guy, right? John DeLorean guy, John DeLorean. He's the guy who made the car. Let me just I'll take this. Go. Hey, John. I'm struggling big right now. So he's the car guy, car guy. Speaker 2 But he was born in Detroit. Motor City. Sure. Makes a lot of sense. He became a car guy grew up in a home that was not great. His dad was a car man. Speaker 1 He's a car guy. His dad was a car man. His dad before him was a car watcher. All hail the washer. Speaker 2 But his dad was on the assembly line and his trunk, and pretty abusive. And so when he was in high school, his mom left him and took the kids. And he said he wanted to build a life for himself. And he was very into cars, because you know, Detroit, you have to it was it's like, it's like growing up, and Speaker 1 oh, I want to see where this goes. No. Yeah, no, let's let's hear Yeah, go ahead. Speaker 2 Well, I was hoping to come up with something more interesting than this. But when I started this sense, but I was like growing up in Hollywood, like a lot of people are like, I want to be a star. Unknown Speaker People who grew up in Los Angeles are not the Hollywood people. Speaker 2 People who grew up on Hollywood Boulevard like on the Boulevard Speaker 1 yeah, those are not what did you know they're not stars. They are just my hair thing about Hollywood Boulevard is the overweight Wolverine out there. You don't see him like this a guy who's like can't be bothered to stay in shape enough to be like Wolverine, but it still wants you to but he still wants to charge it for a picture. Speaker 2 Yeah. And he'll get that money. Yeah, get that back. So he grew up in Motor City. Yeah, really into cars. So he went to the Lawrence Institute of Technology and got his bachelor's in car stuff. Unknown Speaker He went to Lawrence's Here's an analogy. Yeah. Speaker 2 Which is not what you're thinking. But can we get merch from Speaker 1 that? Institute? It says lit dude. That's kind of tight. That is Yeah, I mean, like Lauren's institution all just kind of cool. Unknown Speaker I'm pulling it through. Dude. Okay, let's do Speaker 2 it. So. So John, he wants he got really into cars, right? Yeah, he was learning how to make cars. Jonathan ology, Unknown Speaker Lawrence Institute of Technology, Speaker 2 got a job for General Motors, building cars and designing cars and stuff and worked his way up the ladder, the corporate ladder. Sure. And he was kind of the early archetype of like the maverick like the Tony Stark. And interesting, I watched a documentary series about it's very interesting. Hearing them describe a maverick in the 60s, versus a maverick in the Tony Stark era. Because they were like, yeah, he he didn't wear a tie. And, Speaker 1 yeah, formed a corporate world. He would put his shoes on Speaker 2 his desk. It's like, okay, not he didn't kick his feet up on his desk, he took his shoes off and set them on his desk. That's a power move. Unknown Speaker Every meeting I go into I go, how are we doing? It does. It's like brothers. One of them, Mel. Yeah. Am I supposed to do Speaker 1 something with that? No, I just want you to know that it would be difficult for me to leave this meeting. That's why I've done this. Yeah. And so I want you to know that I'm not one foot in one foot out this relationship. Speaker 2 That's pretty good. We should make we should turn this into a business custom, like make this part of our business culture. When we do we should really try to win, but we take off opposite shoes, and we put them next to each other in the middle. Yeah. And we don't acknowledge it and just see how many I bet other people if you're in a meeting with like four people, they will do it. Do it for sure. I like this idea. Speaker 1 Yeah. And what we have to define our culture as a company, don't we? Yeah, my Yeah, we should. Yeah, I was gonna say we should make it like that guy on Instagram. Who was like, if you don't have a six pack abs, you can't walk in I'm gonna fire you. And he makes a video where he makes a guy take off his shirt. And he goes on to embarrassed about this. And he was and he's like, Yes, sir. Speaker 2 Yeah, he was he got fired next week. That the shorts more Speaker 1 embarrassing, having a little bit of flap or being in a video where your boss is like, aren't you embarrassed by this? That's way Speaker 2 worse, way worse, way worse. Because you know, like, nevermind. That's a bummer. Yeah. So Johnny gets a job and he works his way up the corporate culture. And he's he's a maverick. He's an early Juric. doesn't wear a tie, doesn't wear a tie. He kicks his feet up on the deck and his own rules. Yeah. And he starts to really see Success. He worked, he worked on the Pontiac GTO. And he kind of spearheaded a new era of like sports car and became, I don't want to say a household name, but a household name. If you liked cars, you know, like if you were her if you were in a car nerd, your whole house knew about him because you talked about him all the time. Okay, everybody in your house was so annoyed. But if you were a normal person, probably hadn't heard of them before. You know, I'm saying here. Hey, I liked that hat, man. Speaker 1 Thank you. I left a small one over there. Do you Speaker 2 need to go? Yeah, I just was looking at this hat and how good it is Speaker 1 okay, so just so everyone can see. Odd Job hats. Fits in my head. Very nice. Regular hat normal hat. I don't think some people realize how large my head is. Let me put it to the very last notch that it'll go. The last notch. Speaker 2 Yeah, the biggest the biggest the head gets just a notch it no notches. Notch free. Can't hold them back. Just wide Speaker 1 open. What's up guys? mean, when you put them next to each other, you're like, those are both just Speaker 2 hats. Your head kind of looks like like, you know, like, you put that on? Like, you know, like the not the part with the slice. But the other part like Oh, Honey Baked Ham. But not the slice. Unknown Speaker Slice size. A ham? Unknown Speaker Yeah, it was like there's a beanie sitting up on top of the ham. Speaker 1 Okay, does that why you brought up my hat is to call me a ham head. No, I Unknown Speaker just say it. It's a good thing. You found odd job hats. Speaker 1 It's a good thing. Look straight. Normal. That looks already weird. Now other Speaker 2 didn't look normal. That looks normal. What I was going for. Alright, though I bring it up naturally enough for Unknown Speaker you. I was great. Thank Good, Unknown Speaker perfect. Speaker 2 So he gets a lot of success making cars. And he becomes like a businessman celebrity. Which is interesting because he doesn't own the company. I was trying to think about this businessman celebrity. Yeah, I was trying to think about this today. Like, like we've got business celebrities out there like but they're all I mean. Like, like Mark Yeah, Mark Cuban. like Elon Musk. Yeah, Grant Cardone. Like they're these household names Unknown Speaker are made by Grant Cardone all the time, because there's so Speaker 2 because they own the company. That's huge. Like, that's how I Mark Zuckerberg. Speaker 1 Yeah. And you couldn't figure you couldn't think of Jeff Bezos. I, Unknown Speaker I said Mark Zuckerberg. Anyways, you are Speaker 1 you heard the interaction we just had, right. Okay, I'm not dumb. You couldn't think of Jeff Bezos. I said Mark Zuckerberg. Okay, okay. That's the tone. Tim talks to me. He's like, so clearly wrong. And he goes, I said, I'm just, that was just such a good representation of our whole friendship. Is you just confidently being like, it's Martin Luther King, Jr. Speaker 2 I'm just trying to nurture our toxic workplace culture. Okay. All right. So, but I was thinking about, I don't know if there is any, like, I can't think of any businessman, celebrities who are not business owners. Like he was famous. He was just like, a, like, he wasn't even a VP. He was just a director of like, engineering. And he became like, like, he was close friends with, like, models and like, actors and actresses. Like he was like, and I don't know, maybe there are people who are like friends with them that are just businessmen. Okay, business women, but they're not like, famous. He got famous just for being good at his job. Speaker 1 Okay. Well, I mean, if your job is designing cars, Speaker 2 I mean, I guess but like, even now, like, I don't think there's a car designer that's like getting on the lake. It's because he was on The Late Show. Speaker 1 Okay, sure. But I'm saying like, but he was representative of the company, though. Yeah, he was the face of a now but now that's what I'm saying is that now has shifted through the marketing era of the 60s and 70s is that it's shifted to the CEO has charisma. The person has to have the charisma to be the face, right? Whereas it used to be the CEO used to be the boring desk job to make everything run and you You know, there was no need or time or you know, there was no need for them to be. And if it's not the Speaker 2 CEO then they hire an influencer. To be sure. Interesting. Interesting. Speaker 1 I mean, it's Wozniak and jobs. You know, Steve Jobs had the charisma side of it, but was Nana did most of the actual? Yeah. And design and work. Unknown Speaker This is interesting. Unknown Speaker It's like you and me. Speaker 2 Yeah. Who's the face of the company? Here? Let's put a cop pick one. Speaker 1 There's a reason I let you put your name and a heck one. There's a reason I let you call it space Tim media. Unknown Speaker Yeah, because I'm very prideful. Unknown Speaker Yeah. So he got famous just for doing his job. Maybe if you're good enough for years, okay. This guy makes waves. Like art next guest tonight. Websites for churches. Companies. Good. They are gearing up for Tim stone quest. Hey, guys, hey, everybody. Speaker 2 And then we have to eat all this weird stuff that he gets out of the spin wheel. Yeah, Speaker 1 that's James Corden. That's not the Jimmy Fallon doesn't do the eating stuff. You have to like hold a snake or Speaker 2 some stuff. Yeah, yeah. Or petting Speaker 1 my luck my luck would be to go on The Tonight Show or one of the late night shows the same night that the safari guy is on there. And I gotta like, pet a tarantula. Speaker 2 What do you do hot ones. Hot ones. Yeah, would you do that? Speaker 1 Yeah. 100% Okay, so I mean like I would clear my schedule for the next like days after it you know, give my body some time to cover Speaker 2 recoup not go to a festival the next day. Yeah. So Speaker 1 the he got he got fame he got a long time and tell the story is why we have doing tangents Unknown Speaker we're doing tangents that's what's making it take a long time to tell the story. Speaker 1 It's because you keep going I don't know who's gonna famous just doing their job well, can you think maybe he's got to do their job well, so he's Unknown Speaker will speed this story up so Speaker 1 he made the doors ago and that's the whole episode. It's all started Can you believe he got famous for that? Tonight Show. Patrick you keep doing your blame me. I said Mark Zuckerberg. Speaker 1 Tell the story. So your parents are getting Trini lately? Your parents are like hey, Gerrans are bullying you it's our workplace culture is part of our children parents like you Unknown Speaker I will say Unknown Speaker okay, I'll tell the story. Unknown Speaker You might as well so Speaker 2 DeLorean he works his way up and he makes a couple of their cars still famous Mary's a model on something tonight show has these famous list of friends. And the company works for GN it's like we don't like all this. Like we want a guy who works and you're Yeah, sure working but you're also like Galavan so cool. And like we know how cool you are. Speaker 3 Like you're the coolest guy here and and I'm not everyone knows and everybody doesn't want like they were trying to figure out why you're famous. Like we can't figure it out. All you are is gonna get a job. And so they there was a I don't know the there's there's discrepancies on what happened here. Speaker 2 There's two storylines storyline A is he amicably left the company. Okay. Not sure. I mean, I don't know if that's true. Speaker 1 Swirl on a hammock ruler. Not true. I mean, like, maybe, but it's not. Unknown Speaker That's not what happened. It's like we don't know but we know. It's like the moon landing. Oh, no the truth but we know the truth, you know. Speaker 2 Okay. So storyline B is that he was like pulled out of the office by security We don't want you. I know that wasn't one of the most like, I'm not gonna lie. I got Jared called me the other day, and I didn't answer because I didn't want to talk to you. He left me a voicemail. He was like, he's like, bro, I'm having a crisis right now. I was like, I should probably call him back. sounds serious. And I call him back and he was like, hey, so they faked it right? Speaker 1 Pretty sure they fake that thing, man. You know? Unknown Speaker Just blank stares. Speaker 1 Hey, thanks for checking out this episode. If you like this, and you want more of our show, we've got plenty of other episodes. One of my favorites is action Park, a super sketchy theme park that was basically overrun by teenagers and they just made the rules. It was in New Jersey. It was a wild story. But we did a whole episode about it and I think you'd like it so when you're done with this one go check out that episode but for now back to this one. Unknown Speaker So John eat leaves the company Unknown Speaker in front of soldiers to pay my debt to you What do you want from Speaker 3 me? Either amicably or Speaker 1 inadequately sure what storyline be storyline Speaker 2 gets dragged out by security because they don't like him. Just like the festival in the hotel. They didn't like and so they kicked them out. And so he dash car. Yeah. dashcam Thank you. He got plastic surgery and reinvented himself. So one on the right is the original John DeLorean. The one on the left is John DeLorean to point out the reinvented with plastic surgery and he Speaker 1 was like, and this is before but they knew what he meant. He's like, can you make my face look stiff? Like Jordan Peterson Speaker 2 long before sort of look at it. But yeah, it is working as hard and as John Yeah, he definitely got some. I don't know. What are all that Botox? Why did he do that? I mean, I think it makes him look a little bit more forceful. Okay, I'm not gonna lie like looking at that chin. Like I didn't know plastic to change his Unknown Speaker nose chin come Unknown Speaker out. Because his Unknown Speaker nose used to curve out Yeah. Unknown Speaker It's a little bit harder. Speaker 1 He looked better before I'm gonna. Dude. I'm gonna say this about plastic surgery is not worth it at all. Speaker 2 I don't know, man. I think he looks pretty sharp. I honestly I was I was about to say Unknown Speaker the post is literally just the post. Speaker 2 No, no, I got another picture of him and his family. Here's he him and his family Speaker 3 are gonna go watch this. If you're listening you need to go watch for this moment because this fixture Unknown Speaker is and they're taxidermied dog. Unknown Speaker Their dog is so mad. Speaker 1 Why did they do this? Yeah, he's got his dog on his shoulder. Hey, looks like this is like this looks like they're all puppets. You know? I'm saying yeah, Speaker 2 he Yeah. I'm honestly I'm really impressed too, that his wife's hair is blowing like that. And none of the Speaker 1 face tuned before that app existed. She does actually. Speaker 2 Wow, he met her the first time you ever saw her was on a magazine cover? And then or then he plays assistant he's bringing her? No. Are you serious? I don't know the story. Oh, he does say the first time you ever saw her was on a magazine cover. Well then tell her I don't have a I still Unknown Speaker got my security. Speaker 2 Yeah, but no, I here's what I'm saying. I never thought a plastic surgery jaw can look like I think his jaw looks sharp. I think it looks I think his his post plastic surgery jaw like chin looks better. Okay, well what I'm saying is he as as a person with a weird chin. I'm not gonna lie. Speaker 1 I thought the thing about plastic surgery is that you can just tell. Speaker 2 You tell though. I never knew until I knew. Yeah, I mean like plastic surgery. Okay, no Botox. You can tell plastic surgery sometimes though. Like that shit like that nose and that chin? You can't tell. Okay. All right. Anyways, this episode is not about as Are you out the moon or plastic surgery. So he starts his car company. DeLorean Speaker 1 there. Lorien, Motor Company, DMC Speaker 2 D and C, DeLorean Motor Company. And he gets $17 million in funding from people he knows. And then he goes in, he calls the dude who works for Lotus car company. I needed you to design it, and then a couple of people from GM, and he's like, hey, what if I sniped you from the company? And GM was like, You can't do that. He's like, I'm doing it. And so they they left to start this company and start working on this new dream car. And the concept for this car was pretty ahead of his time. It's like late 70s. And he wanted to he was really interested in fuel efficiency? Because nobody cared about that yet. fuel prices were starting to skyrocket. And so he said, I think the consumer of the future is going to care a lot about fuel efficiency, because fuel is getting more and more expensive. Okay, he was kind of ahead of the curve on that. But he also wanted it to be really stinking cool Unknown Speaker so he came up with Speaker 2 a cost saving tool, but also a cool tool. Cool Unknown Speaker Tool tool. Speaker 2 That's a cool tool. And he was like, he's like, what if we just made it stainless steel? You said we don't paint it. We just get stainless steel. The whole body of the car is stainless steel. We love that great idea. So made the stainless ever Ilan Unknown Speaker was like, let's do that with the Tesla truck. Unknown Speaker Maybe it could have inspired them. I don't know if you see the real Unknown Speaker ones rolling off the line. Yeah, Speaker 2 it looks so bad. Awful, very similar to this. So Speaker 1 oh, if the design is better. Oh, yeah. Interesting. Speaker 2 So they designed this car. here's the here's a picture of a if you never seen it, this is the DeLorean. It's got the column. Speaker 1 The gall doors is the real like seagulls. This is not a design. Yeah, this is a a production doesn't say this is this is what they look like. Yeah. Speaker 2 And this, this, I think rolled off the lot in 8081 8081. They are cool. They announced the concept in the late 70s. And it blew up. Everybody freaking loved it. They thought it would look super cool. And then it was so it was advertised as like a supercar. Like it was gonna be really fast. And it was going to be very fuel efficient, supposedly pretty green, because you're not painting it and it's yours and stuff like that, which was not a huge concern yet, but it was starting to become one for some people. Unknown Speaker They manual or automatic? Actually don't know. Speaker 2 I do know that this was called the DMC 12. And they named it that for something that you're pretty passionate about actually. Can you guess? Unknown Speaker Oh gosh, the disciples Unknown Speaker know, they needed that because the price was $4,000 Speaker 1 I'm pretty passionate about $12,000. Speaker 2 Passionate about companies branding things as the price. Oh, that's true Speaker 1 that a lot freedom. Which was now how much? Is it DeLorean cost? Like, not $12,000 Probably that Speaker 2 I'm looking at $12,000 today. So yeah, the price was about $44,000 Was that their billing? So in today's money, Speaker 1 so call it a DMC 44 And you'd be like, okay, okay. Speaker 2 So is a higher end car but not like super pricey? Yeah. And so to get a what was modeled as like a supercar, and like, it's obviously pretty flashy. hatchbacks weren't really a thing yet. So like, everything about this was cool. Oh, they're hatchbacks? I mean, it looks like a hatchback. I don't know if it's, I don't know if that open? No, that's an engine, the engines back there. Oh, is it really? I think so. I guess I just always assumed that Speaker 1 the cars is what I'm guessing is what I'm gathering from these questions I'm asking you right now. But anyway, Speaker 2 so he built this car, okay. The problem was, they, they did all this promotion for it and advertising the concept and, and it got really, really hyped. And they were they were getting rave reviews. Sure. But he didn't have a place to produce it. And so he started looking for cities or states that would fund a manufacturing plant, because of manufacturing plant is very, very expensive. And he couldn't find any investors to invest in it because they didn't believe that in the late 70s, early 80s, a new car company could compete with a GM or Ford or any of the big computers that were big at the time. They're like, You don't stand a chance. You're never gonna make it in this market. And so pretty much every city and state agreed. So he started going international and asking all these international Unknown Speaker nations. Speaker 2 Okay, good, if they would invest in like tax subsidies or something like that, so he could open up a manufacturing plant there, and he couldn't find anyone. And then he's spending like a year looking for all these different locations to try to build his manufacturing plant because he doesn't have the money for it. Right. He needs a government pretty much Speaker 1 he needs like a tax break. Yeah. So that leaves the money. Yeah. And Speaker 2 then he finds Northern Ireland. And in the early 80s, Northern Ireland was going through what's called the troubles which is kind of Speaker 1 the troubles Yeah, which one sounds like a cool band name. To maybe like a disease that gets passed around from like, children. That's just like, yeah. Yeah, chicken pox and troubles at the same time. Hmm. Speaker 3 That's what I've got to say that my kids got the troubles. Whenever one of them's in trouble, I'll be like don't go around them to kind of catch Unknown Speaker the troubles. Speaker 3 Oh man, toxic workplace culture. So the shoe back. Oh, no. Speaker 1 Okay. You took your other shoe off. I was making sure. Yeah, I couldn't take it. Couldn't take Unknown Speaker hard to have one shoe on. Yeah, it's Speaker 1 just up. But that discipline is what makes me better than you. And that's why you should give me this deal right now. The fact that I've kept one shoe on you don't you took your other shoe off? Yeah, I tell you don't trust me. Trust me, relationship. Take Speaker 2 my shoes. That worked. I didn't take my shoe off yet. But then I was feeling it. I was like, I need to take the shoe. I Speaker 1 just realized that you have tattooed on you. And I respect Nothing you say? Speaker 3 You just realized, yeah, it's been there for a year, a year. nine month Unknown Speaker it matches the one on your shirt. Speaker 3 Doesn't really. That is a pretty good match. You think they modeled it after that? Speaker 1 Okay. Anyway, what was I talking about how he found it in Northern Ireland. He they got the trouble. I got trouble. They got the troubles right here in River City. They got trouble that starts with T which rhymes with D which stands for DeLorean? Hey, that's Speaker 2 a that's right. So the troubles were kind of a civil war, kinda, loosely, maybe, I don't know. Long story short, there had been a very long conflict in Northern Ireland against the UK. Because during the Middle Ages, when Great Britain was being, you know, settlers, they settled Northern Ireland. And they were like, This is ours now. and Ireland was like, No, it's not. And again, it is. And they're like, No, it's not. And then they were like, yeah, it's ours. And also, all of you aren't Catholic anymore. Now you're Protestant. And then they were like, No, we're not. And they're like, Yeah, we are. And then after a little while, they just created this border. And they were like, This is Northern Ireland. And it's part of the UK. And it's not yours, Ireland. And there was a lot of conflict about that for many years. And then in the 60s, there kind of split it Splinter these two groups, the IRA. And then the, what was the word that they, the loyalists, they were loyal to the UK. And so and it was and it was very religiously undertone, because the IRA was all Catholic. And the people who were loyal to the UK were all Protestant. And so there was this. This infighting between the two, and it got pretty violent, and led to a lot of massacres and violence, because massacres. Yeah, there was like, the IRA was like bombing places and like shooting up places, because they were like, you're we're not part of you. Yes. And so it was a very dangerous time in Northern Ireland. And the economy in Northern Ireland was really struggling because of it, because most people were getting hurt, just doing normal, everyday stuff, because there's violence all over the place. And he came, and they said, Hey, Belfast, right now is a very dangerous place. There's a lot of violence happening in there from the troubles. And they said, we actually would love it. If you came in, you built your manufacturing plant here. And they had this dream that UK, and this dream that if we build a manufacturing plant, where the most of the trouble of the troubles is happening, it'll unite Speaker 1 them. Yeah, they're like, the work they can unite around the DeLorean Speaker 2 to to work the worker bowl, employ people from both sides, and they'll get to work together on a project and they'll solve their differences working on this project together. And then also it helps our economy because then there's a big boost the economy, everybody's got a job, everybody's working. Okay? And so they invested multimillion dollars to build this plant and get to work on this, this DeLorean. The problem was, the people who then got hired to work at this plant, had no idea how to build a car. And so they all started building this car, but it was bad. Speaker 1 Yeah, they were like, just the engine going the front of the back. I don't know. I guess I assumed the back Unknown Speaker like, is this are these doors or wings? I can't tell. Oh, Speaker 2 I think they do both. Right. So they, they built these cars, but they were honestly a lot like Tesla's like, panels were falling inside. Yeah, like pieces where we Speaker 1 say we're gonna test all the way out to Sunday. Cool. Yeah. It's further falling apart, Speaker 2 this fall apart. And it was the same content, because these people were not car manufacturers. So like, they could work but like there was just details and things like that, that they were constantly missing. I think Speaker 1 that I think that they were good at it, but they were they just hated each other too much. Yeah, they were fighting. It was one of those things where it's like it's a two person job, but the other person was, Unknown Speaker he was coming back and unstuck. He's like, Unknown Speaker no, let me help you. No, Speaker 2 no, I'll do it. So the cars are not great cars. Sure. And after a year of production, Speaker 1 they are only able to how much does it cost to ship those over the United States like that? Does that Speaker 2 mean a lot of money really hurts? Yeah. So I mean, they ended up retailing for 24,000 double what they were. Yeah. So they didn't change the name, though. Speaker 1 What Tesla did, though, Tesla was like, Yeah, our base model start at 32,000. It's like, okay, but if you want to drive, it's going to cost CCA. Oh, sorry, turning it on cost per subscription plan, which is $2,000 a month. Okay. Speaker 2 And you have to have it for four years. So Unknown Speaker sorry about that. Yeah, Unknown Speaker I forgot to tell you that part. Speaker 2 Same thing, very, very much the same thing. And then these cars ship and they, they kind of sucked. Speaker 1 Okay. They're also design, like, what was the drawings? You said? Were you going to show me that? Speaker 2 I mean, they look exactly the same. But oh, either. You're saying they looked exactly the same. Once you got them in the road. There's zero to 60 time was 11 seconds. What were they advertised? I don't know what they were advertised as well, it was advertised as a supercar. But it's like, yeah, because I don't think anybody took into account how long it takes to get stainless steel up to 60 miles an hour. But the car was Speaker 1 just yeah, looking heavy. Yeah. I'm like trying to do 60 miles an hour here. Right. I see. It's probably 60. So like, do I'm going like Unknown Speaker yeah, there you go. Unknown Speaker As far as 60 Right there, Speaker 3 that's that's 60 miles an hour. You see how quickly I got my arm to 60 Unknown Speaker It's because there's no stainless steel. Yeah, you Speaker 3 put some stainless steel on minus 106. He taught me this was real bad because all that steel in my Oh, yeah. Right. So it was super, super slow. Speaker 3 We haven't recorded this podcast at over a month and it shows I'm listening. Okay, whatever, keep doing your stainless steel hand. But Speaker 2 the car was also a very fragile, the hit that sometimes the doors want to latch sometimes they won't even Unknown Speaker open stayed I'd be mad. Speaker 2 And like panels would fall off. It was it was just not as advertised. It was advertised like this supercar. And it just wasn't it wasn't it was kind of cheap. And so the reputation of the car started to go downhill. And they started to sell not as well as they were, which is crazy. Because before these before these left a lot before production even began. There was pre orders out for them. And the dealerships across the country. Were so backlogged with DeLorean pre orders, but Speaker 1 do they honor the price then if they pre ordered them at like, 12,000? I don't think so. Speaker 1 Imagine you go to buy a car. Yeah. For $12,000. Yeah. And they say, next week, and you go whenever they've made the car and they go you owe $12,000. And you know, I already paid that. Yeah, they go. Yeah, yeah. Oh, Speaker 2 another 12 Yeah, cost. Sorry. cost them a little more. Because, you know, have you heard of the troubles? You know what the trouble Yeah, your car costs board because the troubles Is that like the wiggles or something? I don't understand. Okay, Unknown Speaker it's like a more day. Speaker 2 So they but dealerships had so many people trying to preorder these things and they had such a backlog of pre orders that it got to the point before production even began on the DeLorean most dealerships across the country, were requiring a $5,000 deposit just to preorder and 5000 cash down just a pre order that that was how hot these cars were. And then they come off the lot. And they sucked. And so the reputation like kind of got tanked. And they were having a much harder time to get here and return Unknown Speaker it and ship it back. Speaker 2 Thanks for checking out our show. If you like it and you want to support it be a part of what we're doing here. You can do that by becoming a patron. What happens there is you get to be in the community. We have a discord with our hosts and producers. We have a lot of fun. We're super active in there every day you get access to add free content a week before everybody else. And we have a zoom every month with our patrons. We hang out eat pizza, we get to know you a little bit better. It's a blast. And there's a ton of other different benefits like merch discounts, birthday messages, things like that, that are super cool. If you want to be in that you can just text HiLine to 66866 and that'll get you right in there. If not, we're just super glad that you're here. And thanks for watching our show. Speaker 2 Yeah, and so they were having a hard time getting their money back on that, okay? Or getting people to purchase again after all of that kind of mess happened. And then Margaret Thatcher came into power in the UK, and try to say that name I just don't Speaker 1 know say that they not like that. Margaret Thatcher. I just don't know where it's gonna go. You bring her up? Yeah, she came into power. And she wouldn't be like, if all of a sudden you were like, George W. Bush. And you're like, Okay, Speaker 2 she gave it a power. And she was not a fan of government subsidy, right? And so she was like, No, we're giving you how much money to her. And we're very tight. Yeah. And they were like, they were like, okay, she's actually I'm not a fan of this government subsidy thing. And also, you guys thought that this was going to make everybody closer, like, are you stupid, because it wasn't like there was constantly like bolt holes in the factory and like fights breaking out and stuff like that. Because wasn't it? It was an interesting idea of troubles. It was it was the troubles troubles afoot. And so she shuts the factory down. And she's like, No more. I'm not funding this anymore. She didn't shut it down. But she stopped. Yeah. Shut it down. And so they started laying off workers. And that led him to like a sit in. And so all the remaining workers were like we're going on strike. And it Speaker 1 turns out that the strike brought them together. You know, that led into the trouble, nothing unites all the divides, like some good old anti capitalist Speaker 2 capitalists, and so they go on strike. But it was it was to a point where there's no investors, there was really no one who cared, that they were upset. And so they all ended up kind of getting laid off. And the factory had to shut down. And so now DeLoreans at a spot where he's got all these pre orders for this car. And this car is like his pet project. He's like, very proud of this car. Yeah. And he wants it to succeed. And he's like, desperate to resurrect the factory and Belfast, Speaker 1 this factory. He bought for like, $44 million. He's dead. He's like, That's a lot of money, guys. I wanted to pay 12. Now it's $22 million. And he's like, that's half half a billion was a billion. What? How much was Twitter worth? Speaker 2 Oh, it was a lot. I don't know what it was. But it was a lot. You might be close. Honestly, very similar story. He's trying to make it Speaker 1 work. As I say he's really need this. So he is like, so everyone drives these cars, you gotta pay me $8 a month. Speaker 2 So he's called every investor he knows, right? Every government he knows trying to get subsidies, trying to get investments to say this company. And he's coming up, try. Sure. And then one day, he gets a call from someone he doesn't know. He's like, Hey, I have a business proposition for Speaker 1 you. That I think sounds like you're gonna, it sounds like we know who it is. Speaker 2 And he's like, he's like, I got a business proposition for you. I think it's gonna, it could help you. I hear you're in a tough spot with your company right now. And I think that this could help you reopen that factory and get your car company off the ground. And he's like, he's like, meet me in this hotel room in San Diego. Nisman this hotel room in San Diego. Speaker 1 Is that a thing that people have done in the past? I cannot imagine having a meeting in a hotel Speaker 2 room. Yeah, that sounds like you're gonna admire me meeting. No, Speaker 1 I mean, like, or like, you know, like, yeah, I just couldn't imagine. Yeah. inviting anyone into my hotel room. I get uncomfortable. If anybody's in my hotel room. Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah. That's an interesting point. I don't know if that like last thing. It might have been must have been. Yeah. But anyways, but Unknown Speaker like, if we were on a trip together, I wouldn't want you in my hotel room Speaker 2 at same. Yeah, yeah. Sure. Yeah. Unless you took one shoe. Yeah. Speaker 1 Please take your shoe off. So the shoes, the shoes, your shoe off your shoe, please take the boot. I have these little deputies that you can put Unknown Speaker on them. One is a stupid Speaker 2 lady, too. He goes to this hotel room for this meeting. And he meets with this guy. Long story short, the guy is like, Hey, I've got a bunch of cocaine. And I need you to finance the project. You finance the project? Here's the return, I expect. And I think it'd be like $70 million. Why? And so he's like, he's like, okay, he's like, I'll finance the smuggle. And then it was like $7 million to finance the smuggle what and then he was gonna get like a $70 million return so he could reopen his factory. He was like, this is the best deal ever. This is real. So they pour champagne. They toast and this hotel room. Oh, he's an undercover guy. The doors open. FBI comes in they're arrested. But that's entrapment though. Yeah. And so here's here's the video which sidebar? I don't understand how anybody ever got arrested back then. Because you look at this. You can't tell me that's him? Yeah, this video was too Speaker 1 weak. Last week's jaw, but yeah, so that's entrapment, though, right? So yes. Was he seeking this out? No. So that's entrapment. So this did he get out of this? So Speaker 2 he gets arrested? Because in a two year long trial, and throughout the trial, Speaker 1 because that is straight up. Yeah. So throughout the trial, that's like someone called with a, Hey, I heard you're having trouble making rent, great way for you to make some money. Let's meet up and you meet up and they go, we want you to smuggle a lot of this and you go, I'm desperate enough. Let's do it. And they got you sucker. drachma, you would not have otherwise committed a crime. Yeah, Speaker 2 you're right. So they go through this long trial as he gets off your trial. Bankruptcy has company in the process has to actually declare bankruptcy on the company's legal fees. And Unknown Speaker CIA did this. And that's the conspiracy, I believe. And NASA did this because he knew how colorful the moon was. Speaker 2 And it came out that this guy that he got the call from was someone who was facing a ridiculous amount of prison time. And they made him an offer. They said, if you can help us catch some people, then we'll lighten your sentence. And so he just framed people then yeah, he just started finding people who are desperate and calling on him. And so it took two years. But after two years, they cleared they weren't able to prove it was bankrupted his company after he already bankrupt his company and ruined his reputation. And so after, after the whole thing in 83, his company's gone, his company doesn't exist. Oh, my God, he was on some TV show. And then they asked him, they said, Are you gonna get IV? They're like, are you gonna go back into into manufacturing? And he said, he said, Well, I mean, is it the past few years? He's like, I don't know, how could he said, Would you buy a used car for me? And most people want it because they think they know him as a cocaine smuggler. Because it was all over the news for two years. This mega Maverick. This guy doesn't button his shirt. But he sells cocaine, which we should have known. He never wore a tie. He sells cocaine. Unknown Speaker Oh my gosh, that's a new fear. Speaker 2 Yeah. So well, I'll just don't agree to anything ever. Unknown Speaker If somebody makes an offer, disagree. Unknown Speaker Okay. Speaker 2 So yeah, so he, he got out of it. But he couldn't get back into the car world because of his tarnished reputation. And so he spent well, actually, in this was 83, when he kind of got out of the whole thing. 85 Back to the Future comes out. And they chose the DeLorean to be their car. And he loved it. Yeah. But the DeLorean didn't really exist anymore. Like there was only a few 1000 that ever made. But he he was stoked that they use his shirt. He wrote a letter to Michael J. Fox was like, Thanks for eight but he Unknown Speaker didn't know they were gonna use the car. Speaker 2 I don't think so because there was no license anymore. Like, I think that's why they chose that car. Because no one owned the rights to it. It was a cool car that the company didn't exist, and so they could just get it. And that's interesting. So he was stoked that they ended up using it and immortalizing it and it really was how much is it to buy one now? They on average, somewhere around $50,000? So I mean, okay, yeah. Unknown Speaker You have a car payment on a DeLorean. Speaker 2 It's pretty cool. But then how great cars that's the they're kinda like they're really movie props. You're buying them as a movie prop? Yeah, what it is. Unknown Speaker You're buying them so you can take them to Comic Con. Yeah. And everyone could be like, Oh, cool. It's the car. The thing Unknown Speaker is, it's the time machine. Speaker 1 Here's an even that's like got a time limit on you know, obviously, there's honestly about Elvis impersonators here today. You know, they're almost done right? Speaker 2 So he spends the rest of his life kind of dreaming about getting back into cars and in the early 2000s He starts really making some plans and like drawing some Epson sketches. But in 2005 he ends up dying alone in a one bedroom apartment. With a bunch of sketches for this car, that new DeLorean he was trying to make. Well, here's the rub though. I've never said here's the Rob Speaker 1 I know me and Alex and Connor I can see I can see Connor stage editing with his headphones on and Connor what? Time for a break. Unknown Speaker So he doesn't Unknown Speaker even smoke but he just picked it up. I'm gonna get into this. Yeah. Speaker 2 And his wife asked about hey, Connor got married. Everybody's saying Yeah. Unknown Speaker Hey, congrats. I was just at Connors wedding last night. Yeah, is that different? Katie That was weird. Connor and Katie. Katie Unknown Speaker Oh, I didn't know there was a bullet. It's kinda like every girl you date is the same. Speaker 1 Have you seen this series or you see this? You see this? You see what's happening? Who's the bully? Speaker 2 Yeah. Okay, so here's the rub. In 1985. Okay, the movie comes out. The drawing gets really popular. It was popular, popular already. But yeah, it got a tarnished reputation for a little bit and then the movie revitalized it. Everyone's like, yeah, cars super cool. Remember that car? It was so cool. And it was like, but it sucked. But then I took it and there was like, but the cocaine and then but the car is cool. It's a cool car. Yeah, cuz they were all on cocaine. Car what their car and so some dude in Houston, Texas, started a company called DeLorean Motor Company. Oh my God. He said, Oh, hey, the company's dead. What are they gonna do? And so he started DeLorean Motor Company. And that company, the point of the company was they sold parts. So for people who do buy one who do buy one they and so he went and he found did a bunch of this almost like investigative work to track down all the parts because after the factory shut down, liquidated and liquidated it, and the the UK government actually took a lot of it, and just threw it all over the place. And just threw it everywhere. There was actually a long a long running conspiracy, that because there was Margaret Thatcher and DeLorean kind of had this like feud. And yeah, at the end there. Well, yeah, so shut him down. Yeah. And so there was actually a conspiracy theory for a long time that Margaret Thatcher threw a bunch of the molds for the doors just into the Atlantic Ocean Unknown Speaker herself. Like the Titanic, so strong, the back of the boat. And so Speaker 2 there was this, like conspiracy theory that that was something that happened. And I don't know why, or how, but they proved this in the 90s. Someone scuba dived to the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean and bound a bunch of the molds for the doors at the bomb the Atlantic Ocean, and that confirmed it. And then in the late 2000s, someone did some investigative when Unknown Speaker they were like, Hey, we made that up. Well, no, Speaker 2 it actually did happen. They did find them at the bottom of the ocean. But what actually happened was they sold them for scrap metal and some fishing company was like, these be perfect anchors for our nets. But they were too heavy. And they just fell. Okay, lost them. And so as kind of true, but not I Speaker 1 mean, it turns out they did get them on the floor of the ocean were skewed because they were actually looking Speaker 2 so far away. It was yeah, it says that unmasked. Unknown Speaker So they have the molds, then Speaker 2 now they're at the bottom the ocean. Well, they're heavy, scuba divers aren't strong. Unknown Speaker Okay, here we see the scuba divers are stripping or where they are, though Unknown Speaker they could get to but they're not as strong as talking about. Okay. So but Speaker 2 this the learning guy, he tracked down pretty much every other part. And he was selling parts until 95. And 95, the government did this interesting thing, where and I didn't know this was a thing. But apparently, before 95 There was laws against small batch car manufacturing, like you had to make a lot of them if you're going to make them really, which is really interesting. But this new legislation went through I wonder why? i My guess is quality. I think my guess is they thought that you couldn't quality control below a certain number, like get the right quality. Unknown Speaker Isn't that the opposite of what would happen? Speaker 2 Well, because of the like, equipment you need to manufacture? Like my guess is like the manufacturing equipment you would use at that small of a number. You wouldn't be able to meet like our standards. That's my guess. But they wouldn't they didn't Speaker 1 think that law was in place to make sure that competitors could Speaker 2 Yeah, probably Yeah. But in 95, they did away with it. And so you could then I think the smallest bachelor allowed was 300. Yeah, Speaker 1 I mean, like, if you're trying to open a restaurant and the government's like, Yeah, well, you can't make less than 3000 Hamburgers a day. Yeah. And you're like, well, that's not you know, there's not that many people in this town. And they go, Well, that's the law. So Donald's putting their thumb down on frickin Yeah. Speaker 2 And so when that law came out in 95, they were like, we're bringing it back. And so it's DeLorean Motor Company, which is not DeLorean Motor Company. Yeah, they release all these concept art for the new DeLorean. And they're like, we're bringing the DeLorean back baby. And everyone was like, wow, and they're like, we're gonna small batch it. Okay. Homegrown from the state of Texas. Okay, but the problem was, the EPA took six years filing the paperwork. And so they couldn't actually get started until 2001. Yeah. And then when did other one rolls around? They got into a new scheme, DMC, which they were like car manufacturing is expensive and really hard but they Like but we own all the rights DMC and so they started. They did like a limited edition Nike, DeLorean Nike. They did what is that? A bunch of merch like Nike shoe. They did like a DeLorean branded Nike shoe. And they all save Unknown Speaker money on the image from the movie. Yeah. Speaker 2 And they were licensing the DeLorean Motor company logo. And into those five, they actually got sued for it from the DeLorean family, because they were like, you can't license this. You don't own it. And they were like, hey, they settled outside of court. And they were like, we own it. And they did. And they weren't they because they were like, well, we you guys didn't keep it. The company went under, and we started a new company called DMC, and they made the exact same logo. And but all that stuff had expired because the company was gone. And so now they weren't the owners of the DMC brand. Okay, so they settled outside of court, they own the brand. Speaker 1 Well, you can get DMC merch on our website, until And so I own it now. Speaker 2 So they did that for a few years. Yeah, till 2015 When they were like, it'd be cool if we got into EVs, because those are super big right now. And so they decided to make a DeLorean Evie. And this is the concept car for that. Were you supposed to go into production in January this year? This next year? Okay, which I mean, it looks just like a DeLorean. It's, it's kind of cool. Like a classic DeLorean. But it's it's an electric car now. Yeah. And it's a guy who was like a hobbyist who loved the DeLorean. But kind of stole the DeLorean out from the DeLorean family. And so the door and family not to be undone his two kids. These two You see him here, daughter and his daughter and a son. His daughter said we need to keep the family name alive. Yeah. And so she started DeLorean next generation company. And she is en si. She is making her own DeLorean which looks strikingly similar to their as a DeLorean Evie, which is supposed to go into production January this year, they announced it four months after the DeLorean Motor Company announced it and it looks just like the other one exactly the same. It looks like the same car. Speaker 1 Is there another angle of this? No, this is the only angle they've released was just the butt. Okay, here's the rub, though. Speaker 2 Here's the thing with with tip though, is she she? And this is interesting. I'm really interested to see how this pans out for her. Yeah, she started this company. She brought on a lot of the original people because she's got connections to the family. So she brought on a lot of the original designers and people that worked with to produce the original DeLorean. But she instead of starting a business, she started a 5013 C. And so what they're doing is they're building these cars to be a nonprofit and what they're using the the profits for from the car sales is they're doing STEM programs and underprivileged schools. And so she's like, we want to raise up the next generation of engineers is the idea. I'm interested to see how this pans out because I don't Unknown Speaker Okay. Speaker 2 Vitals fishy, but okay, and donate now on the website. Speaker 1 To the Chi see, I see the play. Speaker 2 And so, so she's like, she's like, we're gonna take down DMC, they've been in lots of legal battles with them ever since. Because, yeah, you don't have to look at it. Yeah. And so yeah, so it's the same car. Here's the thing. That's that's his daughter, right? The dog Speaker 3 the dog as a company to wait two dogs dog is making dog and Motor Company. Speaker 2 Butter company though. The son, the son, he started a company, okay? DeLorean aerospace. And he's making this Unknown Speaker guy doesn't even look like Speaker 2 he's like we don't need a car. We need personal jet. And so that's what a two seater? Yeah, it's just in the idea pillar for some Speaker 1 reason. Why wouldn't you? I mean, if you're gonna do all this stuff, why not just make it a jet? Unknown Speaker I think the idea is supposed to be affordable. Unknown Speaker Propellers not okay. It's a vertical takeoff. Speaker 2 So like that thing moves? No. So you can take off vertically. So the idea is that that's not gonna work ideas that you and I we we can have one of these in our driveway. We can just vertically take off from a driveway. This is how we're getting around town that's not going to work. And so he's he's always been the dreamer of the family. I'll tell you right now, it's not gonna work. So there's no three DeLorean companies out there. DeLorean Motor Company, DeLorean next generation company and DeLorean aerospace and motor vehicles. Speaker 3 Mediacom company world All right, let me call it a lawyer. I got a DeLorean immediate fit a lot for I call her lawyer right now. Good Speaker 2 things out there last night is a production of space Tim medium produced by Christian Taylor audio by Alex Garnett video by Connor Betts, our graphics and our logo by Caleb Goldberg and our social media is run by Caleb Walker. Our hosts are Jeremiah and Tim stone. Follow us on your favorite social media platform at tilian podcast is Ti ll en podcast. Remember to tell all your friends about us, and we'll see you next Tuesday for another episode of things I learned last night. Transcribed by

John DeLorean was a remarkable man who significantly impacted the world of automobiles. His life was filled with excitement, innovation, and even a little bit of controversy. Let’s take a closer look at the life of John DeLorean and the legacy he left behind. Early Life and Education John DeLorean was born in Detroit, Michigan, on January 6, 1925. He … Read More

Skinwalker Ranch Part 2 – Aliens, Ghosts and Lies


Episode Transcription

Made by robots for robots. Only read if you're weird.

Unknown Speaker Hey man, what's up? Unknown Speaker Oh, not much how you doing? I'm alright, I'm gonna happy you're here. Thanks. Have you ever heard? Speaker 1 What are you going to pass the buckets in a second? What was that? I'm happy you're here. Let us know a little bit about you fill out that card Speaker 2 is already a drop in the bucket. There'll be someone pulls up next you in the stoplight is going to pass the bucket over to you roll your window down. What are you talking if you're listening on the podcast? Oh, yeah, the churches do that they know where you are. Speaker 1 I like the idea that someone's listening on a run right now. And someone's gonna pull up next to the stoplight. And that's just for the offering pretty creepy. Speaker 2 I like I like churches that have that like extra touch. You know what it's like? Sure. For the online experience. Speaker 1 It was honked at one of my friends walking the other day. This is real. And she looked like I was like, she's out there walking with her dog. And I was driving to the grocery store. And I did Hmm. I don't think she realized what kind of car I drive. I don't know if she knew was me. Yeah. But then also, later, she tweeted. And she said because she's like a counselor or whatever. And she's she said, Don't honk at people you think are attractive on the side of the road. And I had a messenger it'd be like a first of all, get over yourself. Because I was just Speaker 3 saying that I thought that. I was just saying hi. Second of all, second Speaker 1 of all, I'm gonna hog it. Every person I see walking now. Well, she did a whole like, you know, it could like trigger a trauma response to them. And I'm like, gosh, I do. Listen, there's some stuff that makes me a little. Yeah. We should cut it before we say something canceled. You're right. model trains. No one's No, you don't need the Pentagon permission to do it. Yeah, just tell the audience you don't read. Adult? No, right. I know what you're saying. Okay. You catch aliens with a fax machine. That's what I'm saying. You gotta point $2 million from the government bro. Things I Learned last night Speaker 3 Amen. Have you heard going on? Skinwalker Ranch. Oh my gosh. Unknown Speaker Are you serious? Is there Unknown Speaker a lot more than 100%? Serious? You've done this. Unknown Speaker No, go ahead. Unknown Speaker Yeah, this is a part two. Unknown Speaker We've covered this. Speaker 1 Okay. I was genuinely worried that you did not know that. We did a Skinwalker Ranch episode. I was about to close your eyes for a second. I was like, Oh, he's He's toast. But I was honestly gonna let you do it. And we were gonna release it is whenever we're afraid I am that you'll do when we're old man. And we still do this podcast. Podcasting is so old. So it's God. It's like It's like it's like a TV sets. It's like no one does that anymore. But we're still doing it. And you're like, just bring Speaker 3 the same story every episode every episode. Same topic. So part two, just Speaker 2 a show called it's the same topic. And we just do the same topic every episode. Would it be a good and see what happens by the end? It's like a game of telephone. It's a game a podcast and see where it ends up at the end if this Speaker 1 is really about Skinwalker Ranch I'm excited because the YouTube comments from the first Skinwalker Ranch episode. Do we have an update for real? We do. Speaker 2 So yeah, we covered this before and after do a full episode. Yes. So we've covered this before in March of 2022 Yes, so yeah, we've covered this in March of 2022 If you haven't heard that episode, now's your chance to go here it's a it's a fun episode I listened to it this morning I forgot how good that episode was Unknown Speaker episodes are good yeah but this except for that one now this you know the one Speaker 2 this one we added a bit and this is a new thing I want to do I did this for the glitter monster in the discord I asked our Discord that draw Oh, I saw that I was using for the thumbnail Yeah, and I think I want to do that. The Skinwalker is another good one. It's like hey guys, can Unknown Speaker you draw this? Yeah, I Unknown Speaker like having them draw stuff Speaker 1 or we have some artists in the discord do we do have some people who are not artists but still draw Speaker 2 like that? Well, one of our submissions came from Mickey Mickey Senate from Excel. She drew it in an Excel spreadsheet so Speaker 1 when I was gonna use for the series, if you don't know what we're talking about discord, what's discord Discord is like, on professional slack Discord is like Ayane Yeah, kind of, but Unknown Speaker it's unprofessional. Speaker 1 That's what it is. But yeah, cuz slack is just discordance. slacks, you know, Unknown Speaker that's actually very accurate. Unknown Speaker It's all it is. Unknown Speaker That's what they should brand and I should Speaker 1 do that. But we have our Patreon supporters get access to our Discord where we're we've been messaging and play games and yeah, they're very funny. They're funny. Are they fun? Yeah, Tim Unknown Speaker I don't think that's good. Walker Ridge if you're here for the first time. Unknown Speaker Oh, shoot. Is this from the UFO stuff? Speaker 2 Kind? Kinda. Okay. Technically, yes, sure. So here's the deal. So if you don't know much about Skinwalker Ranch, and you're free to go back to listen to the old episode, long story short, there's a ranch in Utah called Skinwalker Ranch. And it's weird. Yeah. Speaker 1 There's so all the other ranches in Utah where Mormons are kind of like. Speaker 2 So it's had four owners over its history. There's a guy named Kenneth and Kenneth AB the buyers, a guy named Kenneth, his wife, Edith Meyers owned it. The majority of the life of the proper age. Yeah, from 1934 to 1994. No problems everything normal ranch experience, as far as we know, like as as, think about life on ranch. That's the life that they lived in Utah, a Utah ranch. That's what they had. Have you seen there? My dog? Torch. I did it for the 1996 was Terry and Gwen Sherman. And they had a think about a life in a Utah range. That's not what they experienced. Totally different. Yeah. Unknown Speaker They got spooked. Yeah, they Speaker 2 got spooked. They saw aliens, and monsters and werewolves, you name it, Speaker 1 and then went to Home find the old people who owned it before them and the government was like, Who? Speaker 2 Yeah, those people don't exist. In fact, neither does ranch Unknown Speaker never existed. You're in a field right now. Earth Unknown Speaker isn't real. What's Speaker 1 gaslighting? Real bad? Okay, Unknown Speaker there's no such thing as Earth. What are you talking about? Unknown Speaker Unplug yourself, but what? Speaker 2 And so they made this big deal about it being super weird. Yeah. And a real estate millionaire named Robert Bigelow was like, oh, I want it and so he bought it in 1996. Dude, Speaker 1 here's the thing, man. You know, I want to buy a house just to create some lower. Yeah, you know, and then sell it. You know? Just be like, Oh, yeah. Write a book or to someone got murdered here. Yeah. Speaker 2 All the all the water? Yeah. Speaker 1 Honestly. No. Because you know how much I would pay for the watchers house. Unknown Speaker I would pay a lot. Yes. Yeah. I Speaker 3 mean, how much can you pay? $637,000 $657.06 157 cents. Okay, why did you say okay? Yes, yes. Yeah, Speaker 1 but I'm saying if I had a ranch, yes. If I bought a ranch, yes. Yes. You know, I'd make it like a podcast. Jaron buys a ranch. Aaron Bought a Zoo. And it's on Unknown Speaker its audit. And he built a fort the garage and no Unknown Speaker one. I bought a zoo and no one knew. Unknown Speaker Oh my god, Jared. Speaker 1 Speaking of zoos, my Did you know that? My my I told you what my cousins who owned like a zoo Tiger. Yeah, like tigers. Unknown Speaker Not a zoo. But like, Tiger King Zoo. Speaker 1 Yeah, one of those fake zoos. But they had to get like the Ohio came and took all their animals after that guy who lives in the next county over from them let out all of his animals. Yeah. Yeah. And then Ohio was like, Huh. Anyway, we were in Ohio. And we drove past the property. And I forgot that it's just in a neighborhood. Like, it's just like, I was like, Yeah, it's like, way out in the country. You know, there's a big field on their side. But like, there is no neighborhood. And like, you know how when you're a kid, and you're like, this place is huge. Because you're a kid. Yeah. You're an adult. That's just a lot. It's a it's, it's a house. It's like a double lot like they got two agents heard their yard into a zoo. And I forgot they did that. Speaker 2 And it's like, a garage sale. They got signs on all the streetlights Speaker 1 this way and they sell tigers. You know, I'm talking about. They were very kind to their animals. Yeah, Unknown Speaker they had masking tape on their paws. $3. Speaker 1 Yeah, it was like peeling off. I tried to haggle. I was like, Come on, go out. Six hours. 57 cents, you know, anyway. Okay, so Robert Bigelow, there's a property in Utah. And there's some sketchy stuff that they claimed happened, but the old people never experienced it all people never experienced it. And then these periods when this rich guy was like, I want it because of the weird stuff. Yes. And so he that's what I was trying to say. Speaker 2 Yeah. So he founds the knids, which is the National Institute for Discovery Science. And the idea was I'm gonna hire a bunch of paranormal people to investigate this Speaker 1 not yours use the lids store that just sells small Hey, cool hat Speaker 1 this episode sucks. If you found this podcast and you have no idea what's going on, they call back. Speaker 2 Okay, Robert Bigelow, he buys it starts the NIDS for a couple of years, nothing really happens. And then it's kind of Speaker 1 like dang it. They made it up to sell me this house. Speaker 2 Well, it's really quiet. And he's, he's publicly saying like, yeah, we're not really seeing anything happening there. And then a few years later, and I think 2004 a book releases called Skin walk. Unknown Speaker I think I don't remember where Speaker 1 you came. That first episode was so confident and you just called Unknown Speaker I know. Speaker 2 I know the name of the SEC. Oh, hunt for the Skinwalker okay. I was gonna call it the second we could Speaker 1 do as a skin. We could do like a, we could do a podcast on skin. We're trying to figure out a true crime podcast. Yeah. Speaker 2 Hunt for this podcast comes out. And it is a full book of the craziest stories you've ever heard. Yeah, werewolves and dinosaur beavers, and UFOs. And ghosts and portals and skinwalkers is just insanity. And it's like, wow, I thought a couple years ago, nothing was happening. And then the knids mysteriously gets shut down a couple years after that. And by who? By them by the NIDS. Okay, they realized skinwalkers they came up with their cookies. Like, hey, we know I mean, Unknown Speaker like the government didn't shut them down. Unknown Speaker Okay, allegedly. So they get shut down. And then in 2016 Unknown Speaker So I was trying to do what you do with your nose over here. Blowing into the microphone the whole Speaker 2 time. It's my T stick. What was it? So in 2016 router bigla sells it to Brandon fugal. Google is like Unknown Speaker there's a lot of stuff happening here. He's Speaker 2 another real estate millionaire. Who's just building a bunch of stuff in Utah. Yeah. And, but he is a lifelong Mormon. And he's not as I mean, he's interested in the paranormal, paranormal stuff, definitely into sci fi and things like that. But for him, the bigger part of the goal is if he can prove that there's paranormal activity happening there, then it proves the existence of God because if there's demons, then there's got to be a god. So that's kind of his angle. He immediately has motivation. Yeah, he made it goes and trademarks Skinwalker Ranch as a media brand, and then they release the Skinwalker Ranch TV show on History Channel right and follow the whole story. We covered this in our last episode, and we basically were like this is a stupid idea except for all the alien stuff the alien stuff super legitimate but all the rest of it is super stupid. Yeah. Unknown Speaker Yeah. Except for the part about God. Unknown Speaker So there's Stephen Green Street. Speaker 1 Okay, sounds like a young adult author. Kinda. He's 44 years tell the audience you don't read a middle aged adult? No, he will write I know what you're saying. Okay. Okay, whatever Unknown Speaker it's called a joke. Speaker 1 was a good one, buddy. Thanks. So he is a jerk logical leave one star reviews right there. He's a journalist for The New York Post. Joking around too much. I'm sorry comedy podcast. I like more seriously Speaker 1 in my eyes right now. Okay. Do you drink it wrong? A little bit. I'm so worried. What did you just say? Unknown Speaker I feel the caffeine. Unknown Speaker You know, he's a journalist for who the New York Speaker 2 Post. Okay. And he has for a long time at a series on on YouTube on the YouTubes called basement office. Okay. And this series he brought on the lease Elizondo. That's the only name that comes to mind. A bunch of UFO people. All right, to talk about UFOs and aliens and things like sure big fan of UFOs and Unknown Speaker aliens was the aliens guy, you know, talking about Speaker 2 oh, the guy from Ancient Aliens. Yeah, last name. Okay. I just know he's been a big proponent of aliens and stuff. So he digs into remember the big UFO report in like 2018 with the Tick Tack UFO and all that stuff? Unknown Speaker Yes. Speaker 2 A big part of that was Louise Elizondo, which I'll show you a picture of him actually, I think, Okay, let me grab a picture so you can jog your memory on him. A lot of people call him Lou. Speaker 1 I don't know who he is. I'm gonna tell you right now. I don't know who he is. I Speaker 2 guarantee you're gonna recognize him. I won't guarantee it. You guarantee I'll recognize guarantee. You're gonna recognize him. You're you I could not be more confident that you're gonna recognize this guy. Hold on. Let me get a recognizable picture of him Speaker 3 really selling it. Oh, nine that doesn't look anything like I wanted. You wouldn't recognize. That doesn't look anything like. Unknown Speaker Let me get someone who looks like someone Unknown Speaker stop stop right now Unknown Speaker Oh, not that one Unknown Speaker I just had that in my first center. trifle. Speaker 1 Oh, ever since he offered me those tickets aware jam. I do recognize this guy. Yeah, he was the basis of skillet. Unknown Speaker That's actually I think that was what he did before. Speaker 2 Now so Lisa has no idea who this guy is not recognizing No. Do you watch TV? Yeah, Unknown Speaker I don't watch the same TV that you watch on Fox Unknown Speaker News before? Unknown Speaker What is he any news? He's Unknown Speaker been all over anyways. Unknown Speaker So watch the news. Yeah, let Unknown Speaker me get let me get Speaker 1 stopped don't what? What are you doing getting a picture of him on the news? Unknown Speaker No, I'm just getting a picture of him that you would. Unknown Speaker Okay. Speaker 3 Do you guarantee this one as well? No, Speaker 1 apparently not. Apparently, it looks like this guy looks like in I managed this in a good way. Like he looks like a guy who's been a youth pastor for 30 years. Yeah, yeah. You know, I'm saying Yeah, he does, actually. And like, it's rare to find those guys. Sometimes I'll do shows. And like, I'll go to a church and the youth pastors again, been doing this for about two decades when the youth has like no aspirations to like, because a lot of people treat youth ministry like a ladder. Yeah, yes. Step toward a different position. Yeah. And I love it when I run into somebody who's like, oh, no, I love students. And you're like, oh my gosh, yeah. Yeah. And aliens like, Well, where are you finding something else? Are we going to keep talking about I was just waiting Speaker 2 for you to finish your thing. Okay, go ahead. You ready? Sure. Okay. Speaker 1 Hey, thanks for being part of this episode. If you want to help us do more of this, you wanna help us grow our show. One of the easiest and best ways to do that is to join our Patreon. It's a way for you financially support the show, and you get a lot in return, you get access to our Discord channel, you get bonus content that comes out, you get exclusive merchandise, and like live zoom Hangouts, where we're both just hanging out eating pizza, just getting to know each other. The biggest thing is, is we want to know you more as an individual and as a friend. So thanks for supporting our show. If you don't support us financially, we're not pressed about it. We're not like mad, but I'll find you. So text Tillandsia 66866 To keep yourself from being found. All right, because if you don't I want you Speaker 2 so this is at the podium is Chris Mellon. Speaker 1 I'm gonna know any of these guys. And then I know Slenderman in the middle Speaker 2 Yeah, that's a couple defense contractors in the middle of them is how put off you might remember him from the remote viewing episode. He's the guy. Speaker 1 This is the guy speaking. Yeah. Is I believe, could tell me if I'm wrong. I think he's in the President's show at Disneyland, you know, talking about is that am I wrong? But he looks like he would be one of the robots. Speaker 2 Now that's Christopher Mellon, who used to be deputy assistant secretary of the defense for intelligence just on Speaker 1 body language. Can we just go off body language? Go off of it? Okay, so guys speaking we've got closest VR together. Okay. He's a big old nerd dude. Unknown Speaker He's a animatronic. Yeah, that's Speaker 1 what I'm saying. He's not his legs do not move. That Speaker 2 does not real I realized I couldn't say half of that quote after I Speaker 1 started. Oh, I just started to go as you started to not real. The airplane late. I Unknown Speaker did. I did that that Speaker 1 person is not real sure. Second guy's dad super rich. Yeah. He's not but his dad is rich. Like that's, you know, close. Guys, Lou Lou is like the bad boy of this conference. Yeah, Louis just like, yeah, I believe in aliens. And I'd love to cage fight. One guy next to him straight up is like a vampire. And when he speaks, it's like, all yod believe in aliens. And then the guy next to him is his handler. Yeah, he's like, he's like, what do they call that a familiar? And then the guy on the end is just a billionaire who bought his way onto the panel? You know, I'm talking about Yeah, the guy in the middle freaks me out. Scares. He's Unknown Speaker very scary. You should be scared of him. Speaker 2 I am to know Okay, so you are close, actually. So the first is Chris Mellon. So he was the Deputy Secretary of Defense under the Clinton administration makes sense. We'll skip back for a second then Louis sounds and Elizondo we know him. And then the next guy you're right is for forever. No, I'm pretty sure that when Steve justice and then how put off you might remember him from our remote viewing episode. He's the bend spoons guy and see things on on Mars. Okay, but he was an actual government contractor. Yeah. And electrical engineer and then the last guy I'm pretty sure is Chris miser. All government ties first miser government contractor worked with. I don't think so. I'm not a super rich guy. They I worked with I think skunk works, but don't quote me on that. I'm not much. Speaker 1 I hate to be like a 997 millionaire. You don't sound like you're just so close. I mean, I Speaker 2 would just call myself a billionaire at that point. Yeah, well, okay. I mean, at my point where I'm at now, billionaire. Yeah, I'm a billionaire. No one's gonna check. Unknown Speaker According to the internet, I'm worth like a lot. Unknown Speaker Yeah, yeah, it's true. Those are always like, way off. Unknown Speaker Super underreported. And then Unknown Speaker I don't know if you know this, the guy on the left, the one that dad's rich. Yeah, that's Tom DeLonge. From blink 182. Is it really? Unknown Speaker Okay? Yes, I'm being serious. Speaker 2 This is Tom DeLonge is company to the stars. Media is his company that he started. And he put together this team of all star. Unknown Speaker He's an adult contractors. Speaker 2 I know. It's so interesting seeing him in here being super professional, because if you watch them in any of his shows, he's not. Unknown Speaker But he's so intently listening. Speaker 2 Yeah, he's serious. In this same in this same press conference. This was the first press conference that they did with it. When they said you're fine. You know what it Speaker 1 is about the vampire guy? What it said everyone else is looking at the guy speaking. He's nine. He's just not. That's what it is. He's also someone else's like, Oh, yeah. And he's just Unknown Speaker there's someone in the crowd is like, is he looking at me? Unknown Speaker Everyone's crossed. Versus like, I think he's staring right at me, right? Why is he doing that? His eyes have that effect. You know? Speaker 1 That's what I'm saying. Wherever you're sitting in the room. It looks like he's looking at you. Man. Spooky guy, man. Yeah, Unknown Speaker not pictured in the shot is the queen hanging Unknown Speaker upside down from the rafters empty chairs. Speaker 2 Now in this in this press conference, this was the first time we saw the tic tac video. They leaked it, which was before it was declassified. The government was really mad about that. And then a year later, they're like, Fine, that's ours. Tom also in this video, he was like, he's like we're building our own UFO. haven't seen that yet. But Speaker 1 we're building our own UFO. Yeah, that was one thing that he said our companies do building something and we can identify it. We means you're building a revenue. Oh, Isabel, you know what it is missionary? Identify. It's a flying object Speaker 2 using the technology that they've uncovered. I guess this? Sure. So Louise Elizondo ends up becoming kind of the de facto face of this company. Even though it's Tom's company. Tom was busy being a rock star, which he quit his band. I mean, he still had angels and airwaves and but he was like writing kids novels or something. I don't know. He wants He's Unknown Speaker not a kid though. Unknown Speaker Right kids novels as a grown adult. So Speaker 2 Musa was kind of the de facto face of his company. Okay. And he goes on this press tour. Yeah, talking about UFOs. And he is making pretty strong claims that the the things that they've looked at are evidence that there's something else out there, that's not a nonhuman origin. Okay? This leads to the Pentagon putting together a special committee, eventually becoming a whole new program, multimillion dollar program to investigate these unidentified flying objects. Okay. And that's still in operation to this day, as a result of what this group did was tell us onto his background. A little bit about him. He was in the military, he was in counterintelligence guy went on to the Pentagon, and was the director of a program called a tip the advanced aerospace threat Identification Program. And he headed up this program, the whole purpose this program, it was a Unknown Speaker um, I guess. I'm trying to think of the right word a secret, it was a secret program. Unknown Speaker Okay, I wasn't gonna say secret, but that Speaker 2 I was like, I'll just say secret is a secret program in the Pentagon to look at all of these cases of UFOs and be like, it's actually alien or it's just like a balloon or something, you know? Okay. And that was his job. And so he's coming forward as like a whistleblower now talking about all this stuff. And income Stephen green St. Stephen green shoots talking about all this stuff. Over the past few years, we've had all these explosive like, here's this video. Here's this video. Here's the stuff. Here's this guy in the military who's talking about what he's seen or whatever. Sure. So Stephen Green Street started digging into this a little bit, and he discovers something's awry with this story. It all okay, so Luis Elizondo, he was the head Unknown Speaker of St. Louis CK. I was like, How is Speaker 2 ck you know how Jason Bourne is an FBI agent. Speaker 2 Okay, stand up. Comics is the same thing. No one suspects the funny guy. Speaker 2 So a tip Yeah. Was the program that super secret Luis Elizondo was heading up. He was the program director. And he claimed that they had $20 million with the funding, founded in 2007. Speaker 1 He claims all this, yes. When documents approve this Unknown Speaker kind kinda Speaker 1 like any, I guess anybody really could just be like, I did some serious work for the government. Okay, so the government isn't gonna be like, oh, Speaker 2 so Well, look, this is where we're heading. So in 2017, he leaves in three years later, he joins are now in 2017, he leaves to join to the stars Academy, and starts becoming the face of Alien Disclosure, basically. Okay. And in that process, everyone was like, this is the former director of a tipped a super secret program at the Pentagon. We have record of him working at the Pentagon, we have a record of him working in counter intelligence, and being a very high ranking officer in the DOD. However, we can't find anything about at it. And the story that's told is that it's because it's a super secret program. Sure. It's releasing the information about a Tim specifically, Unknown Speaker but also he does make it up. Speaker 2 So Stephen Green Street does some digging in Oh, along with a handful of other journalists outside of his specific like in his network, but not for the New York Post. Other journalists he's kind of worked with. And so he starts doing some digging, and he finds that he was a part of a tip but the the reporting on a tip was very misleading, especially in those early days where the abbreviation a tip was correct. But a lot of people were messing up what a tip stood for. And so there was advanced aerospace threat Identification Program. Advanced aeronautical threat Identification Program, okay. Advanced airborne threat Identification Program. So the advanced aerial threat Identification Program. So all these different versions were that A was different. And so people were submitting these FOIA requests from the government, and it'd be like, that doesn't exist. Because everybody was getting it wrong. Sure. But nobody knew that at the time. Everyone's just like, the government's denying that this is real. And it's they weren't denying they were just like, yeah, what you asked us for doesn't exist. Instead of being like, Oh, hey, here's the thing you're asking. There's like, that's not real, which is pretty convenient. Speaker 1 I'm saying like, if I'm the records department, and someone puts in now that my job you know, saying like, that's not my job. Speaker 2 You look at it. Look through your files and you see it you're like it says that I Speaker 1 did a gig. And I got a check that was made out to Jason Myers. Yeah. With my or spelled incorrectly. Yeah. and Bank of America would not deposit it, because neither name matched. Yeah. Yeah. They're like this isn't you? Like, it is me though. You know me? Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah. And I constantly deposit checks that are not even close to my name. Unknown Speaker I just find them Unknown Speaker fine checks. Speaker 2 They say if you find a $20 bill on the street, it's yours. If you find a $2 million check on the street, it's yours doesn't matter Speaker 1 at the store. And, and I got backed over my bicycle. And I was like, Hey, mister, you got to pay for that. And he wrote me a check. but forgot to fill out the amount of part because he was like, in a rush or something. Yeah, he was a busy man. And I went home, and I put in $1 million. Unknown Speaker And they cash that. Yeah. And they said, okay, Speaker 1 and I bought it at the grocery store. And I had an inappropriate relationship with a woman who should not have been anywhere near 13 year old kid in that movie. Speaker 2 So long story short, after a giant rabbit trail of trying to track down this eight tip program. Yeah, what they discovered is that a tip was never in its name. A tip wasn't a nickname that it got. And the reason it got the name is because Senator Harry Reid was heading up this a tip program. He was the person in Senate that said, let's do this. And so he realized that there was some I don't want to say sketchy things that were happening, but things that the government probably would be like, stop giving money to this. And so he was like, we need to kind of get shadowy here. And so he made another name for it, called the advanced aerospace threat Identification Program, a tip and started calling it that and had everybody in the program start calling it that, to kind of keep it a little hidden Speaker 1 once we made a shadow company, basically, to keep getting funding from the government. Speaker 2 Sort of it came out he made I mean, it was still it was still ginamit we made the zba it kinda but it wasn't there was nothing on paper, there was no paperwork. So there's no paper trail, okay, it was just in every document in every document talking about it. He would call it a tip. Speaker 1 Yeah, it's like, kids from my school, his name was biscuit. Like there's no paperwork that says the name is business. Yeah, but everyone knows him. But he showed up one day, it was like I'm biscuit. And we were like, all right. Unknown Speaker If that's what you want to be called, Unknown Speaker he ran real fast one time we call him biz quick for a week. Fast kid, Speaker 2 the real name of the program was the advanced aerospace weapon systems app application program, or aos app, Unknown Speaker or SAS. Speaker 2 app. So this program is interesting because this program was founded in 2007. And in 2008, they put out a request for proposals for defense contractors to earn $22 million to investigate. Specifically, this is what the document Unknown Speaker defense contractors, how do we get into that Speaker 2 lie? They put out a request for bids to research weapons systems that our adversaries have, and predict where they will be in 40 years. Technologically. That was okay. I searched it, I see it as a contract. So they put out this request for bids in 2008. Weirdly, this request for bid comes out in 2008. But in 2007, Robert Bigelow's company, Bigelow, aerospace wins that request for bid a year before it comes out. So something sketchy here is happening already. Unknown Speaker What do you mean they win the bid? So Speaker 2 typically, the request for bid comes out, all the companies are like, here's what we'll do, here's how much of a cost and then they award it to one of the companies. Sure, a year before the request for bid even comes out. Speaker 1 The government rewards it to Bigelow Yeah. before it ever and then in 2008. They're like, Speaker 2 they're like, here's a request for bids. And then they're like quietly like, we already give this to somebody. Yeah, yeah. Bigelow was a campaign funder for Harry Reid. They were close. They're tight. They was always been tight. So it's pretty clear that Bigelow was like, Hey, I got a cool idea. I need $22 million. And Senator Reid was like, sweet, you got it. And then a year later, he was like, shoot, I just gave 22 Lidar is this guy for no reason. And so he puts out this request for bid. And then let it sit for a minute and pulls it back to kind of have a paper trail of like, oh, yeah, we gave it to this guy. He want bows a year later, he gives them $22 million. Okay. And that's where it needs comes from. And so knids began studying Skinwalker Ranch. And it's really point $2 million from the government. Yes, dang. And so we got to Unknown Speaker start being corrupt. Unknown Speaker Like I corrupt knowledge that, but that was a great line. Thank Unknown Speaker you snuck it in there. It was good. Speaker 2 And so Robert Bigelow takes that $22 million. And he hires a team of wacky voodoo scientists. Yeah. Unknown Speaker Sure. LinkedIn. Well, Speaker 1 I am a aerospace engineer. Yeah, I am a neurosurgeon. Yeah, I'm a wacky kind of guy. Okay, well take. Speaker 2 But yeah, all the scientists were it was how put off the guy who did the remote viewing in the 70s. It was UFO research. Speaker 1 Tom DeLonge. Blink 182. It's not the kind of group that instills confidence. You know? Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah. And so they start studying Skinwalker Ranch, and they're finding nothing. But there's a report from a security guard that he had hired, and the security guard did an interview with Steven Green Street. And he said, the culture was really rough. And he said that nothing was happening at the ranch. And everybody knew nothing was happening at the ranch. But every day we had to fax reports of what happened at the ranch that day to Bigelow Bigelow lived in Nevada, so wasn't even on site facts. Speaker 3 That's what affects is he wasn't finishing the email with facts, nothing. Facts. That's my new signature big facts. Speaker 2 Now, he was often in Nevada and so every day he's getting these reports that nothing's happening at the ranch. And he's getting real mad. He's getting Speaker 1 tearing the paper out of the fax machine. Well, years this 2007 They got an email too late faxes. It's a way to catch aliens with a fax machine. That's what I'm saying. You got $1.2 million from the government bro. Invent slack or something? At least discord You don't gotta make it professional. You know? Unknown Speaker You're right, you're right. But yeah, he's Speaker 2 got these facts says every day sure that say a big hello. Nothing's happening. And he's getting really upset. Yeah. And people started to feel like their jobs are on the line. And so people started just lying and just making stuff up and faxing it off and being like, we saw Donald beaver today. And he'd be like, Good job, guys. You found it you found something new like we saw a wormhole open up and a bunch of interdimensional creatures started crawling out of it. It was crazy. We Speaker 1 saw Dinah Weaver today. Delivered that. How was work today? Uh, you know, I don't know. I was like, 15 minutes late. Traffic was ridiculous, dude. And like my lunch. I had microwaved it. But you know, when the microwave in the middle is still kind of cold. So frustrating. So Dinobot. Backup. Oh, and that was bad. What could have caused that we live in the middle of nowhere? Yes. Skinwalker. Ranch. So because Speaker 2 everybody started out as lying. Yeah, they're trying to keep their jobs. Yeah. And then one of the, Speaker 1 you know, that's what our team does as well. They lie to us to keep tabs. There's one team member who's supporting us like $1,000 a month on Patreon just to make us believe we have Billy supporters. Speaker 2 Yeah. And he made like 20 different accounts. Speaker 1 Yeah, no, he already had those accounts already watches on YouTube. So it boosts our views. Speaker 2 You know, yeah, that's, I mean, I think you're Unknown Speaker and you're a jerk to him every week Unknown Speaker our work culture is terrible because of you. Yeah. Unknown Speaker Well, it's because we don't have slack. We're faxing. Unknown Speaker Teams not getting them. A fax machine, your fax machine. It'll be like a restaurant Unknown Speaker go to the store. Buy tomatoes. We're not gonna have enough for this. All we serve is just to make the best restaurant that just wasn't very good. Ketchup. You want a raw tomato. We will do anything with it. We'll add the right to the cow. Yeah, can I get three raw to me? Why Unknown Speaker tomatoes? Is that Celsius hidden your eyes? What's going on? eyeballs, man. All right. Restaurant. Wouldn't we just be alright? The farmers market. So we're like we're like sabotaging other tomato booths Speaker 3 we're the only tomato guys in town. Okay. Hey, we do one of the tomatoes. You know that right? No, Unknown Speaker no, we're the tomato, tomatoes. If you want to make Unknown Speaker those, two of Speaker 2 us Yeah. And our names are both made Unknown Speaker out on paper, Speaker 2 paper legally we'll never be able to find that. But as far as you're concerned and as far as anyone's concerned, it's made a lot of people think we're in NATO, but we're not related. We're not related to NATO. So Speaker 1 I'm angry at how much time I've wasted Okay, so I'm angry listening back to this later on. Right now Unknown Speaker you're in your car on your commute, driving to another. Unknown Speaker The red light just stuck a bucket out and Unknown Speaker get that book and I like gar get that out of my face. Hey, thanks for checking Speaker 2 out this episode. If you liked this, we've got a lot of great ones. Let me recommend a recent one hitch bot. Basically some Canadian scientists said what if we made a robot that hitchhiked across the country you think it can make it SPOILER ALERT it's a fun episode. I like it a lot. You can need to check it out. One of my favorite recent jokes is in there. So check that one out but if not, thanks for being here Unknown Speaker so one of the program directors isn't as cold Kelleher, another one of the Voodoo wacky scientists man. Speaker 1 Yeah, I'm a wacky guy. I don't know Dr. Wacky. Unknown Speaker You get to last you got to surgery. You're sitting there the scrubs or whatever they give you back. Speaker 2 Like they do where they like roll the wheels in. And then they sit like with the thing in front of the back in front of them. Yeah, man. It's me. And he doesn't one of the elbow arm shakes. Because he's gloved up. He's scrubbed up so he does want to sleep. Well, not a lot of bodies slip. He does one of those. Like, I can't shake your hand but I can elbow tap you like we all did in COVID. And he's like, Hey, I'm a wacky guy. Unknown Speaker Dr. Wacky All right. You recording Unknown Speaker so called Kelleher? Speaker 2 I don't know if he was an actual like on site director or if he was a remote director kind of like Bigelow was Yeah. That he goes to George Knapp. Do you know who George Knapp is? George Knapp is the reporter who broke the Bob Lazar story, okay, and so he and he ever since Bob Lazar has been a huge alien reporter guy, sure. They co author a book. And it's that book hunt for the Skinwalker show science confronts the unexplained on a remote ranch in Utah could have left the last part off, but it made it sound more smart. Okay, and so it's this 300 page book of stories of things that they've seen at the ranch, but no evidence, no pictures, no proof that they talked about all this data that they got and they don't present. I know beaver. There's no work cited. There's nothing in this book of substance other than just interesting stories. They put that book out. And a guy at the Pentagon reads it. Speaker 1 I hate that there's people who work in the Department of Defense then they make sure our country safe and in his free time not even his free time probably on the clock is reading about Skinwalker Ranch. If you're a government employee listening to this episode, I don't care what level of government ploy maybe you're the president. Yeah. Joey or maybe you're you drive a city bus all right, all the way down. Whatever level of government employee you are. Quit doing this. We're Unknown Speaker not for you. Be a professional. Listen to boring podcasts. Yeah. We're not a new source. We are a new source or more of a content bug. Speaker 2 You notice are you doing some Jeremy Jeremy lucky ASCII. I think that's how you say his name. Sure. Jerry McCaskey, he reads the book and he's like, Oh, this is we need to look more into this works with Harry reading, he becomes the director of OSS app. And he starts leading the research and they go hard and a Skinwalker Ranch, trying to figure out what's going on a year after he takes out the rain. The rains uses Skinwalker Speaker 1 Ranch, just so you know. And I would love it. If they did a music festival. I Unknown Speaker didn't rocker. Good idea. Unknown Speaker That's a good idea. Speaker 2 That's what the trademark is for is media stuff. Yeah. So that are set up already for it. So a year later, the Harry Reid is sudden around this a tip stuff. He's like, he's like, Okay, this is getting a little crazy. I need to get special make this a special access program. So you have to have the highest level clearance to be a part of this. For a lot of reasons. One of which being this is getting really weird. I don't want anyone digging in our affairs. Sure. Unless I can kind Unknown Speaker of control who's Yeah. Speaker 2 And so he applies for a special access program, and it's denied. And when he goes to that SAP process that that means and it gets a dime, it goes out to the whole pentagon, I think that's something that they do where if like you start a project at the Pentagon, and it fails, they said Speaker 1 hello, Pentagon team. We just wanted to inform you that someone in the bill tried to keep some secrets. Well, we'll have you know that that's not allowed here. Unless we say so. Signed by the Pentagon. Facts. Speaker 2 Enter, you're about to send 230,000 recipients are you sure you want to do that? And everyone sees it, enter, enter. Speaker 1 The contents of this email are confidential and Speaker 3 do not tell anyone except for the 230,000 people on the street. at the Pentagon is Speaker 1 230,000. Are you been in the Pentagon? No. Unknown Speaker Oh, the subway. Unknown Speaker I have been to the Pentagon. Unknown Speaker Inside they do tours. No, they don't. Yes, they Unknown Speaker do insecure. They do. Look, look at our cool thing. Unknown Speaker My grandma took me she loves this country. She took me. Yeah, we did a tour. Speaker 2 Okay. So now the whole Pentagon knows about offset and a tip. And the whole Pentagon was like, why are we spending taxpayer dollars on this? And they were like, also, we can't let anybody know about this. Because they were like, This is ridiculous. Yeah. So they shut the program down. They lock it up. Couple years later, McCaskey retires couple years after that Harry Reid dies Unknown Speaker is old age it had nothing to do with the Pentagon. Speaker 1 Oh, is that what you were you were trying to find something? I thought you were just pausing for dramatic effect for some reason. I was like yeah, he died. You want to see picture you went? He went he died Okay, Unknown Speaker so So Speaker 2 this program gets shelved, and it's gone. Meanwhile, Louise Elizondo is working at the Pentagon and he reads the email he gets he's on the blockchain with everybody see and how much it flopped. And he's like email Unknown Speaker just Louise Speaker 3 DICOM they couldn't get no I said go. They gotta get go. They couldn't they couldn't even get cob. It's just org Unknown Speaker Please, is it available? Speaker 1 Might you say that? Is it available? Why do you say that like a church puppet puppet ministry was really big 2006 baby Moses do Speaker 2 next available? Pentagon dot law is that sounds like that shouldn't be but it's expensive. All the Pentagon, Speaker 1 Pentagon dot music. Think about putting out an album. Speaker 2 What about pentagon? that's a thing. Okay, so we saw his on a few years later, it gets shut down and he was like, remember that thing that broke? That didn't work out for anybody. We're only Unknown Speaker It's a payment subscription where you get to see all this. Speaker 3 You get an email. Whenever someone doesn't get a special access program. You're added to the list. Subscribe to our mailing list. Unknown Speaker I mean, I guess it is Because of content, you know? Unknown Speaker So they, he's like, he's like, Speaker 1 we got an ancient start one. And only fans. Yeah. Because they, they want us to Hey, they've been asking us, they want us to do Unknown Speaker just like that other YouTube All right. So they Speaker 2 we saw zondo is like remember that thing a tip that got shut down. He's like wouldn't be cool if I did that. And so he gets permission his boss to in his free time. Head up a new eighth tip, but it's not an official program, right? It's a hey, if I am here at the office and like there's nothing to do can I look at alien pictures model Speaker 1 trains? No one's know why you don't need the Pentagon's permission to do it. You know, it's a he's like he's but you can. Speaker 2 It's like if it really what it was is like, Hey, is it cool? If I look at pictures of aliens and his boss is like, I don't care. That's really what it was. Okay, and he was like, it's a tip and Speaker 1 eat nice. So he gets off the call off the phone line, no. Seals Unknown Speaker so he calls up all his friends around the Pentagon. And he's like, Hey, Unknown Speaker what do you Pentagon's Internet security is like, Speaker 2 good question. Broad pretty good. Pretty good. I would assume they got Unknown Speaker a VPN stream, Hulu there. Yeah. Speaker 2 They got a special government Hulu. Oh, do they? It's like Hulu like you know people who like watch Hulu out of like Great Britain or something so they get different shows. Unknown Speaker You should see what they have on the Pentagon. Speaker 1 Where to sign up where to where to finally break and buy and get Netflix because the password stuff? Oh, really? For sharing? Yeah, Speaker 2 barely use Netflix. I want to cancel it Bri watch this a lot anyways, so he called me. Unknown Speaker Oh, that's so weird. Speaker 1 You should just do what's good for you. That's what I've learned. And you should just cancel it. And then when she brings it up, she'll be like, I was watching them, but I don't use it. Speaker 2 I've never I don't even know what it's like when I've never my wife Speaker 1 used all of our high V fuel saver points to fill up her car. Because she was like, Oh, my car gets worse gas mileage. And I was like, but I bought the groceries. Those are my points to see. That's the thing. It's our now that's what she said. And I said, well, our implies that I would also use them Speaker 2 as friends at the Pentagon. And he's like, Hey, my dad said that we could have a sleepover. Oh, wait, he's it actually, my boss said we could look at alien pictures of you want to come to my office this afternoon? Or come over and look at aliens. And so they started looking into aliens sure, in their free time on like their lunch break. Yeah. And because they're in counter-intelligence, they do have access to stuff that the average person doesn't have access to and they see stuff the average person doesn't see. And but it's not an official program. And it has zero funding. And they're, it's arguable that they probably shouldn't be spending their time on the clock doing like, it's, it's the sort of thing where it's like, if you got, I don't really care, like if you got time, whatever, who cares. But you shouldn't be spending his working hours doing this. He does that for a few years, and then quits the Pentagon to join to the stars and talks about all this stuff that he's seen. So this web, this storyline is built on the back of a guy who's claiming to be a part of this organization that he's barely a part of. Okay, I mean, he's a part of the Pentagon. He wasn't involved in the Asheville offset, where the eight tip name came from, he just adopted that name for his little club, his little after club. He was barely involved in the original asset program. There's one reference of him in the book, which is him like telling a story of like war stories. I had like dinner at the ranch. Okay, invited him over and they're like, you know, stuff and then it ends. And he was like, do I do I know stuff? So he came in told stories about that and his psychic abilities and stuff like that. So that's the only reference of him in the book. What okay, they go they leak this this thing. And he joins to the stars he becomes whatever he like people Unknown Speaker like that in the Pentagon though. He's a guy have psychic abilities. I'm a psychic. In that one, he was like, Dude, that feels like one of those questions. It should be in the interview. You know? Hey, question. Two questions. Unknown Speaker Do you think you're a psychic? Speaker 1 We're watching Big Brother right now. No, I'm a psych and there's a contestant who got removed from Big Brother for doing the one thing that you can't like that you absolutely cannot do on TV. Unknown Speaker Yeah. Well in general. Speaker 1 Oh yeah. But like dumb, yeah, yeah. And he works at the Pentagon now. He left Big Brother and they were like, we want that guy. But that's what I'm saying like the worst of the works at the Pentagon. And he's like, yeah, one I believe in aliens pretty fiercely. Yeah. And to almost like, and you're like, yay. The second part like, I would believe in aliens. If it wasn't for how crazy the people who believe in aliens are. Unknown Speaker Yeah, yeah, that's fair. That's fair. Speaker 1 If there was one person who I respected who believed in Aliens, I might consider it Speaker 1 So Connor, he's sort of like slow pan in on his face when I say that as good. I like that. Speaker 2 So in the all the stuff comes out, which goes on to tell the story of his involvement with a tip. And James Caskey. German McCaskey is like, Excuse me? No, you're not. And so he calls calm, tell her and George Knapp who wrote that first book, and they were like, Let's run a book. Unknown Speaker Okay, he's retired and not put him in. Speaker 2 And so they wrote a book to set the record straight, basically, to be like, everything he's talking about is not what we were doing. He had his own little club, we had an actual government program. And here's what we did. And it was him throwing shade at Louisa was unsure, like what he's claiming is not sure, maybe he'd looked at some pictures. In this free time. We studied stuff, the government pulled our funding because they didn't think it was worth taxpayer dollars. But we did some real stuff. Okay, so I put this book out. And they The New York Times, the author of The New York Times article, she sees this, this book, she reads the book, she saw the articles and they she gets access to that initial leak video, that video. And when she gets that video, she is like a big UFO person, like a real big fan of the whole UFO story. And she recognizes that the whole Skinwalker Ranch storyline does not help what she wants to do. She wants the public and particularly the government to start taking UFO seriously. And so she says we need to trim all the Skinwalker Ranch stuff out of the story. We need this to just be this UFO video. Because otherwise, that does not accomplish our goal. Speaker 1 So she's trying to appeal to me. She is she's like all this stuff is what makes us look wacky, like, Speaker 2 wacky? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And so. And there's, I guess, two sides of this argument. Like, if your goal is to do that, then she made a good decision. But she's a journalist. And so she should be telling the story, how it is, and not leaving stuff out of the story. Because the real the reality of that story, there was an interesting UFO video that we can't explain. But also the Unknown Speaker company that just be the story. Speaker 2 But there's a very important part of the story where, where the government spent $22 million investigating werewolves on the some ranch in Utah. And but those are Unknown Speaker separate stories. I Speaker 2 think they're overlap. There's Yeah, but just because they overlap doesn't mean you can't just tell one of them. Ah, I mean, I, I see what I see what you mean. And I would agree, I would agree. But I think understanding that all of this started, because there was a billionaire who bought or a millionaire, not a billionaire. A millionaire who bought some land and was like, oh, it's spooky. And convinced a guy that he's got on a string for his campaign budget to invest a bunch of money into it, which that's a story. Yeah. And out of this program, came this video of like, oh, this is the UFO story, then that goes into the public eye. And that's a separate story that leads the Pentagon to spend a lot more money investigating this UFO stuff. When it came from something sketchy to begin with. i It's they are isolated swords, and they can stand alone. But I think it's important to understand where this part of the story came from. Okay, because otherwise we wouldn't have this part of the story. And because there's something really sketchy and weird that happened here. And so Leslie Kane, that's this. That's the girl who wrote the article. Yeah, she kind of massaged it. To keep the part she wanted the public to hear in the story and silenced the Skinwalker Ranch storyline. The reality of it is is Louise Elizondo, the guy who's kind of the the linchpin of the authority, and the storyline wasn't connected to the real a tip program. The related program was Ghost Hunters international, national Okay, got Unknown Speaker stutters Unknown Speaker international national Speaker 2 all that to say, you should still believe in aliens. Unknown Speaker This is where you're trying to land. Unknown Speaker What I'm trying to say is Speaker 1 are you trying to say anything? You're just so passionate about how she had to tell them what I'm what I'm trying to say. Oops Unknown Speaker I'm just as scared. Unknown Speaker This group of people Speaker 2 with the exception of maybe Christopher Mellon, who's the guy who's standing at the podium right now, Unknown Speaker based on the beast, questionable, alien, dude, Unknown Speaker I don't know. I love Tom DeLonge is Unknown Speaker one of my favorite musicians but not credible. Unknown Speaker I don't know. Yeah, I don't know if we should trust what they're saying. Speaker 1 Oh, it's interesting. What do you what do you what do you do a whole episode? Just to be like you were right here. Speaker 2 I'm not saying you're saying. It feels like I'm not saying you're right. Because we never covered this story. Okay. Speaker 1 Well, we should have it was part of it. Well, we didn't know we didn't know. The work that Steven Greenstreet Speaker 2 to connect the dots. The the tic tac video and the stuff that came from those videos is probably pretty legitimate. Showing the work that's being done with it now is probably pretty legitimate. Okay, but a lot of what's happening right now is built on a foundation of Skinwalker Ranch, and that's something that we should be like, Huh, that's weird. That's all I'm saying is the foundation of this stuff is weird. Okay, so there's a Steven Greenstreet did like a nine part series on this. It's a really interesting, it's worth watching. I'm going to show you a clip for it from that in the middle because I just need you to see it. Unknown Speaker Do you have time for this stuff? What? When do you watch these nine part series? Speaker 2 Well, it's been he's been releasing it for a year. So I've been watching them as they've been coming out. And I'm just now competing, Unknown Speaker like three years ago to the moon. Speaker 2 I remember calling you when he put out the first one. And I was like, This guy's making a pretty convincing case on all this stuff. Oh, and then I was like, as I I'll put it in an episode, and it's taken a year for him to finish the series. So it's been a year since I've told you. But it's, I don't know. The moral of the story is, it's important to look at the source of a story and say, should I trust them? And if you are looking at us and say I trust them? That's perfect. We are the most trustworthy source you could look to yeah, Speaker 1 this episode is Tim just going we did an episode on Skinwalker Ranch and honestly, we should just disregard all that. Well. We Unknown Speaker actually said it was garbage in that episode. Yeah, we Speaker 1 said it was the sky sounds that way and you're a loser. I did tell you I said it was bad because you were like Yeah, well no, I really stopped recording. He was like he was like, I believe I believe the whole story that was said that to save face, but I really believe all Walker ranch. Well, anyways, Unknown Speaker it's an interesting story. Watch Stephen green. She's reporting on it. Sure. I know beavers aren't real. No, but is it fiddler? Speaker 1 Things on last night is a production of space Tim media produced by Christian Taylor audio is edited by Alex Garnett video by Connor Betts social media is run by Caleb Walker and graphic design by Caleb Goldberg. Our hosts are Jaron Meyers and Tim stone please follow us on social media at tellen podcast that's T IO in podcast leave a review, comment, subscribe, wherever you are. Thank you for listening to things on our last night. Transcribed by

Have you ever heard of Skinwalker Ranch? It’s a place shrouded in mystery in the Uinta Basin of Utah. But what if I told you that this enigmatic location became the center of an astonishing expose, thanks to the investigative efforts of Steven Greenstreet and The New York Post? In this blog post, we will delve into the secrets of … Read More

PT Barnum – Man Behind The Spectacular Barnum & Bailey Circus


Episode Transcription

Made by robots, for robots. Only read if you're weird.

Unknown Speaker Hey man, what's up? I hate it when you interrupt me. Amen. Unknown Speaker I didn't either. I let you finish your sentence. What's up? Have you ever heard of PT Barnum? PT Barnum? Yeah? Is it PD no P T physical therapy Barnard Unknown Speaker Yes Yes Unknown Speaker Yeah Unknown Speaker have you what's what's the known for? Speaker 1 No you do for barndominiums which are homes that are made out of barns? Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah it's a pretty popular HDTV thing they like cut it into three condos inside a bar no Unknown Speaker three condos is that that lady on Netflix you know that's pretty funny. We can interrupt. Yeah, that's a good that's a good spot. We gotta wait for like a good joke to roll the end. That was a good you know what, just roll it Yeah, PT Barnum's circus guy. Unknown Speaker Yeah, he's a circus guy, buddy. Not just a circus guy. Speaker 1 That's why sack of crap. You're gonna support that old man. Take a cinderblock. Go set it out. Let it sit there for a little while. We agree. I was just saying that for political points. Things I Learned last night Unknown Speaker okay, so PT Barnum. Yeah. Unknown Speaker You know who that is, though. Unknown Speaker I do know who it is. I Unknown Speaker figured you did. Speaker 1 Yeah. Do you know before I was a comedian, I wanted to be a circus clown. Did you really did you go to school as a ministry Unknown Speaker Jesus came for your Unknown Speaker okay Unknown Speaker clown nose, that's a clown Speaker 1 I knew exactly what you're talking about. Is that what Speaker 3 is that where the clown nose is? The clown telling the joke? No. But you're saying that as the cloud? Yeah, well, sometimes it's like an interactive bit where they bring the person up on stage. They stick to your nose. Yeah, it's the everybody it's like it's like when you go to do CTOs with it? Everybody gets the wristbands that light up when you go see a clown. Everybody can Speaker 1 see Taylor Swift and the word honks her nose at the end of the show. Very not sanitary. Jesus wants your honk is a quote that will live on the discord forever. I think unfortunately. Yeah, PT Barnum's circus guy. Yeah, he's Speaker 3 a circus guy by not just a circus guy. Unknown Speaker Put that okay. Unknown Speaker Well, we're off to a good start. Alright, here's a here's the PT Barnum. Here's what he looks like. Oh, Unknown Speaker which if you saw this, you saw Speaker 1 if you saw the greatest showman. Yeah. Hugh Jackman should not have been cast to play this guy. This guy looks like the Phantom of the Opera without the mask on you know, I'm saying like, this guy. Yeah. John C. Reilly would have been a great pick that's actually play pts. Very Speaker 2 accurate. Very, very accurate. It's interesting, because I don't know if it's this era of humanity, or if it's if it's this guy, specifically, but he looks like like the last thing I would expect is that he travels around with a giant tent and a bunch of elephants and people who dance real good Speaker 1 that's the job description. I mean, full picture of James Buchanan because maybe I'm just getting maybe maybe my brains not working correct though. Speaker 2 You know I'm gonna be honest with you. I don't I don't remember off the top of my head what Buchanan looks like but this picture Speaker 1 feels pretty Buchanan honey. Does it look similar at all? Or mine's Unknown Speaker pretty similar Speaker 2 causes here there's a lot of pictures with James Buchanan who after he should have Unknown Speaker quit taking pictures. There's pictures of this guy after he should have stopped. There's Speaker 2 a lot of other words, here's like this. And it's like he was outside in the wind. And then he went and took a photograph. Speaker 1 Very disheveled in his like presidential portraits. Yeah, Speaker 2 I think so. He was one where he combed his hair. This is Buchanan with Cohen. Okay, I Unknown Speaker wasn't crazy. was pretty Barnum ready at the same time era. Unknown Speaker Cannon was Speaker 1 I don't know why but like they both could be played by John C. Reilly is maybe why I'm thinking that Speaker 2 Buchanan died in 1868 was President 1857 to 1861. So yeah, same timeframe. Speaker 1 Hey, maybe that's what it was the that was the style. They're gonna think that whenever they see like these guys with the shaved like my barber does the shaved thing in the head right there. You're Speaker 2 gonna see it right. I got looks like Donald Trump. Pull that picture. Unknown Speaker The meanest thing you've ever said anything like that at all? Speaker 3 There haven't been a lot of I can't think of a single president who's had cool hair Unknown Speaker what? Leave up JFK. Yeah, I guess the tape is pretty cool. Speaker 1 Did Clinton had good hair when he was in office? Right. Obama started with good hair. Do you see how fast he grade while he was in office? Speaker 2 Yeah, but honestly, Oh, well. I will say Obama had Obama has gray hair and even gray gray. He grave made him look dignified. I think some people gray makes him look Rama looks Unknown Speaker better old than he did when he was younger. Yeah, Speaker 2 I think some people gray makes you look better. Some people great makes you look worse. I think Obama looked better. Looks better was gray. Speaker 1 Yeah, I mean, gosh, yeah, I guess should we Unknown Speaker dye hair gray? Speaker 1 Should we just do do powerful men have bad haircuts? Should we did that Speaker 2 seem like have you seen all of the Oakland Raiders staff? Yeah, Unknown Speaker the Oakland Raiders owner? Owner. Yeah, he's Speaker 2 not their owner there. I don't know. I think he's still there. Their owner, their coach, and who was it? There was someone on their team. They've all got Speaker 1 the same barber and there is themselves horrible. They were horrible haircuts. Their barbers blind. Okay, we've Speaker 2 got so much PT Barnum, not Barber. Okay, we got a lot of sorry, he has a long life. He was born in Bridgeport, Connecticut. And his dad was an innkeeper and a tailor and a storekeeper. And, you know, like one of those guys who was like, did a bunch for newer, but like, successful, you know, like a serial entrepreneur. Yeah. Like, like, like, he would have had a YouTube channel talking about how to be successful. Speaker 1 I do worry that like, when I'm old. I have, you know, what if comedy dies in the next couple of years, and then it'd be like, yeah, he was a comedian in his like, 20s. And then he worked at a used car lot for his 30s Speaker 2 It's like, it's like, Have you heard that? I don't know why you would hear this. I'd be surprised if you have actually, Unknown Speaker can you stop because we have a lot to get to. Speaker 2 Okay, I heard Wi Fi you don't hear it. Okay. No, I haven't heard it. It's it's a song from Hold on. Let me I have to. Casting I'm not loving the Spotify. I can't remember who sings it. So just forget about this. Okay. Speaker 3 So he but here's the thing his grandfather was a Unknown Speaker teepee. Barnum. The Papa. Yeah, Unknown Speaker what speed do you stand for that? Unknown Speaker Pretty taut. Pretty, Tom, I think we'll call him Fred, pretty boy. Okay, Unknown Speaker so P D stands for Phineas Taylor. Speaker 1 Cool. Phineas is a name that should make a comeback. His grandfather, Speaker 2 also Phineas Taylor. Sure. His grandpa. His grandfather had like a lot of really, really strong influence on him. His grandfather did a couple of things that were like noble, but he also was a lottery schemer as I mean, it means he like schemed a lottery. What does that mean? Speaker 1 A lottery schemer. Okay, what does that he's scheme, the lottery. Okay, how, but he had a lottery. I don't play the lottery. I don't know Speaker 2 exactly how he was scheming the lottery, but I'm assuming it was something like those. We covered a couple of lottery winners on our show. Yeah, did kind of different things. So I'm assuming it's something like that. And he had a lot of influence on young PT Barnum. Okay. And so when PT was on the ways of scamming, yeah, I guess when PT was 18 Danger 16 He, his father died. And he had to become the breadwinner for the family. So he started working at a grocery store. And while he was working at this grocery store, he realized I'm seeing a lot of people every day because they're here buying their groceries. And so he says, I know what I'll do. I'll start my own lottery. ends. Unknown Speaker Okay, okay, so he do that. Unknown Speaker I mean, you can do whatever you want. Speaker 1 For free country. I don't know if it's like, and I hope it stays that way. You know, who else believes that all of our new fans? Speaker 2 I mean, this is like 1825 or something like that, or whatever you want. And so back then, like, it's like, yeah, maybe you weren't supposed to do it. But like you, no one's gonna go get a license to start a lottery, you know, especially in Bridgeport, Connecticut, a lottery license? Yeah, no, no one's thinking Speaker 4 about 60. Cardozo. How does he Unknown Speaker so here's what he does water, he, Speaker 2 he sells lottery tickets, okay. And he's holding, like, drawings for them weekly. And he tells he guarantees a prize for everyone, for everyone who enters a lottery. And so he said, I basically he's like, he's like the grand prize winner. I'll give them like a fraction of my earnings from that lottery current same way most lotteries work. But then he was like, but everybody else, the grocery store I work at has a bunch of empty bottles, and they told me I can have them. And so he gets Speaker 3 to anyone else. Okay, no reason. And everyone was like, thanks. I want a major or Speaker 1 it's good to still hang on someone's mantled. That's my great granddad's bottle, Speaker 3 he wanted in peace for blobby Tom, pretty boy, Speaker 2 gave that to him in a lottery. So we're winners, our family, we changed our last name the winner after that. Speaker 1 Okay. Turns out our daughter was like some kind of spy or something like that really rough. Unknown Speaker So he did this for a few years. And did you get that job? Speaker 2 No, I didn't think so. Are you going to explain it? Okay, cool. So he, he just, he saved up money from this lottery, and then moved to New York and bought himself his own grocery store. So I was able to successfully run this lottery for a few years. Wow. And we should be clear, this is the 1820s. So you could buy grocery stores for like, 40 bucks back then. Like it wasn't this? Yeah, it's not the same thing. But it's still impressive. And so he's managing his grocery store. And you know, it's, he's, he's having like, a, like a career, I guess out of this, but he's not enjoying it. He's in 1835 rolls around. He's 25 years old. He's been doing it for a few years, running the grocery store. And he's, he's successful, but not like, success. Yeah, you know, and like, like, he's like, he's like, I want spend more. But he's like, but I there's one big problem with getting more and has work. And he hates working. And he's like, I don't want to have to work. He's like, I'd rather be able to be in a spot where I don't work. And I'm super rich. And so he started, started looking for the next big thing. Unknown Speaker I've got some great products available. And I think you'd like creams, and assorted. Speaker 2 And so this is this is 1830s. So he learns about an acquaintance he like a childhood friend he has he lives in Philadelphia. And this is the 1830s. And so his friend had a slave. Her name was Joyce Heath. And his friend claimed that she was the nurse, like the nurse of George Washington when George Washington was an infant. Okay. Which I saw the look on your face. The numbers don't add up. She will be 161 years old. Yeah, if that was true. But PT Barnum was like, You know what? The lottery was pretty easy. And he's like, I think I could pull this off. And so he goes out to Philadelphia and technically one off Unknown Speaker that's a good question. So it goes into Philadelphia. So Unknown Speaker you think I'm like, I'm gonna sell tickets to see this lady? Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, pretty much. And so he wants he goes out to Philadelphia and Speaker 1 some meet and greet with George Washington's, like childhood nurse. Yeah. Shoot, dude. I hope I'm never that famous. That someone will be like this was a babysitter when he was like three. That'd be $20 A meter. Hey, you Unknown Speaker want to meet her? But like, Unknown Speaker I don't know. I guess it's the 1830s Well, Unknown Speaker it's weird though it feels weird. I can speak from experience Speaker 3 a lot of weird experience. Can you speak from when we toured Alcatraz at the end of Alcatraz, the last surviving inmate? Oh, he's just at the end of the tour. And like, he's like the door greeter? Well, no, he was sitting at a table in the gift shop. He's like, he's like I said 30 years ago, and they still have me here. They Speaker 1 won't let me get out of here. We taking a picture? No. I told him to quit taking pictures of me long ago. I don't want pictures of me having anymore. I shouldn't. Nobody should after a certain point. Speaker 3 It was he was there. I think on his own volition. He wrote a book about his experience. He was doing book signings in the gift shop. But it felt weird. And everybody else there felt weird about it to Speaker 1 buy his book. No, that's why Sacher crap. You're gonna support that old man. But his wife was ruined by the archaic prison system that existed Unknown Speaker by San Francisco. Some people were going in there taking pictures with it. Unknown Speaker I'm glad you had a good vacation. Everybody Unknown Speaker else walked by and was like, Unknown Speaker could you ask for a refund afterward? Unknown Speaker Yeah, we did. We were like, hey, it was really Unknown Speaker weird that I didn't really get a refund. Unknown Speaker Really drug magic training. You're Unknown Speaker doing the magic tricks very well. I hated it. Unknown Speaker So do you know what this this is a prison. Speaker 1 I'm sure that guy he's cool in 2006. But his time has done. Unknown Speaker best show in San Francisco. I don't know, man. Speaker 2 So he, he had 500 bucks to his name. So I took out a loan for $500 to make it 1000 And then made an offer to lease. Joyce from her owner, which was weird, because that was technically still illegal. Like, even at this time, slavery was illegal in the north, because he was they were in northern states. And so that shouldn't have been legal to happen. But he exploited the North. Yes. Yeah. It was because he was technically leasing her. Yeah. So it wasn't technically it wasn't laboring, yeah. Okay. And so he took her on tour. So people could meet George Washington, lady, and made, Speaker 1 that's what I'm saying. Like, what are you putting up? Like, if it's just said hi, V. I mean, like this guy nursed or this guy, maybe progressive, you know, yeah. This gal nursed Ronald Reagan when he was a baby, you know? Yeah. And she's at HyVee this weekend. You're like, okay, Speaker 2 yeah, they that's exactly what happened. He's gonna meet and Unknown Speaker greet. He really was. Speaker 2 It was like, it was like, 20 cents to meet her. And she old. Yeah, she was old. She was so she was about 80. Something of this not 161. Unknown Speaker Right. She would have needed to be. Speaker 2 But they the one thing I respect about PT Barnum, there's a lot that you probably shouldn't respect about him until he gets old when he got old, then there's some things you can't respect about him, because he'd learned some stuff. But at this point, he's like, there's not a lot you can respect about him. But one thing you can is he always made posters for his events that were I think ahead of its time. This was his poster for this. Hello, baby. George Washington Speaker 1 was full. So just so everyone knows. It's, you know, obviously, the older woman holding a knot baby. It is a just a small George Washington watching pretty funny. Inside this is aged 161 years. Unknown Speaker Yeah, George Washington isn't even around anymore at the time of this. Yeah, Unknown Speaker they're saying, Speaker 1 Look, though, that's honestly that is ahead of its time, because that's like, full grown. George Washington just shrunk down and put in her lap. Yeah, that's Unknown Speaker some photoshop. already funny. It is pretty funny. Unknown Speaker And so they took her around till on tour, and they Speaker 1 said she was 161. And it was a lie. Speaker 2 I'm pretty sure. Yeah, his friend told him she's 161 years old. Yeah. But Speaker 1 that's like what he Yeah, he's like, sure, sure. Sure. Sure. Unknown Speaker So they took her on tour. And this was a huge Speaker 1 hit. At that time. What people's belief stuff, man. It's true. And no one had invented lying yet. And so people were like, this is this is just true. Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, that's accurate. And so he made a killing off of this. There's no way to prove anything yet. Every time he would go into 20 cents this year. People were like, oh, I want to see George Washington's nurse. And so people were coming from all over the place to see this. Experience it, but only lasted a year because she passed away year after Unknown Speaker 162. Speaker 3 And he had developed a little bit of a taste of reputation. It because some people were like, There's no way. There's no way that's actually yeah. Washington's that Speaker 1 ends up helping him. Yeah. And marketing standpoint, that's what you want. Yeah. Speaker 2 And because of that, he he capitalized on that as well. And so after she died, he hosted a live autopsy to prove her age. And so at a saloon in New York City, which is saloon of all places, like the doors and everything. Yeah, that sounds like that cannot be up to health. But they hosted a live autopsy, he sold seats and people came in, they watched it. And they verified she was 82 years old at the time of her death. And everyone was like, ah, wasn't real, but it was cool. Well, acid like Unknown Speaker how were they age verifying at that point? Unknown Speaker I don't know. I think teeth. Unknown Speaker Okay, yeah. Speaker 2 Everyone's teeth has numbers on them. Like, the back of your teeth has a number for your age. Yeah. Can you feel that? Yeah, it changes every year. Like your birthday? It's Unknown Speaker 31. But um, you don't know how horny nine? Unknown Speaker Ah, you didn't call your mom. Unknown Speaker I didn't call her mom right now. You call her Unknown Speaker I'm two years old. Unknown Speaker This changes so much. Changes everything I know about myself. Oh, man. Hey, thanks for checking Speaker 4 out this episode. If you like this, and you want more of our show, we've got plenty of other episodes. One of my favorites is action Park, a super sketchy theme park that was basically overrun by teenagers. And they just made the rules. It was in New Jersey. It was a wild story. But we did a whole episode about it. And I think you'd like it. So when you're done with this one, go check out that episode. But for now, back to this one. Unknown Speaker So they barely Yes, she's 82 Yeah, she was 82. Unknown Speaker And so he was like, Wow, this he's like, Unknown Speaker Oh, Unknown Speaker I too, got bamboozled. Unknown Speaker I was tricked by that guy in Philadelphia. Unknown Speaker That you all know is real. Speaker 2 Is none of that. So so yeah. So she she passes away. And he was like, Man, that worked out great. And there was a lot of money and to even just speculation. And so he started looking for other people that were unique that he could exploit. Speaker 1 Oh, yeah, they're old people. Just looking for the Speaker 2 other Oliver's to take somewhere. And so he he started finding you'll never run out of them. Your typical like, cars, like Sideshow stuff, like so like people with extra limbs or bearded ladies and but none of this stuff was as much of a hit as George Washington's nurse. And so like he kind of he kind of struck it big on his first one. Okay, everything after that was like just kind of they're like, yeah, we've seen the bearded lady. Yeah. And so, but he he spent a few years saving up his money. And he bought scoters American museum in 1841. Okay, it was like, like a Ripley's Believe It or Not using a wax place or what? No more like a Ripley's Believe it or not, because they just would have like weird exhibits of like, here's an example. One of the things that they had in there from the very beginning was what's known as I think, yeah, the Fiji Mermaid, which this is allegedly allegedly proof of mermaids that exists, they found this a Fiji and it was this, so I don't like it. If you're listening. It's it was a Speaker 1 half fish and then not even want to call it a person at the top. But kind of Speaker 2 Yeah, so this is a recreation of it. We don't have the original, but it was because what we did was he took a skeleton of a monkey and cut it off at the torso and then glued it to around and like glued it to the back of the monkey. And then was like, look, it's a mermaid. It's a real mermaid. And people were like, Oh my gosh, they found a mermaid in Fiji. Speaker 1 And that's what it would look like. Is I mean all these fairy tales of sailors falling in love with that. Unknown Speaker Yeah, yeah, that's Yeah, exactly. Unknown Speaker It's worth it if you're an audio listener to just Speaker 2 it's terrifying google it is terrifying. So yes, stuff like this, like crazy automated. Yeah, yeah. He's making crazy oddities and saying all this. I found a mermaid Yep. So he redesigns this museum. Oh wow. Barnum's American museum is it's big. What does that force five stories? Yeah. And had just all these exhibits of interesting things all throughout. And it was literally that it was like you walk in you look at something that was kind of interesting or a person who was who had an extra limb or a bearded lady stuff like that. That Speaker 1 is the the last surviving person from Alcatraz. It's the baby that he's holding. Unknown Speaker And everyone's like, what's Alcatraz? Well, you'll Unknown Speaker probably die. But we'll find out. Unknown Speaker We'll find out when you're older. Unknown Speaker He's older. Speaker 2 And this this museum he was he was tricky with this stuff. And so he was, is I guess, it was like a quarter of there's not a real murmee Certain Well, no, no, no, even better. So it was like 25 cents, I shouldn't say even better, even worse. So it was like 25 cents to enter, right? And then you can turn around and see the whole thing. But at the end of every, not every exhibit, but at the end of some of the major exhibits, he would put up all the signs that say this way to egress. But at and I guess apparently still now, people didn't know what egress means. What's your exit? And so people would be like, oh, I want to go see the egress. And then they go out and then they'd be outside and they there's no reentry. So they had to get another ticket to go in. So he was just tricking people to buy a second ticket. Unknown Speaker Dang it. Oh, I put it down. Unknown Speaker That wouldn't fly. Now. This is who PT Barnum was, Unknown Speaker I'd burn it to the ground dude. Unknown Speaker But again, still great posters. Unknown Speaker There's a side to the egress. Unknown Speaker Yeah, cuz he was like, Haha, we got to. Okay, so. Okay, Speaker 3 sure. So just a bunch of interesting stats. Someone with a lot of tattoos they hippopotamus. Siamese? Chicken, Chicken Chicken. Yeah. Bearded Lady. There's a brick. Unknown Speaker Is that a bearded lady though? White? Speaker 3 Yeah, I think that's a bearded lady. looking thing, I think. And then just an average baby. Speaker 1 No, he has a huge baby. That's the point that baby that baby's not average, that is actual size. That's a large baby. Speaker 2 And then there's a brick in this, because here's what he did, he would do this every day he would get into, he would walk into the museum. Speaker 1 One break from the building, because this can't last forever, guys. And like he would just you know, he's like, we're here until the building falls down. A different brick from a different area is like, eventually it'll Speaker 3 fall. Well, what he would do is he would take these bricks, man. And he would Speaker 2 he would walk in, and he would grab a brick and he will walk back out with a brick. And like just set it on the street. And then turn around, walk back in and then walk back out and grab the brick and walk back inside. And people on the like morning commutes would walk by and they'd be like, what do you do with these bricks, man? And he's like, why don't you come inside and see. And it meant nothing. It was just something just odd enough where people would be like, What are you doing? I go try to check that out on one of these days. And I'm gonna do that Speaker 1 when we open our mobile bar. What do you do it just like just go take a cinder block. Go set it out. Let it sit there for a little while. And come back out. Pick it up. Yeah, yeah. What are you doing? Have you ever heard of Oregon? Speaker 3 Just doing weird things. Once you come check it out. And so like his it slowly grows in popularity. Just Speaker 2 it's so, but nothing was like hugely successful yet. Like he was he was doing well. He was doing well. Okay, but it still wasn't like I don't have to work anymore. Well, you know, he was shooting for and then he met Tom Thumb. His name wasn't Tom Dunn. That was the name he changed him to. His name was Charles PT Barnum changed it. Yeah. It was Charles Stratton. Unknown Speaker He's like, I'm gonna call you. Tom. Is there a reason? Yeah. I think you know, Speaker 2 his name was Charles Charles Trenton. And he was his parents. Were actually friends of PT Barnum. Unknown Speaker Okay. It's parents like, hey, our kids weird. Speaker 2 They're like, we don't think he's ever gonna be able to make a living on his own. Why? Why he was a dwarf. And at that day and age, I mean, that's a pretty logical conclusion that he's never gonna be able to make much money on his own. And so at four years old PT Barnum says, Okay, I'll pay him or I guess I'll pay you as the parents. $70 a week. Unknown Speaker I'll lease your child Speaker 2 pretty much $70 a week to be in my A big money. Yeah, good money. And so they were like, yeah, like done deal. And so he legally changed his age to 11 years old and legally changed his name to Tom Thumb. Cuz for some, I think he thought that would sell better, which I think it does. I think it is better than Charles Stratton. Okay, and then calls him a general and says, Come see General Tom Thumb at 11 years old and 11 years old, but He's four years old. But he says he's 11 years old. Unknown Speaker Is there a picture of Tom Tom? Yeah. Here's Unknown Speaker a picture of PT Barnum and Tom Thumb standing together. They ended up becoming best friends that are lifelong friends after this. Speaker 1 That makes sense. But like, but like, why 11 If you're going to change the age, just shoot big, you know, go for 160. You know? Speaker 2 Yeah, I don't know why the age 11 was chosen. I think maybe it's because he was still like, he still kind of behaved like a child. So they were like, well, we got it. We can't act like he's an adult. Unknown Speaker But he's a Gen Y. That's why I say like, Gen. He's 11. Unknown Speaker He's an 11 year old come meet the 11 year old General. Unknown Speaker That's what I that's what I'm saying. Speaker 3 It's like, okay, that's the idea is meet the 11 year old general. And then that's what was interesting about him. Sure. And they taught him to say like, general stuff. And so he would walk into a room and he'd be like, hello, troops. I don't know, whatever generals do. Yeah. Speaker 2 And then they taught him to sing and that crushed. And so like, it was like, it was like, it had developed an audience Speaker 1 for like, oh my gosh, he's a he's a war general. And then he goes and they're like, he's singing. Take two quarters. Speaker 3 How many quarters Do you want? Take me to the egress. I can give you more. Unknown Speaker Yeah, he goes, follow me. He's gonna be running around. He's a child. You know, saying? Speaker 2 Yeah, so Tom Thumb makes him a fortune. People. The word spreads of the singing 11 year old general. And people start traveling to New York just to see Tom Thumb. Okay. And so they become a lifelong best friend. They become lifelong best friends. Wow. Him and Tom Thumb. And he takes tom tom on tour a couple times. But more than anything, Tom Thumb is performing at the American Museum for life and making pretty good money doing it. Speaker 1 Yeah. Did PT have a like, I believe against looking at the camera. Unknown Speaker No, I think he did it here. Okay, well, that's also Unknown Speaker why he didn't do it. Creepy, man. Unknown Speaker Yeah, yeah. After that last picture. Everyone was like, Hey, where's Unknown Speaker my eyes? I gotta bounce my eyes. Yeah. So Speaker 2 I love I love TomTom. And so TomTom makes him a fortune. And it really puts the museum on the map. Sure museum was opened for decades. It is a brick thing anymore. People are coming on their own. And it gets to the point where the museum is now bringing in 400,000 visitors per year. By 1846. It gets the point where the museum earns him $80 million. It translated to today's money, I should say. He makes a ton of cash off this museum. And TomTom really kind of put him on the map and meant this out. Okay. And so he goes on a little bit of a spending spree, finding more oddities and kind of compiling stuff to have in in his museum and then says I'm going to open up a new house from a Speaker 1 new house. I'm going to open up a new house for me usually to build yourself a home like a business plan like a business like for me, I like a house for me and then I like that same house build smaller for Tom Thumb. Give it to him for his at Speaker 3 the garage, his 18th birthday. So Unknown Speaker next year. Well, we could change that. Not really. Got more time. Speaker 3 He's got it. Yeah. At least not on us seven years. It's a lot like Tim's anniversary. Unknown Speaker In that in that on papers, two of them yes. So that's okay. The government doesn't listen to this Speaker 2 so he builds this new house and his II wants this house to be a thing though, where it's he has his home But he also hosts major events here. And so he puts in a theater and he builds like a big ballroom because he's like, I want the best music artists in the world to come do their. Their performances here in my home music here. Yeah. And so he opens up a home and he names it. I ran us down. And this is it. Holy cow builds this in Connecticut. In 1948 is when he built it. No, 1848 Sorry. 1848 That's what I meant. Unknown Speaker Otherwise, he'd be 161 years old. Speaker 2 If you're listening, it's a giant house and it's it's in your classic like, India, like temples style. So they've got like a big dome. Like bulbous rooftops with the spires. Stories. Yeah, depending on who you are. If you hugely been tortilleria. You would think this was here. 700 years ago standing is it? No. Speaker 1 Okay, I guess you'll tell us why. So yeah, Giants. This is this Outback also his Speaker 2 whole properties his there's lots of sub building all buildings. Yeah, that's Unknown Speaker Tom those houses. Okay. Speaker 2 And a fountain out front? Yeah. So I mean, just an absolutely obnoxiously gigantic mansion. Even for today's standards. If you saw this in 1848. It will blow your mind at how big this guy's house is. If you saw this in 2023, it will blow your mind at how big this guy Yeah, it's huge. It's a palace by every like, yes, measure. So a couple of years after he built this house, he finds out about a Swedish singer named Jenny Lind, who was huge in Europe. And he thought he could benefit off of her success. And so he calls up her crew, and is like, hey, why don't you guys come on over to the states all tore manage for you guys. And we'll we'll let you build an audience out here. And so Speaker 1 what would an audience translate if you came over from Europe, like would people show up? Typically, Speaker 2 no. But PT Barnum be one of the things that PT Barnum got really, really good at publicity. And yeah, he got really good at marketing stuff. And so he was confident he could build an audience for her before she even got to the states. Okay, so he went to her and he offered 150 Night tour to pay her $1,000 A night. And that is money. So translate it today is $40,000 a night for 150 Night tour. So she was like, Hey, that sounds great. Can you pay me up front? And he was like, Unknown Speaker No. He was like, Yeah, Speaker 2 I think we can do that. So he went and he took out a loan against his museum. He took out a loan against his house, and he's still stupid. And he took he put his entire savings so dumb, and he was still came up $6,000 short of what he offered her. And so he went and he was asking him for money. He found Unknown Speaker no, that's so dumb. Speaker 2 And so he found a point you Speaker 1 just like a musician enough that you're like, we're gonna do it. I'm gonna force it to happen. Speaker 2 He found a pastor in Philadelphia to give him six grand and he needs six grand. And so he told us pastor, Unknown Speaker pastors were rolling. Speaker 2 He found a pastor Philadelphia, and he said, Hey, Jenny Lynn, one of the things she was famous for in Europe was her morality, and her philanthropy. And so he said, I think if we have a star in the United States that's famous for the things she's famous for, we could really see a change in the morality of our nation, and convinced this pastor and the pastor put up $6,000 towards it, and was able to pay her upfront and she put the majority of it straight into her charities, and then sailed to the US. And he started marketing it and he really played up the morality played up the philanthropy stuff and the marketing. And when she arrived, she had no audience in the States before this deal started. When she arrived at Port, there's 40,000 people waiting for her to sail in. And they worked. Yeah. And so she goes to stay at the hotel that night. There's 20,000 people the hotel and they sold out of her merchandise, which is interesting to me. I'm curious Speaker 3 what her merchandise was. Yeah, like, T shirts, like just there's no way they had T shirts like, Unknown Speaker No, I had a blouse, a little fluffy blouse. And Unknown Speaker a fluffy bass. They sewed some suspenders and Unknown Speaker say J lens pulls my pants up. I Speaker 3 don't know what it is. She's so more moral. That she it says morals. The morals tore the mortals toward morals toward morals tore. So Unknown Speaker that night PT was like, oh yeah, this is gonna Speaker 1 work and then she actually crosses in front of somebody. And they're like She's not who they said they were. What a hypocrite. Speaker 2 And then all of the all of the fans daughters, they started putting black eyeliner on their eyes and go into her shows. And we're like, I love Jenny. Unknown Speaker They're like this is the reversible Speaker 2 Jenny's ruining our nation. No. So she plays at the castle garden Theater in New York, the first like, I guess there's a second night in the States. But our first night of the tour, sells it out. 5000 seat theater, huge theater for the day. sells it out. And this single event, because PT Barnum reiterated the PT Barnum decided instead of selling tickets, he was going to auction them because it was so it was already so popular as this single event paid off the Old Testament. Wow. So and then they went and did well, not 150 Nights, they did 93. Halfway through the tour, she dies. Halfway through the tour, she starts realizing, you see Barnum is making an insane amount of money off of this tour. And she's feels dirty about the fact that she's that he's marketing it off of her morality and her philanthropy. And so he says, if you're gonna make this much money off of stuff, he said, You have to give it away, I have to make more off of this is what she said. And so they negotiate a new deal where he would make a $5,500 management fee for each night of the event. And she would make the rest of the profits. And so So she Speaker 1 starts making a killing. Yeah. And so by the end of this, he was like, I don't want to do this anymore. This sucks. So Speaker 2 after 93 nights, the deal kind of fell apart. And they parted ways, because she was frustrated with the way he was marketing it. So they didn't do a full 150 Nights. But for 93 She walked away having earned about $350,000 in 1840 Cash whole equivalent. I've got a calculator up right now in point Unknown Speaker two or 12 million. Speaker 2 It's equivalent to Yeah, 13 point 6 million today. Yeah. And then he netted estimates range around $500,000, which was net. And so I don't know what a million. Yeah, I don't know how much he actually took home off of that. Because he's had a half. Yeah. And so the gamble worked really well for him. And so he started saying, hey, there might be something to this Tor stuff. And so he starts looking at winner do Unknown Speaker part of started with, Unknown Speaker yeah, get that remember? Unknown Speaker What if we had a morality? Speaker 1 What if we tore it is, you know, $10 entry, no tickets. Speaker 2 But they, they like auctioned all the tickets for free, free auction, free auction pre auction. So he gets into this, this concept of touring. And so he starts sending his acts is pretty crazy Speaker 1 how winter jam did that it's $10 cash at the door. They don't have to pay any processing fees on on cards or anything like that. And there's no ticket sales. So there's no other hands in the pot. It's interesting when you learn how things work, when you know how business goes and you go, Speaker 2 Oh, and you're like, yeah, and then they mark it in a certain way. And you're like, Oh, let's Unknown Speaker see what you did here. Yeah, PT Barnum. Unknown Speaker But anyways, you gotta get a winner. Unknown Speaker I do put me on there. I love it. I think you guys are geniuses. I'm so moral. Yeah, he's Speaker 3 also 3131 31 Speaker 2 You're enjoying it and you're enjoying chillin, you've been around for a little bit, I want to invite you to be a part of our Patreon. We have a Patreon that has early access to all of our episodes ad free content, both audio and video. We have a discord with our hosts and producers. That's a ton of fun getting to hang out with all of our patrons in there. We also do once a month now we do these live streams with our patrons. We hang out we get to know each other we eat pizza. It's a blast, along with a bunch of other benefits like a merch discounts message on your birthday like fun stuff. It's definitely worth it. We're having a blast with our patrons. But if that doesn't sound like something for you, like that guy here, just kidding. No, we love you. Thanks for checking out Dylan podcast. How do you how do they get it though? I realized I forgot to put a CTA in mind. Speaker 1 Oh dang we're doing Yeah, they can text Tillandsia 66866 Thanks Jared. Speaker 2 These are set at his axon tour. PT Barnum is sending his accent or making a killing his museum still open make it a killing off the museum and he's sending him out individually on tour, yeah. And he's brilliant. He's bright. He's starting to like, going out on the road, Tom thumb's on the road doing events, wow, singing or whatever. And he's working with a lot of musicians. Now Jenny got him into the music world. For us, they are there to surround trains. And so they he's, he's a huge success, right? Well, in the 80s, the early 1860s. His museum catches fire. Oh, and the newspaper puts out this article of his museum burning, which is Speaker 1 there's like a head, and oh, it's a mannequin. Speaker 2 Yeah, there's I think it's Abe Lincoln's mannequin. Losing ahead. Unknown Speaker Oh, my God. Yeah, it's Speaker 2 a terrifying image. This is an interesting time in journalism. When the cartoonists that would have typically just done no pictures for the front, they had them do everything. And they let them do it however they wanted. Why don't you draw a picture of the fire at the circus? Okay. And they were just like, cool. And they would just Yeah, make it insane. But yeah, so we know what sort of the fire No. But there was there was a major fire and it damaged it pretty bad. He was able to get an insurance payout, but it didn't even come close to covering the damages. But he was able to reopen partially and didn't didn't open. The whole museum backup reopened partially, a few years later, Unknown Speaker a lot more egress signs, Speaker 2 a lot more and eagerness signs. But a few years later, it caught fire again. And this time he couldn't recover. Yeah. And so it was a complete loss. And he shut it shut it down for good. Ironically, a couple years later, his house also burnt down. What so I don't know if this guy was literally playing with fire or if something wasn't insurance at the time. Well, there was there was insurance. But yeah, it wasn't like the sort of thing where it's like, he's not collecting industry. He's not he's not getting Yeah, I mean, he could have been insurance fraud, and honestly, but he wasn't making enough money off of it. He was making more money off his insurance as pilots burned out. That's why we don't have any pictures. That's a Speaker 1 bummer. Yeah. Because it was wild to like, still exist. Yeah. I also think there's Speaker 2 a possibility. So he, at this point in his life, he got into politics. And he was he was in the Republican, the new Republican Party was a brand new thing. And it was very different than it is today. It was actually like the inverse back then. Right. And so he was he was very progressive. Had a had a pretty instrumental part in the 13th amendment. Which is crazy, because because he started from that, yeah. And so well, what he said in his he gave a speech and in his speech, he said that he was once a while it was the word he used basically, like hard headed Democrat, who was a northerner he thought exploiting people was okay. And he said, over my career, he said, I've been privileged to work with people from all over the world from multiple different background, basically, and realize that these people are all the same. Like there's no reason why you should Jr really did change him. Yeah. And so he his life, like exposing himself to other people changed his life. And so then he was instrumental in making the 13 or passing through the 13th Amendment, but he said in his speeches, he was like he he thought he should be punished for the things that he had done in the past really, really looked like a change man after that, honestly, Speaker 1 it's almost like we agree. I was just saying that for political points. I don't think we should actually don't punish me Don't please don't I've been punished enough my business burnt down, my home burned down. Speaker 3 My business burnt down again. And so he he was also instrumental in Speaker 2 passing legislation that made gas lighting a common thing and cities streetlights were all the time man Speaker 1 in the city before nothing like that. Unknown Speaker Gaslight Wow, they're Speaker 1 like, they're like there was no Barnum's Museum. Well, yes, there was. No You're making that up. You're Speaker 3 crazy. Give it up. You're making it up. You're crazy. And he was like, I did that. He was like that. That was me. That was my work bro. More gaslighting here. But I Speaker 2 do think it's possible that because he was such a proponent of gas lighting, that that's what Burton has everything down. Oh, because that was that makes highly flammable. Speaker 1 But like running gas lines as infrastructure kind of stuff. Yeah. And then lighting Speaker 2 the city that way. Yeah. And so he was in point of all this is to say he was influential in politics as a politician. And then at the age of 63. He was like, You know what I haven't done yet. Okay, because I haven't Speaker 3 done a circus yet. said I've done all this stuff. And everybody the future knows me for the circus but I haven't done the circus yet. She's times right. Speaker 2 And so he establishes PT Barnum's grand traveling museum menagerie caravan and hippodrome wasn't great at naming stuff. Great it advertising. Yeah, good naming. I think that was normal back then. long names were long. Yeah. And so he started Speaker 1 to zipper, his name, Phineas Taylor to long pt. Speaker 2 And so he started running that in 1870. Ran for 11 years. Very successful circus in the States. 1k. one of if not the most successful circus in the United States. Meanwhile, across the pond in Europe, there's a guy by the name of James Bailey, who's running a very successful circus. And K. Borrow the UK in Unknown Speaker Butea. Speaker 3 And he learns about it from Tom Thumb. Important sidebar. Tom, Tom went over there. Yeah, important sidebar. I'm Speaker 2 getting ahead of myself a little bit. Sure. Yeah. So in the 60s, during his political career, he ended up getting into some pretty hot legal waters. And so some of the stuff that he did, made some enemies, as happens a lot with politicians, right. And he, he got a little a little too passionate, I think about these enemies. And so he started coming after them a little bit too hard. And so he got sued for libel multiple times, oh, and nearly bankrupt, got bankrupt from the litigations that he found himself in. Because his museum wasn't open anymore. He lost his house. We had a lot of a lot of his assets were literally burnt out, right. And then, and then he was kind of being a little too risky with the slander. He was thrown at some people, and it costs him. And so he almost lost everything. But his old friend Tom Tom, at this time, it had gone off on his own, and was touring in Europe and was like, why don't you come on toward me in Europe? You can open for me. Unknown Speaker I mean, did we tie five at the top? Yeah. Unknown Speaker But here's the thing. PT Barnum, Speaker 2 this whole his whole career was never a performer. He was always the guy running the show, you know, but not the performer. And so opening was like, What's PT Barnum gonna open for? So he opened as a speaker, speaking against alcohol. And so Speaker 1 thanks for coming tonight. I'd like to start this joyous evening of fun and drinking with a talk about how neither of those things are good for you. You should not drink where they serve and drinks it like theaters and stuff Unknown Speaker then I imagine I would assume Yeah. pour that out. Put that out. Dump your drink, dump your drink. Speaker 1 Don't drink or dump your soul. Yeah, he was what was known as yours. He was he was what was Speaker 2 known as a temperance speaker. And so the idea was alcohol is bad for you. You shouldn't drink it you should abstain he Speaker 1 was running a DARE program across the UK basically Speaker 3 opening for Tom. Everybody's everybody's going out to see Tom Tom perform the the 11 year old general he's still 11 So it's a big bait and switch. Yeah, that he comes out and he's like, he's like, Are you drinking tonight? Unknown Speaker Tonight? Well cut it out. You're Unknown Speaker all gonna die. Unknown Speaker As you can see in this presentation. He's like, not a good public speaker is really hurt. Tonight. I'm gonna give you sorry. I'm gonna give you three reasons that drinking is wrong. Not wrong. Unknown Speaker But like not good. Unknown Speaker Cue photos. Unknown Speaker Can you put the pictures up on the screen? Please? Yeah. Speaker 1 Not the one where I'm looking at my camera. But the camera Speaker 3 anyways, you might not know me. My name is PT Barnum. I'm gonna before we get into it, I gotta show you a picture of me and my family. This is me and this is my son. Speaker 1 Hey, guys, thanks for being here. We want to say thank you for being here. There's a card Have a seat back in front of you just fill that out. Let us know you were here. Speaker 2 Yeah, if you just fill that out with your credit card information, you can drop in the bucket when it comes by and we'll just take whatever we want. Unknown Speaker Nice. Unknown Speaker Legally, I'm supposed to say it that Unknown Speaker if you want to reach the summit Unknown Speaker he goes it does this tour. It Speaker 2 makes a good amount of money off of this tour, and he's able to reboot his career and gets into the circus. was a circus for 11 years. And then Tom Thumb who's still on tour in Europe is like, Hey, there's this guy, James Bailey super successful out here. Looks like he's planning on coming to the states, you should get ahead of that. Unknown Speaker Okay. And so he Unknown Speaker calls that's why he started doing the circus stuff. Speaker 2 Well, no, he had been doing the circus for 11 years at this point. Oh, so he calls up James Bailey. And he's like, don't come to my territory. He's like, you're my number one competitor. He's like, you're the target to my Walmart. You're the Pepsi demand Coca Cola. Unknown Speaker He said, I'm a Bailey. Yeah, he's Speaker 2 like, what if? Join sides? He said, he said, What if we what if we be Pepsi Cola? Anyway, that doesn't flow? Right? What about Walgett? What Speaker 1 if we merge? What if? What if? What if you come over here and I buy your circus and we call it x? Unknown Speaker I think it will sell really well. A lot. I don't know, man. I'm just kind of thinking through some stuff. Make sure this Speaker 3 New York City, a giant light up X, on top of a building facing the windows of your enemies. Speaker 1 Will people think it's a weird thing? Ah, you're thinking too far ahead, buddy. But if we just make it with gasoline, I like to think in the moment. And then let my youngsters tell me my mistake. Plan. Speaker 2 And so James Bailey and him, they partner up, Bailey comes over to the states and brings his his elephant named Jumbo. And they buy a train that they had for a long time. Pin like chartering train trips. Yeah, but Speaker 1 you can't get charter a train. Yeah, you can show up with Speaker 2 like, check bag and elephant. Like, the ticket person is good. I know you can't train. And yeah, so they bought a train. They're the first circus to ever own their own train. Speaker 1 Wow. And they were rolling the towns with a full train. Unknown Speaker And so in 1882, they went on their first tour, how Speaker 1 does somebody go ahead of them? I guess that's how people the circus is coming. Speaker 2 I think they would mail flyers or something. I don't know. I mean, he was great at advertising. However he did it people would always come in. That's what I'm saying. Like, why Unknown Speaker would they do that? Speaker 2 They were the first three ring circus, which I think most likely came out of a debate. Because what they have you ever been to a three ring circus? You know what that means? Yeah, I didn't. I don't think I knew what that mean. Like, I went to circuses as a kid. Like there's Speaker 1 a center ring, where all the cool stuff happens. Yeah, there's another one where like kind of stuff happens. And then there's another one where other but they they can because Oh, it's constant entertainment. Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah. So they're all going at once, basically. Yeah. And so I think that most likely came out of a debate where it was like these two circuses came together. And they were like, well, I want to perform now. And they're like, Well, if we all do it at the same time, everyone wins. Yeah, I think that's what happened. But it was their first three ring circus. They launched in 1882. And it ran until 2017. What is the longest running any form of entertainment? Speaker 1 ran until 2017. The other one that came to the shrine mosque Speaker 2 Barnum and Bailey's. I don't know if it was that or if it was the Ringling Bros. Ringling Brothers in like the post war era blew up and they okay for their money. And now I think Ringling Bros. Bring the Ringling Brothers wrinkling. Speaker 1 There's one in June I think is bigger. Now, there's a there's a company in Joplin that does circus circuses. Uh huh. Yeah. So I drive by their field all the time. And like their elephants are just out there. I'm not joking. Like, they're on the side of the interstate. And they got their big semis, and they're still doing it even though people it's like to me, like, how much longer do you think circuses could exist? And also, SeaWorld? How long do you think SeaWorld could exist? Because I think like, millennials aren't SeaWorld? Speaker 2 Yes. Here. Well, it's close. See? Well, it's gotta be close. It's so close to a close very close. Speaker 1 I mean, I would go weeks ago, just just to keep my life Unknown Speaker I don't think I've been to a circus since I was like, six. Unknown Speaker I would do a circus in. I mean, even before then, when I was a kid, I knew I was wrong. I was I was bad. Really? No, we went I think I went to I was like, in I don't know. Speaker 2 I don't know. I mean, I think it depends on the circus. Like if a circus is like doing like, elephants and like animals stuff. Like I think they're, they're on the target list. But I think if a circus is doing like, just acrobatics, yeah. Cuz those suffering do. Yeah, I think I think the acrobatic stuff could last. But I will say like, like, if I'm on the highway, and I see circus tents, like this part of me that's like, I should go to that real quick. Unknown Speaker I should go see real quick. Let me tell you, let Speaker 2 me tell you if I if I'm on the highway, and I see a circus tent on in the parking lot and independent center. Yeah. And as I'm driving by I see a guy walk out with a brick. I'm good. He sets the brick down. Unknown Speaker I can what's he doing? I can't find now I have to find out how to figure out how to make money off this year. What he's doing. He's opening a story loop. For real though, Speaker 3 like That's definitely what he was doing. Like, it's this question of just like, what's up with the break and then you go through the whole museum. And while you get Unknown Speaker through part of it, you got to pay like I still go. Brick Unknown Speaker brick, you go through the whole thing at the very end. Unknown Speaker He's there the gift shop. A copy of my book. The brick book book. No. What's the brick? is about my life. Oh, brick. Oh, yeah. Greg stands up Unknown Speaker and says the Pledge of Allegiance Speaker 1 to the flag of the United States of America for which it stands, one nation indivisible. Speaker 1 You get it. You got what I did there, right? Because that wasn't in the title of right time era, you guys as a good joke. Speaker 3 So the surgeon is what he's known for it but he didn't start doing it until he was in his 60s. Wow. Speaker 2 I mean, he made a lot of money. Throughout his career, like he, the circus was a huge success of his he was a huge success doing everything else before and he knew how the entertainment business worked. And so Speaker 1 I'm going to change my marketing to be Judy Lynn's marketing, which is just like, come see Jaron, he's a really good guy. Speaker 2 Before Barnum and Bailey's started, while he was getting his circus business off the ground, he got into being an author. And so he wrote a book called The Life of PT Barnum. Unknown Speaker We just didn't spit. Speaker 3 Yeah. It's pretty great. He literally literally did that. Unknown Speaker Yeah, but he did under a fake name. So it would be like a biography. No, Speaker 2 it was called by it was life of PT Barnum by himself. Okay. Unknown Speaker Everybody thought he meant it was written by him. But he was like he was by himself all the time. Unknown Speaker And that's the real story. Speaker 3 He few 10 years later, he wrote a book called The humbugs of the world, which was him just slandering mediums. Speaker 2 Because he had a real problem with them. And he actually in the book he offered, he was going to pay $5,000 to any medium who could prove they could actually talk to the debt. Maybe 5000. That was how the book ended. I sound like one of his friends died. He's like, I'm sick of these people sick of these mediums. Unknown Speaker And so then these mediums, there's a group of mediums Speaker 2 that actually they read that book, they read the offer, they found out that was $5,000 up for grabs, if they could prove that they could talk to the dead. So they got together. And one of them told one of the mediums a secret. And the other medium was in the other room, and he'll tell them, and they did the seance thing. And they proved it and so he had to pay them $5,000 That's it made it sorry. Unknown Speaker Obviously, he didn't know the secret. He would have had to tell someone a secret and then kill them. Unknown Speaker And that yeah, so anyway, so they got a few times Speaker 1 to figure it out. They killed a lot of people before they shoot. He has to figure this super Speaker 3 secret is the brick was nothing. Nothing to do with. It was just a break. It's all don't break. Unknown Speaker She was 82. Unknown Speaker And he was for what are you seeing right now? Unknown Speaker Well, I don't know. Your friends gonna tell me in a second. That's probably gonna get marked by the by the YouTube standards. The transcript says stab, stab, stab, actually three different times because I said it. Again, they said you can say stab 10 times. Speaker 3 Let's say thank you. If you stay, poke 11 times, say what's a better word? What's another? What's a synonym of? Unknown Speaker Of what? That's what I thought this conversation is over real hard. You hear Oh, wow. Speaker 3 Knowledge that was just waiting for it. I was just gonna post. Unknown Speaker It says 29 You're good. So Unknown Speaker he writes up. I'll take you through doesn't boast Unknown Speaker you should lose a tooth for the bid Speaker 3 so he he writes a couple dozen books most of all about like couple dozen. Yeah, most of them about how much he hates mediums or about politics or business, Speaker 1 you know, and that's what what happened if we didn't have social media all these people who leave like seven paragraph comments wouldn't think they're authors. Speaker 2 But then in 1880, right before the Barnum and Bailey Circus thing happened, he wrote what is probably my favorite book ever. I haven't read it I just by the title judging the book by its cover. This is my favorite book ever written. This is PT Barnum's the art of money getting Unknown Speaker which is so great. Unknown Speaker I want to read it. I want to read it really bad. Unknown Speaker I don't think this was the original. This was not Speaker 1 this is definitely what's available on Amazon now. Speaker 2 Because and I think that just because this font is very clearly this was made in in PowerPoint, this car. Yeah. But man, I want to read this book, The Art of money getting all about how he got his money. He is widely attributed with for being the person who coined the phrase, there's a sucker born every minute. Oh, I don't. Most people think that he didn't say that. And I think the reason for that is because I don't think the slang term sucker lasted that long. Right? Right, right. But he was pretty vocal towards the end of his life, about the fact that he said that he would say people, it's not that people have a problem with being lied to. They actually crave it they crave being lied to. And so he would create these ridiculous things so people could be lied to because they liked they liked it. They liked being lied to about this. Fiji Mermaid. They like being lied to about George Washington's nurse or Unknown Speaker liked believing things Speaker 2 like weird stuff. And so yeah, he believed he believed that people were entertained by being lied to. And I liked it. And he was he built a career off of doing that for people. Speaker 1 No, I was doing it for your good. So he really was gaslighting at the end wasn't. Hey, you lied to us. Yeah. And you liked it? Geez. No, no, you craved it. You actually I remember you wrote me a letter one time when you were a small boy. Like I was Santa Claus. I'm you said hello, Mr. Pretty Tom Barnum, will you please lie to me? You remember that he's Unknown Speaker lying. And he's like, Wait, you're Unknown Speaker doing it? Right now? You're alright. You know? Yeah, cuz that's what you wanted me to do. That's okay. Unknown Speaker And in at 91, Speaker 2 his health started to really decline. And he knew it. And so he asked the newspaper to write his eulogy, so he could read it. Before he died. He's like, he's like, I think I'm gonna die. So you write my eulogy. Before I put it out, I want to read it first. And at the age of 80, he ends up dying of a stroke. His last words, were him asking his assistant to get him the receipts from last night's circus because he wanted to see how much they spent. And then he died of a stroke. Give me the receipt. never never never stopped working into the last minute. The reason we know about the reason we have circuses, probably honestly, and a major part of of the 13th Amendment, even though he was kind of a problematic person, the majority of cool for Unknown Speaker talking like mergeable. Okay, Speaker 3 this is this is what happens at the end of the day. This is what happens at the end of the radio tour when you walk around the museum with your earbuds in and the person narrates everything for you. Speaker 2 At the very end of it, they get really close to them like to finish the story. Okay, while you read the plaques and try to listen at the same time. It is very difficult. Why don't you give me the ears and the Speaker 3 Why did you give me yours at the same time? Sure. Islands born Unknown Speaker blindfolded guard this museum Speaker 3 America's first blindfolded museum booster that Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So PT Barnum, legendary entertainer. Great author. Unknown Speaker Prolific, great author, lifted gaslighter. Speaker 3 And I do believe in show person. You believe in medium? Unknown Speaker Yeah, cuz so I did the thing with that. I was like, You know what? You didn't know. Yeah, well, I kinda I was like, I'm gonna prove it. So I did the whole whisper of a secret thing. Speaker 3 Whisper the medium. Yeah, that we killed. And I was like, Speaker 1 Why are you laughing? Why did you say why are you laughing? That person's not anymore. And so I was Unknown Speaker whispered a joke to me. All they talk to you is for the secret and then Secret you said was a funny joke. Fiddle off Speaker 4 things last night is a production of space Tim media produced by Christian Taylor audio is edited by Alex Garnett video by Connor Betts social media is run by Caleb Walker and graphic design by Caleb Goldberg. Our hosts are Jaron Meyers and Tim stone please follow us on social media at tellen podcast that's T IO in podcast. leave a review, comment, subscribe, wherever you are. Thank you for listening to things on our last night. Transcribed by

One name stands out in the colorful entertainment world like a shining star: PT Barnum. Known for his incredible showmanship, creativity, and relentless pursuit of the extraordinary, PT Barnum left an indelible mark on the entertainment world. Join us as we journey through the life and career of this remarkable showman, exploring his early life, his museum, his European music … Read More

John R Brinkley – “Doctor” of Goat Glands, Lies, and Radio


Episode Transcription

Made by robots, for robots. Only read if you're weird

Unknown Speaker Hey man, what's going on? Have you ever heard of John Romulus Brinkley? The second? Oh. Unknown Speaker I've heard of John Romita is Brinkley, but you're talking about his son. The second. Yes. John are both. Unknown Speaker Allegedly, because like, you don't just do the second. That's Jr. Yeah. Well, yeah, the presence of a second implies implies the presence of a third. Yeah. And also the presence of the first one. Unknown Speaker Maybe I'm gonna name my kid something. Unknown Speaker The second Yeah. Is it Patrick? mahomes. Like the third or whatever. Unknown Speaker I'm pretty sure it's the second, the second or the third. I think he's third. I think he's after mahomes A third. I think he's the second now I'm pretty sure he's the third. Cuz I'm pretty sure he's he's like a logo. His personal logo is pm three. Unknown Speaker Oh, you're right. And so there's a lot of pressure. You know, he has a son. No, he's the second. He's the second. Oh, they only have daughters. All right. Yeah, I think they only have one daughter. I don't know. I don't follow that closely. I'm pretty sure. Unknown Speaker There's a new Nother one. There's a new one. There's a new one. Anyway. Okay. So this is a Patrick mahomes Gossip podcast now. Unknown Speaker I'm airing my adult bully. And I don't know what happened. But as soon as we got married, she is something in her brain just went he's not gonna leave now. And she's got me. Be careful. Be careful. The Dude, it's Saturday night I'll set you up to but he's not a doctor. He is just full of ghosts. I'm just gonna take those feelings. And I'm going to show that's what I'm telling you, man. It's better that way. Unknown Speaker Things I Learned last night Unknown Speaker this is Unknown Speaker John are Brinkley. Oh, the second. This is him before he became Colonel Sanders. Yeah, here he is after he became Unknown Speaker is this is a digitally colorized photos a colorized photo of him I printed the hat they put in when they colorized it. I know. They were like we're tired of doing this. That I can't do his hair back Digital Color artists. Unknown Speaker Here's a picture of her pointing and yelling at somebody probably staged. Unknown Speaker It looks like a stage deal. Here's a picture of him holding someone's baby. It's not his I know that for a fact, because of the story. Don't read that. I know that. Unknown Speaker And here's a picture of all I can't read that. When you say don't read that I scribbled. Unknown Speaker And here's a picture of him, resting his hands on a bald man's head. Unknown Speaker Oh, I love this era of America, where people just took really weird pictures, like really serious, weird pictures. This is his business partner. This was his business. This was the photo of him and his business partner who's on their website to get those on their website. This was about us. What year is this? Like? 1920 or something like that? Okay, when this one was taken? Yeah. Unknown Speaker It's not that funny. But it's like, can we take this picture? You know, you're a person who looks at people planking on the internet and you're like, ah, like it was funny. Yep. Unknown Speaker Yeah, yeah, we can take this picture in a few years when you're bald. Yeah. Good call. Unknown Speaker Wait, do you think something about first? You 100% 100%? Not even a question. I don't like how confident you are in that. I don't know. Let's look through the footage Unknown Speaker from three years ago. Unknown Speaker And just compare it to now. Just every time I turn my head back a little bit. Unknown Speaker People have been pointing it out to him. No one's been pointing out just my wife. My wife knows someone coming out the other day. Unknown Speaker I think it's because we brought it up. Right. We brought this up before Shut up. Okay. He was born in July 8 1885. in Baden, North Carolina. Now he's Unknown Speaker John Brinkley senior. His father, the first John First John R. Brinkley. He was married five times. First. First marriage ended due to the fact that apparently North Carolina or North Carolina had rules for marriages. One of them being you had to be old enough to get married. And his first marriage he was too young to he was too young. Yeah, he was too young. So they were like in the one 1800s Yes, the state was like, not that marriage. What age was he? I can't find that information. I just know that he's Unknown Speaker like 12 Unknown Speaker and he's like an eight year old Unknown Speaker Oh, that's what I'm saying. You know, like it was already, maybe, maybe, okay, this first marriage got overturned by the government. Unknown Speaker But the rest of his marriages didn't all five of the same woman, Unknown Speaker oddly enough, is for marriages. He always married women who are significantly younger than him. And, Unknown Speaker yeah, first one, I just want to make sure I understand his first one gets overturned because he's too young to get married. And then I'm assuming the second one's not that long after. Unknown Speaker I don't I don't know how long after it was, but I do know he was an older man marrying younger women. So I assume based on the stories of the other wives that he waited a few years after his first his first marriage was a little hard one for him to swallow. It took him a year. Yeah, over that. Literally his childhood love. Yeah. Unknown Speaker You know, Unknown Speaker it was It wasn't even his high school sweetheart is a kindergarten sweetheart and the state took her from Unknown Speaker the state took her mind to Unknown Speaker I lost her to the state. That's like if you Unknown Speaker I lost her to the state. Unknown Speaker That sounds like some domestic issues going on. No, I like the idea that like Unknown Speaker No, please, please finish your sentence. It's not gonna get much. Okay, cool. I like the idea of intent warning. Unknown Speaker I like the idea that you go on your honeymoon. And like you go like somewhere exotic to like a national park and you're camping and then your spouse goes missing. And then you come back and what you say is I lost her to the state. As in like, whatever state you were in where you lost her. The state took cool from me. Yeah, me and my wife went looking for treasure. Unknown Speaker Suspicious mountains. Unknown Speaker So married a whole bunch. Okay. Unknown Speaker worse over time, or is he just married five women? They died? They are. They're always younger than him. They always die. You know that my grandpa's been married 13 times? No, when I told you that. No, my grandfather has been legally married 13 times. That's exhausting. Yeah, my grandma was number two. Unknown Speaker And then divorce. Most of them. And like the last three have passed away because he's old now. I mean, that's that, let's say last two passwords and how he said like if you've been divorced more than twice, then it's probably like, Unknown Speaker no, he never got it. He never was like, I'm the problem. He they sent me he sent me an invite to his last wedding. Unknown Speaker It was like in Florida. He's ever wanted to come down for it. Yes. It's great. Great Grandson was his best man. I wrote back and said I'll catch the next one. So Unknown Speaker have you seen that Larry, David bit were these like, he's like, Would you ask him if he would travel for wedding? He's like, I'm like Jimmy Kimmel. I think we've seen that. No, Jimmy Kimmel is like, Unknown Speaker what's the farthest you travel for a wedding? And he's like, he's like, I don't know. It's throwing out and it's like, the guy gave it to them destination wedding. And he's like, No, I'm not gonna go to that. And like, what if it's your like, daughter? And he's like, I'm not going to that he's? And he was like, he was like, he's like, No, if you if you're expecting me to fly, he's like, I'm not going. He's like, he's like, an hour and a half drive is the farthest I'll go for a wedding. Okay, that's a good point. That's a good point. Good point, you flew to mine. Unknown Speaker I was Unknown Speaker I don't think we want to have that fight on a podcast. Unknown Speaker I don't think that you're Unknown Speaker a safe person. Unknown Speaker For me to be vulnerable with. Unknown Speaker Okay, so Unknown Speaker I'm just going to take those feelings and I'm going to shuffle. That's what I'm telling you, man. It's better that way. Unknown Speaker All right, Morty Go ahead. So Unknown Speaker all four of his wives died died before him. And they were younger than him significantly older than him. His fifth era Well, I don't know people died in the 1800s Yeah, just like you get the gist of common cold and you're dead. Yeah. You look at the sun for too long and you die. Awesome. It wasn't anything better Unknown Speaker by looking at the sun all day, all right. Kills Unknown Speaker coincide against Unknown Speaker that sounds gonna kill you. So Unknown Speaker he died his what he loved. Unknown Speaker Looking at the sun Unknown Speaker is fit Unknown Speaker wife Sara had. John The second was kind of wild that waited until his fifth wife to name one of his kids after himself. Did he have other children? Yes. Oh. Unknown Speaker Ran out of name. It was like I just named this one. How many kids do you have? How many kids you have before you do? One named after you? You know? I'm not sure. I know. I know. He has at least one sibling because it's talked about him. Unknown Speaker But I don't know how many like it doesn't have a list of siblings and his thing to prove the oldest sibling to be like the favorite and be like, you know, this is Junior. Quite another Unknown Speaker for like, the fifth kid to be like an old junior and, or, or, or Yeah, the other one used to be Unknown Speaker the second the second? Unknown Speaker Because Unknown Speaker I like him better. Sit him at the table at the table. Hey, so your name is not John Brinkley the second anymore? He traded it. Yeah. He traded it for a bowl of soup. Unknown Speaker Now gonna go buy? Unknown Speaker Sawyer? Unknown Speaker I don't know. That's an old name. Right, Sawyer? Anyways, so Sarah had him out of wedlock, and then they got married because that's what you did in that time. Unknown Speaker And while John was a child, one of Sarah's nieces also named Sarah moved in with them. Unknown Speaker When she was like, in their early second. Unknown Speaker Well, they figured that'd be too confusing. So they started calling her Sally. So is that real? Yeah, they call her Aunt Sally, instead of me. So, Sally, you move in somewhere that like a year ago. Unknown Speaker We already have too many Tim's. Unknown Speaker Tim and aunt, Tommy. Unknown Speaker Sorry, on wherever you're from. I don't know. Unknown Speaker They put Sally and Sally lives in the house. Right. Okay. Sarah, his mother died of tuberculosis when he was five years old. Okay. And then his father John died when he was 10. So now as you're saying, Sally, now it's just him and Aunt Sally. Unknown Speaker So, Sally, and Sally moved into seventh place to go now she has a kid. Unknown Speaker And probably all the others to actually but those ones didn't do anything historically valuable. So we don't know about them. They're not any dollar bills. Unknown Speaker Well, me there's this guy. But he made a lot of them. It's he he went to school in like a log cabin school. Okay, they had classes like two or three months out of the year. Unknown Speaker Depending on how good the year was, you know, they gave him an extra month if it was good. Unknown Speaker Graduated at 16 Sure. and got a job as a town to town sales are not salesman, mailman. So he he didn't put the mail in a box. But he carried it between towns. Yeah. So you had a big bag of here's all the mail for the next town and he had carried over. Thank you for explaining how the mail works. Well, I want to I want to make sure that everyone understands that he was not putting anything in stock for this. You could send a letter you gotta imagine like in the back then. Yeah, the mailman has to be real annoyed. If you put one that's like, far away. Yeah. And then you just know like, he's not gonna take it. I'll take that in like three weeks. How long were they actually delivering letters to the North Pole before someone was like we should stop doing this. They still deliver. Okay? They take them to NORAD. They take them all the nor Unknown Speaker you waste our valuable tax dollars. Of course, forcing those people to read. Read the letter. Make sure it's nothing out loud. Make sure Tara's Unknown Speaker gonna watch these kids these days. Unknown Speaker And so while he was in that log cabin school, though, there was another girl going to school there named Sally. Not as hot. Unknown Speaker But she was a year younger than him and she bullied him his whole life. You want to get married though? You're younger than him. Unknown Speaker But let him his whole life. They were enemies, not friends. Sally did a lot of emotional damage on him as a child. Unknown Speaker Okay, anyways, grew up in the mail of how she bullied him. No, just You said she bullied them. Okay. Yeah. Unknown Speaker Well, eventually they are. But that's different. Unknown Speaker Became a mailman. Yeah. And while mailing. Unknown Speaker He got into telegraphing, they taught him how to do that. Okay. And so he got a job in New York as a telegraph operator, and then moved to Jersey while he was in Jersey telegraph and he gets a call Sally's Unknown Speaker Sick is Sally and Sally is sick. So he comes back and he gets back to beta. By the time it gets there she dies. On behold. Other Sally bullies Sally comforts him. Unknown Speaker They fall in love. They get married. She continues to blame Unknown Speaker because those first one that's the first five the one that they're too young to get married. No, no, no, this is the real John R Brinkley. Now this is a second. This is the second sorry. Yeah, so this is confused. His dad was the one who got married and all that stuff. Yeah. Unknown Speaker Hey, thanks for checking out this episode. If you like this one. Or if you don't like this one. There's so many other ones right? If you're halfway through this one, and you're like, I hate this I want to go check out the Richmond TV vigilante. It's an episode we did a while ago. It's a little bit of a shorter one. But one morning in Richmond, Virginia. He's people wake up with just TVs on their front porch. No idea where they came from until one person checked their ring doorbell footage and got a decent surprise so Richmond TV vigilante is a great episode. If you're gonna go check that out later. But for now, back to this one Unknown Speaker now this is JR to Jr. to Yeah, Mary's is childhood bully. Okay. Unknown Speaker Sally, and they moved to Chicago. I married my adult bully. I don't know what happened. But as soon as we got married she is something in her brain just went he's not gonna leave now. And she's got mean. You know, I heard jokes sometimes I go. Okay. Oh, too. Real? Yeah, she's like making fun of me. Yeah, well, you're easy to make fun of the other day. I was walking out my backpack. She grabbed both straps pull them as tight as she could. And she will walk out the door little turtle Unknown Speaker grown man Unknown Speaker my wife Unknown Speaker cried she's Unknown Speaker sad me. It was fun making it rain. Hail all over me. And you open up the door on that porch bandit was stealing your stuff for your turtle and I was like the Dirac here. I want a little turtle let us tell you that your belt and my neighbor's caught the whole thing on their ring doorbell they well. I hear them. I hear him. I hear. Unknown Speaker They turned the mic on whenever they watch. Yeah. Unknown Speaker I'll ring doorbells work. Unknown Speaker And my neighbors don't have a ring doorbell. There's a guy who sits out Unknown Speaker at like crack the doors like, hey, there's so Unknown Speaker much going on out here. There's a person at your front door, taking extensive notes Unknown Speaker during ski, watch that latest steal my stuff. But it's not his job to get paid enough to intervene. He just gets paid enough to draw so she really did that to me though. She's just so calm. She's just so uncomfortable. And she's a little too comfortable. Now. I go hey, maybe you should buy stuff feelings. Yeah, I'm a boy her back. Yeah, yeah, that's what I always did. To my bullies. Okay, return the ball. I'm gonna lower into Unknown Speaker a tunnel Unknown Speaker with my friends. You know? Unknown Speaker That wasn't bullying. Unknown Speaker That was Unknown Speaker scary. 30 years. So he marries Sallie Mae Sallie. They moved to Chicago and he starts going to medical school. Okay. But it was like one of those medical schools but it's like, is Does that count? You know, you know, every medical school in the 1800s Yeah. And so he's going to this middle school school. After three years though, when they were just like, I know like, here's a cold math. Here you go. Unknown Speaker Actually, yes. And so he he's gone to medical school he's doing the thing would also cure your your Unknown Speaker deviated septum. Yeah, you're right. Unknown Speaker So he is going to medical school. And after three years in medical school, he gets kicked out for not paying any of his tuition at that time. And they're like, we've let you do this for three years. Unknown Speaker Come on. And so he moves to Kansas City, finds another questionable medical school in Kansas City. started going to school there. Same thing happens that doesn't pay as Arthur Bryan's medical school. Unknown Speaker Before they got a barbecue, Dr. Brian subdivides medical school. Yeah. Then he got his license taken away. But he was like he was like you don't want it's pretty similar to the math that I've been telling people barbecue sauce. Unknown Speaker So you just put some brown food coloring in it. Put it on some? Some ribs, okay. Unknown Speaker No, yeah. So he gets kicked out of that medical school again. And he decides, wait a second. I don't need to actually go to the school. And so he calls up a diploma mill in Kansas City and gets a medical license and just pays for it and start practicing medicine. Unknown Speaker In Unknown Speaker sidebar, his dad did this. Not like the fate of his dad was a real doctor. But sure he benefited from the Civil War where like he didn't have to actually get a license. He just got a war license, you know. And then he coasted off that the rest of his life Sure. But he wasn't doing well because he was in a small town where like, there just wasn't like, he wasn't like a rich doctor. He was like a man. If you're in a small town, you gotta go make people sick. Yeah, you know, his wife, his wife. Unknown Speaker Yeah. Oh, yeah, dude, that's annoying. He was creating all of your lifestyle and you're a doctor. And it's like, you got to live with that. And like, yeah, that's why you weren't getting good business Exactly. Like a doctor. Unknown Speaker He could even save his wife. Unknown Speaker That's just bad. PR. It's bad doctoring. Unknown Speaker That doctor. You go to a barber, and they all got bad haircuts. Yeah, you're like, you never want to go to the barber who has a good haircut. Why? Because he's not the one who did it. Unknown Speaker Someone else in that shop did so you want to go to the one that has the worst hair? Cut their own hair? Unknown Speaker Have you ever tried that? Want to go to the one with the worst haircut? No to cut your own hair? Yeah, it's hard. It's really hard anyways. So he gets a plumber gets a fake license, start practicing medicine can study and it goes decent for him. Like, decent, right? During the day in Kansas City. Do we know? I don't know, somewhere in Kansas. Unknown Speaker Does decent, but starts to have some weird rumors pop up about what yours is now. Like 1910s, something like that. Sharks have some rumors pop up about them, trying to face them some trouble ends up in St. Louis, where he met meets that bald guy. Unknown Speaker Yeah, this guy. And they got into medicine, a unique kind of medicine, which was the line. And so what they did is they they started selling German electric juice. Unknown Speaker And it was a German electric juice. Yeah. And so it was a cure all pretty much like it could do whatever you whatever is wrong with you drink our German electric juice. And they were selling it and everyone was really excited about it. And it did pretty well until they got caught because it was just water with food coloring in it. Unknown Speaker And really, yeah, it was literally just water with food coloring. And how do they get caught? Someone came to their little shop and coughing and they're just like with the hose. And just Unknown Speaker it's like, this is how electric juice is. In Germany. This is the real deal. Yeah, yeah. So they started facing like legal issues and Unknown Speaker you take as much as you want before it's packaged. Unknown Speaker started facing some some legal issues in St. Louis. And so he skipped down to a small town in Kansas, where his life really begins. Unknown Speaker And why is in Kansas, he opens up with a bald guy. Now the ball got he ditched the ball guy. And the old guys lose the ball guy got in trouble. The ball guy did face the music. The Yeah, he took the fall. Okay, yeah. And anyways, Unknown Speaker loose Kansas starts practicing medicine in Kansas. And this is where the meat of his adventure begins. Unknown Speaker Why is that? And his wife Sally is bullying him all along the way. Right? She's coming with him. Yeah, so she's blowing him all along the way. She actually leaves them a few times. And while he was in Spain facing legal trouble in St. Louis, she leaves him for good. Oh, yeah. And so that's a good point. She leaves him for good. And he meets another woman named Unknown Speaker Myrna or something like that. Unknown Speaker Okay, I don't remember exactly what her name is. Unknown Speaker And they ended up getting married. But he was our mini Minerva, to Linda Jones calls her Mini Unknown Speaker and Sally finds out and they never actually got divorced. A Sally comes in. She gets really mad and pulleys him some more. Unknown Speaker And then he gets back with Sally. No, no, their relationship ended. They got formally divorced. Unknown Speaker Well, she's like we never formally divorce. You can't see anybody. You can see what Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. Unknown Speaker Anyways, the only reason I brought up Sally is because the pulling thing I thought was funny that he married his boy. Unknown Speaker Okay. Unknown Speaker He's in Kansas. And he's he opens up his practice. Sure, one day while he's in his practice. Unknown Speaker A guy comes in and he's been practicing medicine for a little bit. He's been taking pictures like this of him doing surgeries. Unknown Speaker Okay. Unknown Speaker It's and a guy comes in, and his small town in Kansas. Unknown Speaker Milford, Milford, Kansas has been buried by Lake now a reservoir. The town doesn't exist anymore. Oh, interesting. Because of what he did. They said we should just flood the whole town. Sure. No, so a guy comes in and says Unknown Speaker Hey, Unknown Speaker I've got a medical issue. Can you help me out doc? Unknown Speaker And he's like, Well, what what's your problem? Unknown Speaker He said, he's struggling with impotence. And he's trying to have a baby for a long time and it can't. Unknown Speaker And real professional. Unknown Speaker Actually, I actually put the exact quote there in Kansas, right? So like, there is sure like, I mean, Unknown Speaker Kansas is a land where there's a lot of animals just about, Unknown Speaker like farm animals, there's a lot of farm animals about because there's a lot of farms. Okay? Real professional, you need to get to the quote quicker, you are now real professional. He says, Well, Unknown Speaker points out the window to a goat, and says a pair of those goat glands in you would probably take care of your problem. Unknown Speaker And, okay, and the guy says, Unknown Speaker I think you got something there. Unknown Speaker And so, he agrees to try out an experimental surgery from this not a doctor, but like, Yeah, as far as he knows, is the doctor to surgically implant the goats testicles in him to try to cure his impotence. Unknown Speaker Okay, no, like no reason. So he's just in his met his doctor's office, and he is looking out the window where he goes. Unknown Speaker Like, he's like, he loves looking around the room for like, oh, how can I help this guy? How can I help? Unknown Speaker That's an idea. Unknown Speaker Yeah, yeah. And so he tries it. But here's the thing. Remember, he's not a doctor. And so he doesn't know how he doesn't know any of that works. He works. So Unknown Speaker he doesn't hook them up. Like he just puts them in them. Unknown Speaker Does the surgery I don't understand what you mean. Unknown Speaker Like these are just loosely stuck inside this dude's body. These Goodway calm glands. That's what they call them and all the documentation anyway. Sure. So just loosely, Shazam inside this dude. And Unknown Speaker miraculously, the guy has a baby Unknown Speaker at the end so Unknown Speaker needless to say, suddenly needless to say they named the child Billy Unknown Speaker and that's a true story. That's not a joke. They really made the bill Unknown Speaker and he becomes a giant deal. Brinkley he gets in the news. And that's that's the baby this is Billy This is the goat baby part go and this is this is the article of Brinkley uses goat glands to cure sterility. Okay, which this is an article from the Kansas City Star Unknown Speaker first goat gland baby yeah, it becomes huge news. Here's another article Unknown Speaker Wait, is this like an anti this like? This is a he's the devil kind of thing. No, this is praising him. Oh, really? Because it looks Unknown Speaker aggressive. It does. The article took a goat says preaches fundamentalism practices go clan science. Unknown Speaker And the that headline is the goat horns in a drawing of yeah, that's all I'm saying is like that seems like some demonic, like injury there does. But it's very Yeah. This becomes a giant deal. And we'll forum wide are like, Oh, you mean like there's a cure. And so people start traveling to see him to get some goat glands. Okay. And he's charging $500 a procedure which translated for inflation is 10 grand. Yeah, to get go glands inserted into people. And he realizes Wait a second, like this is this is a cash cow a cash coat, if you will. Unknown Speaker He says he starts coming out and you gotta give a goat milk though. Unknown Speaker So that's my recommendation. You know, you got to feed the child with goat milk. He starts to say oh, wait a second. It's not just sterility. Like it's that's not the only problem this is a Unknown Speaker panacea any any issue you got. Go clans will cure it. And so see, always shoot for the moon too much too much. You can try to solve one problem. You made a lot of money. Yeah. Well, you didn't make a lot of money because everyone was like, I got to forgive those as well. That helped me and he's like, Yeah, you got to put it up on your ribs and Unknown Speaker So he was just implanting these in random parts of different people's bodies, because they had different diseases. And it was literally I mean, it was essentially he was implanting a tumor into people's bodies because he was like, Yeah, it'll heal you. And Unknown Speaker it was working really well for it was making a lot of money men and women lining up to get these glands inserted in them because they believed that this was this was bad. It kind of was like it would heal you of pretty much anything. Yeah. And so he's got lines out the door. I've got anxiety, you know, would help with that. Unknown Speaker It's like looking out the window. Well, you know what animal house with that? Unknown Speaker You come into the doctor's office. It's like It's like Dr. Doolittle. And like all the animals. Unknown Speaker Is it like dogs? Is he talked with his goats? Unknown Speaker I don't know what it's about. You could have chosen Unknown Speaker that Evan Almighty was surrounded by animals and you went it's like Dr. Dulo, who's having conversations with the goats a goat crazy idea. Unknown Speaker As he is he grown his own goats that I guess he's he's coming from, okay, I don't know where the goats are coming from. Unknown Speaker Thanks for checking out our show. If you like it, and you want to support be a part of what we're doing here, you can do that by becoming a patron. What happens there is you get to be in the community, we have a discord with our hosted producers, we have a lot of fun. We're super active in there every day, you get access to add free content a week before everybody else. And we have a zoom every month with our patrons that we hang out, we eat pizza, we get to know you a little bit better. It's a blast. And there's a ton of other different benefits like merch discounts, birthday messages, things like that, that are super cool. If you want to be in that you can just text Dylan 266866. And that'll get you right in there. If not, we're just super glad that you're here. And thanks for watching our show. Unknown Speaker But he's making a lot of money gets very wealthy. And so he makes the logical next step. He builds a radio tower. And he gets into broadcast to advertise. Yeah. And so he is actually a pioneer in advertising gland FM. Unknown Speaker He becomes a pioneer in advertising Unknown Speaker He becomes a pioneer in advertising because he was one of the first people in radio to broadcast but to run ads. And so he would run ads for his go glands and his broadcasts. And he did an early version of like an Ask Me Anything, where people could write in their medical questions, and he would broadcast the answers to them. But he remember it's not. He's like, you gotta you gotta go out on your property. Unknown Speaker Well, I need you to do is I need you to every answer somehow just incision right below your elbow. You can do it. I can do it. You can do it. Unknown Speaker You don't have to do anything with it. Just shove it in there and then duct tape yourself back up. Yeah, you'll be healed. Duct tape. Unknown Speaker So $2,000 changes your life, you've got other problems. Unknown Speaker So he's doing broadcast radio advertising for the goathland stuff, right? And that really starts to take it to a whole new level people are traveling from way further, because they're hearing about this on the radio broadcast. Unknown Speaker And lo and behold, Unknown Speaker a significant person hears this broadcast, and comes to town to find out what's going on. And this is a guy by the name of Unknown Speaker Morris fish being and Morris fish been. It's been fish. Unknown Speaker Fish been Unknown Speaker jarred your fish beads or Unknown Speaker a turtle boy. Unknown Speaker Beads are out called Fish toes. Unknown Speaker Fish being worked for the American Medical Association. Oh, and he heard about this. And he was like, that sounds made up. And so he came to observe one of these surgeries sure to see what was going on. And so he interviewed. He interviewed Brinkley, and he asked Brinkley like okay, can you tell me more about this procedure? And like I said, What? Gauguin's Unknown Speaker What is this decencies How can we replicate this? So medical institutions across the country can start to implement this, this thing? And he said, he said, I'm the only one I can do it. No one else can do it. I'm the only one who's who's able to do this, this procedure. And the vision means like, Okay, can I watch? And he's like, Sure. And so he lets him come in and watch the procedure and he sees it. And fish being is like, fish being realizes immediately. Unknown Speaker Hey, this guy is dropping. Yeah. Unknown Speaker I mean, nothing's actually happening. Well, he's just shoving the them in there. Like there's no actual, like medical reason why they should do anything. In fact, it actually probably causes a lot more harm than good because you have a foreign body just shoved into your body. And so he goes back to the American Medical Association and writes a paper produces it for their publication, being like, okay, yeah, this guy is someone that no one should ever seek medical attention from. And its license needs to be called into question. And so the American Medical Association starts to come after him. Unknown Speaker But doesn't actually like pull the trigger on anything. They're just publicizing things within their medical journals about the fact that the goat gland procedure is fake, and that Brinkley's doesn't have any central ATM. Essentially, the problem is the American Medical Association's journals were Unknown Speaker read by doctors. Yeah, it's all public. Yeah, all the doctors were like, oh, yeah, that guy's a fraud. But the public was hearing this guy on the radio, yeah, talking with authority, and they will continue to travel to get these procedures done on them. And so he Unknown Speaker fish being kind of launches this, this smear campaign, but the only place he can get published is in the medical journals. Okay. And so he's not Unknown Speaker being hurt. Yeah. It's not having an effect on the the success tree, if you will, yeah. And so his radio broadcasts just continues to get bigger and bigger and bigger. Unknown Speaker And finally, the state of Kansas, learns from the American Medical Association about his radio show where he's giving medical advice. And so the state of Kansas starts to the medical board in the state of Kansas starts to go through some legislation to regulate radio broadcasts, to not allow you to give medical advice over the air. Because they're like, that's probably not Yeah, not good, smart. And so they pass this legislation, and he gets his broadcast shut down. And he's not allowed to broadcast at all anymore in this crisis. And so he does what any logical person does moves, he runs for governor Unknown Speaker and says, I will run for governor and replace the entire medical board and change the law so I can have my radio station back. Unknown Speaker Okay. So he, he, he runs for governor and his his, his campaign was interesting, positively will reduce taxes and state expense. Yeah, so his, his campaign was interesting. He promised to reduce taxes, and open up more lakes than any other government. Any other governor in the history of Kansas, he was going to open a bunch of lakes, which is a crazy promise to make coupled with each other to lower taxes and open a bunch of legs. I don't know if like legs or legs are free, overall, but I'm so many legs. But his campaign was going really well. Because he was actually like, a pretty popular person in the state of Kansas for his surgery. And for his radio shows. And for the fact that during the campaign, most of the rallies were like, I mean, Kansas in the 18, or the 1930s. And so it's like, the rallies are happening, their campaign rallies are happening in fields somewhere. And so in he's a rich guy at this point. And so he was flying into all of his rent rallies and landing at the rally. And everyone was like, oh, I want that guy. I want that guy's cool. Unknown Speaker Got it? Okay. It's good to know that this. Unknown Speaker Cool. Unknown Speaker And his campaigns go really? Okay. We'll see you. Unknown Speaker Soon what you want to say I don't want to say Unknown Speaker it's escaping. It's going really, really well. Sure. He's got really good odds. He's, he's winning in the polls. And the state of Kansas sees this. And they go, like, we can't let this guy win. There's no way we're letting this guy become the governor. So they hurriedly pass a law where if you're a write in vote, because that was an important part of that his campaign, he launched his campaign just a little bit too late to be on the ballot. He had to be a write in. But he was still doing so well in the polls that they thought he's gonna get wrote in and actually when the governor so they pass the law that for writing votes, you have to print the name exactly as they tell you, you have to print the name. And so they wrote like you have the right John are Brinkley Sure. A lot of people just put John Brinkley so those folks got thrown out. Yeah. And so he ended up losing the governor. Race, but if it weren't for that, most people think he would have actually won because that law that got changed. Last second, a little sketchy. A little sketchy. Yeah. And so he lost that race. He tried again the next race and didn't get it. And so now it's been a few years and his business is struggling because his his lack of a radio station. Yeah. So he made the decision Unknown Speaker to move to Del Rio Texas. Yeah. Because Del Rio, Texas, significantly Unknown Speaker thing about Unknown Speaker where that city is located is it's right along with the Texas Mexico border. And there was an interesting thing that was happening between the United States and Canada and Mexico at the time. And that was Unknown Speaker the United States and Canada just got together and passed this legislation about long distance broadcasting. Okay, split up who has the rights, and the United States and Canada were like, we get all of the rights. And Mexico was like, We want some, and they're like, no, no, you don't. And Mexico was really mad about it. And so Mexico was just like, I whatever, fine. We're gonna give a bunch of people long distance radio rights, like I know, we're not supposed to, but we're doing it anyways. Because you guys were rude to us. And that thing that we did about it, like we got together, we said, we're going to do this and then you guys bullied me. And so we're doing our thing. And so and also, we're gonna get married. Unknown Speaker We're gonna get married in a few years, but we'll come back to it. That's an unhealthy complex I developed in childhood where I have a feeling for people who make fun of me and I really want to really need to earn your I want to chase you. So he moves to Del Rio, Texas for the Express reason that he knows why he doesn't have long. Yes, he doesn't have broadcast rights in the in the United States anymore. He got banned for the stuff that he was doing. He's like, I can get it in Texas, and are in a school in Mexico right across the border live in Texas. And so he opens up this radio station in, right on literally right on the other side of the border. Yeah, like you can see it from the fence. I don't know if there's a fence yet. Unknown Speaker Which you could see it from the Great Wall. Unknown Speaker And they the amount of Unknown Speaker like the offer that the country of Mexico gave to this guy's absurd. They gave him a 500,000 watt radio station, it was a two, there's two radio towers that are connected by this radio array. It is the most powerful, privately held radio station to ever exist. What broadcast range of this went to Canada, like well into Canada from the border, and so he could broadcast to basically the whole country. Unknown Speaker From right on the other side of the border, because this was such a massive radio array. And they still did it basically to be like, Screw you. Yeah. And because it was in Mexico, Mexico don't have any legislation yet. He could now broadcast whatever he wants. Sure. And so now, the entire US and Canada hearing about plans and Mexico is hearing about as grants. He's doing the same broadcasts he was doing in Mexico. They got goats. Yeah, they got all kinds of goats in Mexico. And so he's he continues doing his Koechlin surgery now in Del Rio moves into a hotel. Unknown Speaker going it's going pretty well moves into a hotel and Unknown Speaker rents out a couple of rooms in the hotel as his practice. Unknown Speaker Okay, which if you're seeking if you're going Unknown Speaker to show to Unknown Speaker Hampton in Unknown Speaker like, yeah, I'll see you in room 478 Oh, sorry. Don't go 678 Is someone from I don't know. Albuquerque. That's a family vacation. Unknown Speaker They're not going to help you. They will. They won't. But be careful. Be careful. The dude on Saturday night. I'll tell you up too, but he's not a doctor. He is just full of goats. That's where he keeps all the goats. It's like overflowing he's gonna push the door shut. Yeah. Unknown Speaker And then housekeepers are that's sheep. Goats bad two. Oh, they don't just they do know that they scream they don't buy they do bad. Oh, no. They go Unknown Speaker it's not Unknown Speaker different sounds. No, it's not play it back on her. He was going back and they go ah, goats make a bot sound similar to the sound of sheep make. However, goat vocalizations are closer to what's called a bleat. Which is a sound also sometimes made by cows and deer lower interesting Unknown Speaker so he he's he's running out of this hotel and it goes well he ends up buying the hotel and turning the whole hotel into his practice and he puts a neat little sign on it and calls it the brink the hospital in Del Rio, Texas No it's not. Unknown Speaker And now he's got an empire he's got her his his radio station is doing super well like he's he's actually broadcasting country music stars on this radio now that are getting their start on it. Sure. And he's got his his hospital that's crashing as well. Unknown Speaker The radio station thing becomes such a big deal a bunch of other competitors start opening up radio stations along the border and it becomes this thing known as border blasting. Which sounds different but it's it's just running a radio station on the border. Unknown Speaker Oh, Unknown Speaker It becomes a huge success from sportscasting success from border blasting and is raking in the dough manages in Del Rio, Texas to open up or to build. Unknown Speaker Wow giant home, which is now our good picture is he's got Dr. Brinkley on his gate. Yeah. Unknown Speaker Sounds still exist. Yeah, it's on the National Register of Historic Places. Oh, wow. So a, you know, it sucks what is like now that's like not a mansion Unknown Speaker you know? Yeah. And now that's that's I mean that's still cost you that's a how $7 billion? No Unknown Speaker it'll still probably cost three does the does the gate still say Dr. Brinkley? I don't think so. I don't think the gates there anymore. Which seems I bet yeah, it's on the National Register of Historic Places. He continued running his Unknown Speaker his radio station and his his How long is he doing this? I mean, this is into the 50s. Now, he's been doing this for 20 years now. Yeah, he's been doing it for decades are dying because of the Go clans? So yeah, so there's about 32 people that you can say their death was tied to the goat glands. It's Unknown Speaker there's a few you can say for sure. They got an infection from the grantee and that killed them. Okay. handful more where it's like, They that could have been the glands that killed him. It could have been stung. That just coincidentally happened at the same time. Okay, most of it was they got infection, so they died. Unknown Speaker And so yeah, it's becoming a serious thing. Fish being is still on his tail. There's been this whole time has been releasing articles in the American Medical Association journals, trying to slander his name, but he doesn't have like a lot of power. He's trying to do everything he can to take this guy down. But this guy's just too rich. He's got too much too much on him. Okay, so fish bean Unknown Speaker enters into a lawsuit against him. Unknown Speaker Basically being like you're operating under Unknown Speaker a fake diploma, and you're doing stuff that's actually killing people, like you should not be Unknown Speaker a doctor, you can't call yourself a doctor. And so he tries he tries to countersue him for defamation, okay, and Unknown Speaker dramatically loses this, this lawsuit Unknown Speaker ends up hitting getting hit in the 50s with a $3 million Unknown Speaker settlement that he has to pay which bankrupt him lose asset sales. Right. So he has to sell because he countersued Yeah, because he tried to do that countersuit. Unknown Speaker And so he ends up having to sell the hotel is his radio station, his home, Unknown Speaker loses everything in that suit, and is no longer able to practice medicine. Unknown Speaker And so without access to his ability to do medicine, and without access to his radio station, he's pretty much lost his ability to make it Yeah. And so that was kind of the end of the story for him. He ended up suffering three or three heart attacks and got some I can't be Davis. Unknown Speaker Okay. Unknown Speaker three heart attacks and got his leg amputated. Yeah, it just feels so unrelated. Like, okay, the leg amputation. Unknown Speaker Pretty Pretty. Go leg on there. Give me Unknown Speaker like one knee goes forward and one knee goes back. But there's so much shorter so it only goes down just Unknown Speaker like it's got this weird diagonals Unknown Speaker Yeah, when he walks it's really weird. Circles. Unknown Speaker It's like I tried to tell him I tried to tell him to just put a goat gland in there, but they put the whole leg Unknown Speaker I went under and I woke up like this. Me a tall one. Pick up the shortest one and what are they called? The kids the pack? Pack? I don't know. Unknown Speaker So yeah, so he was taught. I don't know what to tell Sally about this, please. Unknown Speaker She'll make fun of me so much for this facer? Oh, they'll go boy Unknown Speaker I hate it but I also like it. Oh, I have more than external problems. Unknown Speaker So he, he ended up getting buried in Tennessee for some reason. Memphis, Tennessee. I don't know how that happened. Yeah, he was, uh, probably near Elvis. So he got buried there and he had this like monument with a Angel at the top of it. And in 2017 Someone stole the angel. So now it's a monument Unknown Speaker really tall monument with just the angels foot at the top of it. So Unknown Speaker that's the story. funnier if they left the whole leg Unknown Speaker as it started John Brinkley, a man who managed to scam a bunch of people with a fake that how long after the last day die? Um, I think how long did he live poor at the end? See? Unknown Speaker Like four or five years? Not very long. Unknown Speaker And so yeah, I don't know three years. Unknown Speaker So yeah, so II, he survived off of a fake medical license for decades with a fake medical license was a pioneer in broadcast radio and advertising started border blasting which was a huge deal through the 30s and 40s Unknown Speaker and had a political career of sorts. So Unknown Speaker and it's all thanks to the Koch glands. Unknown Speaker Wow. That's John Brinkley, and his dad was married five times. That was a detail that was the story wasn't it? Unknown Speaker I just wanted to get the fact that there's so many Sally's in his lives. Unknown Speaker More Saudis than makes sense. That's the reason that Sally shut up Unknown Speaker I'm joking Unknown Speaker What are you doing Unknown Speaker now their nannies Yeah. Yeah, their nannies as close as it's close. Anyways, cuddle them off Unknown Speaker things on last night is a production of space Tim media produced by Christian Taylor audio is edited by Alex Garnett video by Connor Betts social media is run by Caleb Walker and graphic design by Caleb Goldberg. Our hosts are Jaron Meyers and Tim stone please follow us on social media at tellen podcast that's ti LL IN podcast leave a review, comment, subscribe, wherever you are. Thank you for listening to things on the last night Transcribed by

John R. Brinkley was an extraordinary man known for his peculiar medical procedures, controversial political career, and groundbreaking contributions to radio and advertising. Born in 1885 in North Carolina, Brinkley’s life was filled with twists and turns that left an indelible mark on history. Early Life and Shady Beginnings Brinkley’s upbringing was far from ordinary. Raised in a modest household, … Read More